BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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In that spirit, Nissan is not going to close its Sunderland plant.kingstongraham said:Like old times in here.
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OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.0 -
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years0 -
All those stupid car workers who voted for BrexitTheBigBean said:
In that spirit, Nissan is not going to close its Sunderland plant.kingstongraham said:Like old times in here.
Isn't that how it goes?
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That's excellent news.0
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Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.0 -
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
It is however, the perfect strategy for no deal.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.
They get to blame Johnny Foreigner. To those who believe them.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Although deals between 2 sovereign nations have been signed 6 months from starting. And some others within a few months more (as we are not right at the start).Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Are you suggesting that we do a deal directly with EU members who want to keep unhindered access to the UK market?Stevo_666 said:
Although deals between 2 sovereign nations have been signed 6 months from starting. And some others within a few months more (as we are not right at the start).Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.0 -
No.surrey_commuter said:
Are you suggesting that we do a deal directly with EU members who want to keep unhindered access to the UK market?Stevo_666 said:
Although deals between 2 sovereign nations have been signed 6 months from starting. And some others within a few months more (as we are not right at the start).Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
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Not bothering here much, but is the argument that
That's the end of the discussion then?Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.0 -
Have you not followed?kingstongraham said:Not bothering here much, but is the argument that
That's the end of the discussion then?Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.
We don’t need several years to do a FTA with the EU because they can be done a lot quicker, the only ones that take several years all involve the EU, as we are negotiating with the EU it does not have to take several years.0 -
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Hi, a "no deal" deal scenario , although bad for both sides is not the worst case scenario for the EU,that would be a UK that prospers outside of the EU. therefore the EU has to try and keep some kinda control of the UK. this is understandable but hardly tenable from a UK point of view! The EU has often said their can be no "cherry picking" of the good bits of EU membership but then asks for exactly the same access to UK fishing waters as they currently have, a somewhat hypocritical viewpoint. If one is to assume the UK can not "cherry pick" the good points of EU membership then it should be safe to assume that the EU cannot "cherry pick" the good points of UK`s membership of the EU, EG, fishing, security and Defence. Im sure their is a deal to be done, and i expect the "real" negotiations to start in July provided the UK stick to their guns and do not extend the transition period. A FTA with the EU would mean trade wouldn't be disrupted to greatly but then the UK would be trading the same if not better without having to accept the 4 freedoms!. This is probably a major sticking point for the EU which I don`t imagine they will accept. I`m nearly 50 years old and have lived and worked in the EU for quite a few years, Im no "Little Englander" but don`t think the EU has gone in the right direction.0
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Geopolitics means EU can strong arm the U.K. into an unfavourable sitch for the U.K.spatt77 said:Hi, a "no deal" deal scenario , although bad for both sides is not the worst case scenario for the EU,that would be a UK that prospers outside of the EU. therefore the EU has to try and keep some kinda control of the UK. this is understandable but hardly tenable from a UK point of view! The EU has often said their can be no "cherry picking" of the good bits of EU membership but then asks for exactly the same access to UK fishing waters as they currently have, a somewhat hypocritical viewpoint. If one is to assume the UK can not "cherry pick" the good points of EU membership then it should be safe to assume that the EU cannot "cherry pick" the good points of UK`s membership of the EU, EG, fishing, security and Defence. Im sure their is a deal to be done, and i expect the "real" negotiations to start in July provided the UK stick to their guns and do not extend the transition period. A FTA with the EU would mean trade wouldn't be disrupted to greatly but then the UK would be trading the same if not better without having to accept the 4 freedoms!. This is probably a major sticking point for the EU which I don`t imagine they will accept. I`m nearly 50 years old and have lived and worked in the EU for quite a few years, Im no "Little Englander" but don`t think the EU has gone in the right direction.
Geopolitics is not charity, it is not fair and the big boys usually win.
Of course if the EU doesn’t want to show leaving is advantageous as it will be an existential problem for the remaining union.
