In Hospital 3rd world country after bike crash - hoping for
zenrodes
Posts: 9
Hit my head hard (shattered helmet) so my memory is vague 5 minutes leading up to and 30 minutes after. Remember it was nearly dark and gliding at about 40 mph around a white SUV. Next memory is being on a gravel offshoot road and quickly steering the bike back to the main cement road and dropping into a cement drainage ditch.
25 min ambulance ride to the emergency room, xrays, surgery where tube inserted into lung, and tried to confirm no major head injuries. Another 50 min ride to the nearest hospital with a CT scan. My condition worsened mostly the result of the internal bleeding. My x-rays were whiteouts (white blobs- no details).
Friends of mine from Chiang Mai(n. Thailand) got involved. I was breaking down, alone and don't speak Thai. My x-rays started circulating around and a doctor that I raced with really stepped up. Looked at my xrays and located a local doctor he knew from school. Within an hour he was in my room. He was honest about my condition and called another Thai friend of mine and told him I needed to get to a pulmonary specialist in Chiang Mai.
Fast forward 8 hrs - it is now day 3. X-rays come back vastly improved. Still in lots of pain but no longer desperate. Fast forward to day 11. Feeling really strong but still coughing up blood every hour and 300 cc drained from my lung yesterday.
The doctors here are very competent but young. They are both telling me 2 ribs are too damaged and aren't going to spring back. I will have roughly 80% lung capacity. I sent my x-rays and scans to a surgeon in the USA and he told me that it was much to early to know and your lung can adapt even if the ribs don't fully spring back. A surgeon in Chiang Mai basically told me the same thing. All are looking at the same x-rays and ct scans located at this link. https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4Iz76NVzrhJT0lMMDFSd1J5X0U
Anybody have anecdotal stories or a professional opinion would be extremely helpful.
Thanks in advance and sorry again for the wordy post.
25 min ambulance ride to the emergency room, xrays, surgery where tube inserted into lung, and tried to confirm no major head injuries. Another 50 min ride to the nearest hospital with a CT scan. My condition worsened mostly the result of the internal bleeding. My x-rays were whiteouts (white blobs- no details).
Friends of mine from Chiang Mai(n. Thailand) got involved. I was breaking down, alone and don't speak Thai. My x-rays started circulating around and a doctor that I raced with really stepped up. Looked at my xrays and located a local doctor he knew from school. Within an hour he was in my room. He was honest about my condition and called another Thai friend of mine and told him I needed to get to a pulmonary specialist in Chiang Mai.
Fast forward 8 hrs - it is now day 3. X-rays come back vastly improved. Still in lots of pain but no longer desperate. Fast forward to day 11. Feeling really strong but still coughing up blood every hour and 300 cc drained from my lung yesterday.
The doctors here are very competent but young. They are both telling me 2 ribs are too damaged and aren't going to spring back. I will have roughly 80% lung capacity. I sent my x-rays and scans to a surgeon in the USA and he told me that it was much to early to know and your lung can adapt even if the ribs don't fully spring back. A surgeon in Chiang Mai basically told me the same thing. All are looking at the same x-rays and ct scans located at this link. https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4Iz76NVzrhJT0lMMDFSd1J5X0U
Anybody have anecdotal stories or a professional opinion would be extremely helpful.
Thanks in advance and sorry again for the wordy post.
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Comments
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I stopped reading after KOM & Strava dork.
Get well soonI'm sorry you don't believe in miracles0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19629939#p19629939]SloppySchleckonds[/url] wrote:I stopped reading after KOM & Strava dork.
Get well soon
Sorry to offend you and removed any mention of Strava. Thanks0 -
Has your insurance put you in touch with anything other than the state health provider? If you have explained this i apologise but i skim read.0
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Heal well and quickly“Give a man a fish and feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and feed him for a lifetime. Teach a man to cycle and he will realize fishing is stupid and boring”
Desmond Tutu0 -
Has your insurance put you in touch with anything other than the state health provider? If you have explained this i apologise but i skim read.
Don't blame you for skimming. My insurance company here in Thailand only covers legitimate claims and offers no other services.
