Over 130km/h on the Ventoux, is it possible?
Comments
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Here's some physics for you Mfin.
http://www.vavaveteran.co.uk/downhill-physics/
If Cav was doing 80 then the bigger guys like Cancellara etc would be going faster as a rule - and they don't go that fast.
Here's some physics? You mean here's a guy writing about trying to look at the physics involved but openly not understanding it, trying to simplify it but sprinkling it with a few assumptions and eventually giving up with a smile.0 -
Here's some physics for you Mfin.
http://www.vavaveteran.co.uk/downhill-physics/
If Cav was doing 80 then the bigger guys like Cancellara etc would be going faster as a rule - and they don't go that fast.
Here's some physics? You mean here's a guy writing about trying to look at the physics involved but openly not understanding it, trying to simplify it but sprinkling it with a few assumptions and eventually giving up with a smile.
that may be so, but broadly it's correct which is that all things being equal a heavier cyclist will be faster, due to force of gravity being proportional to mass, while the frontal area not increasing at the same rate.
But clearly there are other factors as well, cornering a bike at speed if you've ever done a charity/sportive is not something every one can or will do, and so on.0 -
Here's some physics for you Mfin.
http://www.vavaveteran.co.uk/downhill-physics/
If Cav was doing 80 then the bigger guys like Cancellara etc would be going faster as a rule - and they don't go that fast.
Here's some physics? You mean here's a guy writing about trying to look at the physics involved but openly not understanding it, trying to simplify it but sprinkling it with a few assumptions and eventually giving up with a smile.
that may be so, but broadly it's correct which is that all things being equal a heavier cyclist will be faster, due to force of gravity being proportional to mass, while the frontal area not increasing at the same rate.
But clearly there are other factors as well, cornering a bike at speed if you've ever done a charity/sportive is not something every one can or will do, and tailwinds, tyre pressures, road surfaces, brake pads, sheep, ambient temperature, draughting, tyres, wheels, bike aerodynamics, helmets, flappity crudcatcher shorts, humidity, rainfall, hairy legs, non-hairy legs...
Fixed that a little for you.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
Here's some physics for you Mfin.
http://www.vavaveteran.co.uk/downhill-physics/
If Cav was doing 80 then the bigger guys like Cancellara etc would be going faster as a rule - and they don't go that fast.
Here's some physics? You mean here's a guy writing about trying to look at the physics involved but openly not understanding it, trying to simplify it but sprinkling it with a few assumptions and eventually giving up with a smile.
You get the gist - Cav won't be the heaviest or the fastest in the bunch downhill. Lately he's not even been the fastest in the sprint ! Maybe next year though.0 -
Here's some physics for you Mfin.
http://www.vavaveteran.co.uk/downhill-physics/
If Cav was doing 80 then the bigger guys like Cancellara etc would be going faster as a rule - and they don't go that fast.
Here's some physics? You mean here's a guy writing about trying to look at the physics involved but openly not understanding it, trying to simplify it but sprinkling it with a few assumptions and eventually giving up with a smile.
You get the gist - Cav won't be the heaviest or the fastest in the bunch downhill. Lately he's not even been the fastest in the sprint ! Maybe next year though.
So, based on that you're saying Cav loses time going downhill. I think you'll find that's not the norm. Skill, technique, position on the bike, holding wheels and a stack of other things come into it, it's never a rolling down a slope inanimate object thing. Like I say, I can't remember any race where on descents all the bigger heavier guys gain time on the all the smaller lighter guys, it is just not a trend that happens at all.0 -
The point is that Cav hasn't hit that speed. It's a gps blip. He's not the fastest pro downhill. Hilly stages aren't really his forte.
Go out and ride with a chubbier cyclist and you'll see that they do descend faster - everything else being equal.0 -
The point is that Cav hasn't hit that speed. It's a gps blip. He's not the fastest pro downhill. Hilly stages aren't really his forte.
Go out and ride with a chubbier cyclist and you'll see that they do descend faster - everything else being equal.
I have the perfect balance of being small at 5'6" but also overweight at 13st, so I go downhill quite quickly
. The same means my hill climbing sucks 0 -
I'm with Mfin on this.
Mountain descents have corners, and different riders have better riding positions, reducing drag. weight is only one of many factors that affect how fast a rider will descend. You only need to watch a mountain descent on a bike race to understand that, or do a hilly or mountainous sportive.0 -
I'm with Mfin on this.
Mountain descents have corners, and different riders have better riding positions, reducing drag. weight is only one of many factors that affect how fast a rider will descend. You only need to watch a mountain descent on a bike race to understand that, or do a hilly or mountainous sportive.
hence the "all things being equal" part, yes clearly you can loose/gain quite a lot though the Corners and so on.
But weight has a noticeable impact.0 -
"All things being equal" translates to "under conditions which virtually never arise in real life", because when is everything else except weight ever equal? It's vastly more likely that someone outdistancing you down a hill is doing so because they're taking corners faster thanks to better line selection and general technique, not because they're heavier. Weight has some small impact, yes, but I don't think it's ever likely to be the crucial factor when you consider how much time you can lose by taking a bad line through a couple of corners. You'd always expect a good lightweight descender to outdistance a bad heavyweight because the extra gravity assist just isn't going to compensate for unnecessary braking and so on.I'm with Mfin on this.
Mountain descents have corners, and different riders have better riding positions, reducing drag. weight is only one of many factors that affect how fast a rider will descend. You only need to watch a mountain descent on a bike race to understand that, or do a hilly or mountainous sportive.
hence the "all things being equal" part, yes clearly you can loose/gain quite a lot though the Corners and so on.
But weight has a noticeable impact.
My brother weighs more than me and is a much faster descender, but I know this has nothing to do with weight because he used to weigh much less (I've lost weight, he's gained it) and back then he still got down hills much quicker than I did. He's simply better at cornering than I am.0 -
I think some of this is "when me and my mates roll over the crest of a certain hill we know well and all start to roll down the other side without putting in any effort, some seem to start to roll down a little quicker". Of course this kind of thing is of no interest because it's not really descending. If you want to be quicker than mates of this type then actually put power out when descending, learn how to get more aero when you need to, pick good lines, develop great cornering and late braking technique, develop getting power out at high cadences, push the boundaries of grip in all conditions etc. You'll be hundreds of metres ahead of a bunch of lazy rolling fatties who are having themselves a nice well earned break from pedalling up to the descent in no time whatsoever.0
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I'm no scientist, but is there a point at which having a smaller, more aero frontal profile outweight the effects of added weight?
I'm sort of relating to how Cav's smaller more aero frontal profile compensates for him putting out less power than the likes of Kittel and Greipel where the power on a descent is coming from gravity.0 -
Vicenzo Nibali, Contador and S Sanchez are testament to the fact that weight isn't the most important factor. As a lightweight, I can go like the clappers over a hill and my heavier mates just cruise and keep up though.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0
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The wind blasts through the various "combes" or wide gullies on the top part of the south side; get that right and you can end up having a 70kph tailwind on wide smooth tarmac on -9%.0