At this point, I'm out of intensive care and for the most part danger. I moved into a nice private room a few days ago. I'm patiently waiting for the blood to drain from my cavity and lungs. Another couple days I hope.
My concern as a cyclist is the long term. Broke ribs and punctured a lung 10 years ago and recovered fully. Why are the docs here telling me 80% lung capacity? I'm not a doctor and it just makes zero sense. Docs outside the hospital that have looked at my x-rays are telling me it is too early and most likely with exercise I will FULLY recover.0 -
Things look positive. Although i'm not an expert the Doc's seem to be giving plausible explanations for the residual blood. But, if it's bright red and frothy it may be more than just residual. Bone's heal as does most soft tissue. The main thing is don't rush the recovery. Seek physio and occupational therapist advice before placing too much stress on things. Bear in mind that in the early days of getting back in the saddle any form of abdominal or chest pain should get looked at rather than being tolerated through gritted teeth. Happy Cycling.0
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4 years ago my chest was run over by a large loaded van. I had a haemopneumothorax and lots of rib fractures etc.etc.. The crush injuries to my lungs caused me to cough up frothy blood over about a 8 to 12 week period and my cxr's looked like fluffy pneumonia all over , but that is mainly inflammation and oedema due to the crush injury . lots of antibiotics and oxygen were given , specially in the first 2 weeks , but later also when I got worse again and feverish after trying to get back to work much too soon at 4 wks(office job).
cut to now :I lost about 1 litre of forced vital capacity (useful lung volume ) permanently; which is about a 20%reduction. This means I can cruise along at moderate pace just as before , but when I hit a hill I very soon run out of puff and drop off the back, like a big bloke with small lungs.I have a mild morning cough like an ex-smoker . The rib injuries all healed but one , but there is still chest wall pain , perhaps due to nerve damage. I only occasionaly take painkillers for it if sleep is disturbed.
I think that kind of permanent effect might be what they have predicted for you, but did you have a crush injury to the chest ? If not then there might not be so much volume loss in the long term.
If you are able to make a claim on insurance you need to be assessed by a dr who knows a lot about traumatic chest injuries. Not all respiratory specialists seem to.
You will get back on your bike in a few months, but may need to take it slowly for a year and perhaps change your type of racing , or perhaps you wil make a full and complete recovery within 6 months . I cannot tell from this distance, but perhaps this anectote might be useful to you.Raleigh Eclipse, , Dahon Jetstream XP, Raleigh Banana, Dawes super galaxy, Raleigh Clubman
http://s189.photobucket.com/albums/z122 ... =slideshow0 -
Your doctors will be conservative with their predictions. The level of certainty they will have about the forecast will be quite low (they are doctors not time-travellers) and every person will respond differently to that level of injury, so it is best to take each day as it comes and aim for small improvements. In many ways the forecast should not really change anything about how you go about your recovery, just keep an open mind about your expectations and take comfort in the fact that you're probably fitter and healthier than the people the doc normally sees.
PS get well soon!- - - - - - - - - -
On Strava.{/url}0 -
Thanks for taking the time to post. Awful injuries and sadly long term health issues. Sorry!The crush injuries to my lungs caused me to cough up frothy blood over about a 8 to 12 week period and my cxr's looked like fluffy pneumonia all over , but that is mainly inflammation and oedema due to the crush injury .
My injuries are different. My lung itself was not crushed and simply punctured. Doctor told me an hour ago it had expanded from top to bottom(sorry - lack medical terms). Had lots of internal bleeding and this was the main concern but that has stopped now. Both doctors English is not great but the gist of my condition is that my lung will be fine but 2 of my ribs are not springing back and forming an arch. This will limit my breathing capacity in their opinion.
Guess I'm looking for further confirmation that it is too early in the process to assume the rib won't spring back and even if it doesn't I thought lungs adapted and might still get 100% functionality. One US doctor and another in Thailand have both said that most likely will recover 100%.
I want to be back climbing hills 6 months from now as I did last week. Maybe I'm being petty and should patiently wait and see what happens. Hard for me to do while bored in a hospital room.
Thanks and hope your OK with the injuries.0 -
DW is right nobody can say with accuracy so early in the process , but if the injury is ''just'' rib fracture causing puctured lung then I would think it pessimistic to expect much permanent volume loss.
From my experience I would say that your good level of fitness and muscle strength now will last for a year or more so that you will be able to train back up to your best level rapidly when you get going again. The quicker you are able to restart training the better in that respect. If you reduce your activity for a couple of years the retraining process will be slow and resemble that for someone new to sport.Raleigh Eclipse, , Dahon Jetstream XP, Raleigh Banana, Dawes super galaxy, Raleigh Clubman
http://s189.photobucket.com/albums/z122 ... =slideshow0 -
How's the bike?Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
Didn't know they had ambulances in Scotland.0
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Didn't know they had ambulances in Scotland.
Good job he wasn't in Wales - he would have been well and truly stuffed. I hear they just tie ill people to sheep and transport them to the nearest leech vendor over there .........Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
Sloppy Craig and Mathew
Lovely way to welcome someone to the forum!0 -
Was hoping to receive more input on odds of a full recovery. It's apparent that my health and possibility of 80% of prior lung capacity is humorous to a few posters.
No problem, I wasn't expecting much by posting on the internet and rarely do spend time on internet forums. Quite possibly offended a few posters and deserved the ridicule. I do wonder how these posters would feel in a shitty hospital in a foreign country where the doctors keep telling him he is now in stable condition but couple of broken ribs, a minor concern initially, will never heal correctly and hence the 80% lung capacity.
Maybe I'm a vain complainer. Being on the podium was easy for me if healthy but now worry it will be an impossibility. Vanity? Maybe and I'm sure most members on this forum would be more of man and accept fate.
Sincerely,
Robert
p.s., One poster asked about my bike. Police have it and really don't care what condition it is in.0 -
You aren't the first person to be offended by the zany off the wall humour of our more socioopathic members here. Its a judgement thing - knowing when to joke - and some people will never have it.
Rest assured, you absolutely have our symphathy, but not many of us will be able to meaningfully comment on your prognosis.
Your main problem doesn't seem so much to be the care you are receiving (you seem to have navigated that particular minefield) but rather that you have a long time to sit there and wonder how well you'll ever recover.
Look, what whatever happens, you are alive and you aren't brain damaged or paralysed. To all intents and purposes it sounds like you will fully recover and be able to get back to your sports. Maybe you'll have slight residual lung damage, maybe you won't. But once you are recovered, you'll find that you will appreciate being able to do your sports at all.
In the meantime, latch on to the most positive medical opinion and aspire to it. If your clinicians in Thailand are downbeat, I reckon your best bet is to try to communicate with people at home and try to get advice from the clinicians who are going to pick up your treatment once you get back.0 -
You aren't the first person to be offended by the zany off the wall humour of our more socioopathic members here. Its a judgement thing - knowing when to joke - and some people will never have it.
Rest assured, you absolutely have our symphathy, but not many of us will be able to meaningfully comment on your prognosis.
Your main problem doesn't seem so much to be the care you are receiving (you seem to have navigated that particular minefield) but rather that you have a long time to sit there and wonder how well you'll ever recover.
Look, what whatever happens, you are alive and you aren't brain damaged or paralysed. To all intents and purposes it sounds like you will fully recover and be able to get back to your sports. Maybe you'll have slight residual lung damage, maybe you won't. But once you are recovered, you'll find that you will appreciate being able to do your sports at all.
In the meantime, latch on to the most positive medical opinion and aspire to it. If your clinicians in Thailand are downbeat, I reckon your best bet is to try to communicate with people at home and try to get advice from the clinicians who are going to pick up your treatment once you get back.
I agree - fine words.Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
If you can't laugh about it, then you could cry.
Can't comprehend what it may be like in a foreign country in your condition but as said before, you are alive, compos mentis and it won't be long until you are back in the UK and getting a re-assessment. At least they responded and had sufficiently modern medical facilities so that you have had treatment well above the standard of some other 3rd world countries.
Your immediate concern is a lung infection at this point. Sorry to spread fear but be aware of this and be aware of it whilst your lungs are compromised - months ahead, especially when you start to get back into the swing of things and start pushing the boat out on a chilly day.
Anyway, chin up - come down to Bottom Bracket and get some proper sh1t flung at you, you'll soon have a smile on your face.
I hear they do a little 'operation' in Bangkok. I was thinking this because if you feel that you will never be a podium bloke again as a man...
Take it easy, one step at a time.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
@ First Aspect, Thanks for the considerate post
I really don't need more sympathy. I do appreciate the kind words but I'm past the point of needing them.
My intent was to throw out my question and hope someone might have valuable input or even a professional opinion after looking at my scans and x-rays( OP link) Realized prior to posting the odds were slim but what did I have to lose?
Also aware how trivial 5,10, 15% lung capacity is for the general population. All the gram counter, watt , and aero threads would even be more trivial in my opinion.
Thanks everyone for the input and at minimum they helped pass the time. Honestly, my lungs should recover 100% (they did 10 yr ago) and the doctors here are wrong. My x-rays are scary the first few days but now are similar to any one with broken ribs. My lung even fully expanded today. Maybe it is common in this hospital to tell collapsed lung patients they won't recover fully.
Thanks again and no hard feeling. Just tried to get the thread back on track hoping a curious doctor or someone else might know something I don''t. Delusional? Probably a little.0 -
Sloppy Craig and Mathew
Lovely way to welcome someone to the forum!
It's a bull thread.
From a medical perspective:
None of us were there
None of us have seen his records
None of us knows 100% MOI save for falling of bicycle - what did he impact? Speed, angle, secondary impacts?
Secondary injuries
Distracting injuries
Past medical history
Treatment at roadside
Treatment at hospital
Post hospital treatment
None of us have examined him
No sight of X-rays/PRF or equiv
No hand overs from paras/con dr
Treatment protocols
Pre accident health
Post accident health
Too many variables.
Too many non medical people offering opinions
Non medical person reviewing non medical opinions.
Every accident is different, every persons recovery rates are different, so not even any point making comparisons.
It happened.
He's alive. Liaise with doctors who have the full picture.
Get on with it. Smile, laugh, buy a new bike, enjoy the time off work.
But most of all, don't forget to wear sunscreen.Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
Sloppy Craig and Mathew
Lovely way to welcome someone to the forum!
It's a bull thread.
From a medical perspective:
None of us were there
None of us have seen his records
None of us knows 100% MOI save for falling of bicycle - what did he impact? Speed, angle, secondary impacts?
Secondary injuries
Distracting injuries
Past medical history
Treatment at roadside
Treatment at hospital
Post hospital treatment
None of us have examined him
No sight of X-rays/PRF or equiv
No hand overs from paras/con dr
Treatment protocols
Pre accident health
Post accident health
Too many variables.
Too many non medical people offering opinions
Non medical person reviewing non medical opinions.
Every accident is different, every persons recovery rates are different, so not even any point making comparisons.
It happened.
He's alive. Liaise with doctors who have the full picture.
Get on with it. Smile, laugh, buy a new bike, enjoy the time off work.
But most of all, don't forget to wear sunscreen.
Chill, and why all the anger. I did provide a link to x-rays and ct scans on the original post. You need to grow-up and your sense of humor is pathetic. Re-read your post - intelligence seems to escape you. Just let it go and in the end, is this about you?
A doctor can tell quite a lot from x-rays and CT Scans. Which was provided.
This I why avoid internet forums. This member needs everyone to recognize his superiority which is pathetically transparent. At least some fools are entertaining but not this fool.0 -
Mate, listen. You fell off your bike. You're getting/have got medical treatment from (what seem to be) decent doctors.
You can only tell so much from x rays/etc without seeing back up info - it's like being told your gears don't work but not being told what type of gears or what cables.
It's not a superiority thing - you need to laugh at stuff like this otherwise it will get you down - you're now fine save for a minor rib issue that will most probably sort itself out.
You also asked for a medical opinion in your first post - if you just wanted anecdotal that's what you should have shed for - I have plenty of stories about falling off stuff I can tell you if that's what you're after......
Life throws curve balls at you occasionally. This is one of yours. Now chill, smile and crack open a cold one.Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
this and your previous post are awfully long. They betray a guilty conscience.Mate, listen. You fell off your bike. You're getting/have got medical treatment from (what seem to be) decent doctors.
You can only tell so much from x rays/etc without seeing back up info - it's like being told your gears don't work but not being told what type of gears or what cables.
It's not a superiority thing - you need to laugh at stuff like this otherwise it will get you down - you're now fine save for a minor rib issue that will most probably sort itself out.
You also asked for a medical opinion in your first post - if you just wanted anecdotal that's what you should have shed for - I have plenty of stories about falling off 0stuff I can tell you if that's what you're after......
Life throws curve balls at you occasionally. This is one of yours. Now chill, smile and crack open a cold one.
I've used the word "puerile" before, but I don't think that does you any justice. I'm all for banter, but you are simply vile and not in the least amusing.0 -
WTF is going on in Road Forum? Are the mumsneters winding US up now?
OP, Get well soon but the internet is not the place to get medical advice. I'm an expat too so i feel some of your pain in terms of understanding medical problems but this is not the way to solve it. Get well enough to leave hospital and then go to wherever home is and get to work with a specialist. Even if a doctor were to post anything (which IMO would be a little irresponsible of them) without seeing the whole story it would be meaningless. You ve had a massive smash and it will take time to recover. Put off plans for the TdF this year and start getting better. One of those jobs will be to put the incident behind you and for most people that means learning to laugh about it. Witness the banter between military guys who have lost limbs for example. Many a study shows that wallowing in self pity is not the way to get betterWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
this and your previous post are awfully long. They betray a guilty conscience.Mate, listen. You fell off your bike. You're getting/have got medical treatment from (what seem to be) decent doctors.
You can only tell so much from x rays/etc without seeing back up info - it's like being told your gears don't work but not being told what type of gears or what cables.
It's not a superiority thing - you need to laugh at stuff like this otherwise it will get you down - you're now fine save for a minor rib issue that will most probably sort itself out.
You also asked for a medical opinion in your first post - if you just wanted anecdotal that's what you should have shed for - I have plenty of stories about falling off 0stuff I can tell you if that's what you're after......
Life throws curve balls at you occasionally. This is one of yours. Now chill, smile and crack open a cold one.
I've used the word "puerile" before, but I don't think that does you any justice. I'm all for banter, but you are simply vile and not in the least amusing.
It's nothing to with being puerile or vile or banter: I don't do NHS hand holding. In my workplace we are forthright: we tell the facts and work off them: the guys on the ground prefer it that way, we prefer it that way as we know what we are dealing with.
We also appreciate life and enjoy it to the full where we can. We see the light in the dark because dealing with it everyday you have to otherwise you'll go mad.
I'm sorry if you wanted an NHS style soft and caring answer but not all medical professionals are like that. Perhaps it should have been stipulated in the OPs first post.
I'll leave you guys to it.Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am
De Sisti wrote:
This is one of the silliest threads I've come across.
Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honoursmithy21 wrote:
He's right you know.0 -
I rest my case0
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I rest my case
Was your wife the author of the Centre Parcs thread on mumsnet?I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles0 -
What is your IQ?[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19630930#p19630930]SloppySchleckonds[/url] wrote:I rest my case
Was your wife the author of the Centre Parcs thread on mumsnet?0 -
What is your IQ?[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19630930#p19630930]SloppySchleckonds[/url] wrote:I rest my case
Was your wife the author of the Centre Parcs thread on mumsnet?
That's the sort of thing only a complete idiot would say.I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles0 -
Which one of the preceding 5282 things are you referring to?[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19630951#p19630951]SloppySchleckonds[/url] wrote:
What is your IQ?[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19630930#p19630930]SloppySchleckonds[/url] wrote:I rest my case
Was your wife the author of the Centre Parcs thread on mumsnet?
That's the sort of thing only a complete idiot would say.0
This discussion has been closed.