This fairly basic stuff.0 -
It was known 4 years ago too.rick_chasey said:
Geopolitics means EU can strong arm the U.K. into an unfavourable sitch for the U.K.spatt77 said:Hi, a "no deal" deal scenario , although bad for both sides is not the worst case scenario for the EU,that would be a UK that prospers outside of the EU. therefore the EU has to try and keep some kinda control of the UK. this is understandable but hardly tenable from a UK point of view! The EU has often said their can be no "cherry picking" of the good bits of EU membership but then asks for exactly the same access to UK fishing waters as they currently have, a somewhat hypocritical viewpoint. If one is to assume the UK can not "cherry pick" the good points of EU membership then it should be safe to assume that the EU cannot "cherry pick" the good points of UK`s membership of the EU, EG, fishing, security and Defence. Im sure their is a deal to be done, and i expect the "real" negotiations to start in July provided the UK stick to their guns and do not extend the transition period. A FTA with the EU would mean trade wouldn't be disrupted to greatly but then the UK would be trading the same if not better without having to accept the 4 freedoms!. This is probably a major sticking point for the EU which I don`t imagine they will accept. I`m nearly 50 years old and have lived and worked in the EU for quite a few years, Im no "Little Englander" but don`t think the EU has gone in the right direction.
Geopolitics is not charity, it is not fair and the big boys usually win.
Of course if the EU doesn’t want to show leaving is advantageous as it will be an existential problem for the remaining union.
This fairly basic stuff.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Our relationship with the EU is already very well developed. It doesn’t seem to me to be very hard to do a free trade deal very rapidly indeed.0
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Simply revoke A50 and keep that deal then.
Very rapid.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
The problem is that every other FTA in history has involved two economies converging. An FTA between two parties intent on diverging presents a whole new set of problems.kingstongraham said:Our relationship with the EU is already very well developed. It doesn’t seem to me to be very hard to do a free trade deal very rapidly indeed.
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80% of our economy is services, no FTA in history has covered services, this is why Maggie was such a driving force behind the Single Market. You are deluding yourself if you think our trade will be the same or better. By definition leaving the EU means that our trading terms will be worse.spatt77 said:Hi, a "no deal" deal scenario , although bad for both sides is not the worst case scenario for the EU,that would be a UK that prospers outside of the EU. therefore the EU has to try and keep some kinda control of the UK. this is understandable but hardly tenable from a UK point of view! The EU has often said their can be no "cherry picking" of the good bits of EU membership but then asks for exactly the same access to UK fishing waters as they currently have, a somewhat hypocritical viewpoint. If one is to assume the UK can not "cherry pick" the good points of EU membership then it should be safe to assume that the EU cannot "cherry pick" the good points of UK`s membership of the EU, EG, fishing, security and Defence. Im sure their is a deal to be done, and i expect the "real" negotiations to start in July provided the UK stick to their guns and do not extend the transition period. A FTA with the EU would mean trade wouldn't be disrupted to greatly but then the UK would be trading the same if not better without having to accept the 4 freedoms!. This is probably a major sticking point for the EU which I don`t imagine they will accept. I`m nearly 50 years old and have lived and worked in the EU for quite a few years, Im no "Little Englander" but don`t think the EU has gone in the right direction.
There is no economic argument for leaving the EU. Nobody has ever attempted to make one so don’t kid yourself we will be no worse off.
Boris “fvck business” Johnson believes in the primacy of the State. If you don’t believe that the Govt can drive the economy then you voted for the wrong party.0 -
Not sure if you're pretending not to understand.surrey_commuter said:
Have you not followed?kingstongraham said:Not bothering here much, but is the argument that
That's the end of the discussion then?Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.
We don’t need several years to do a FTA with the EU because they can be done a lot quicker, the only ones that take several years all involve the EU, as we are negotiating with the EU it does not have to take several years.
I'll give it one last go. Tell me what part of 'the EU takes a long time to negotiate free trade agreements' isn't clear to you."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Right. And this is one of those.Stevo_666 said:
Not sure if you're pretending not to understand.surrey_commuter said:
Have you not followed?kingstongraham said:Not bothering here much, but is the argument that
That's the end of the discussion then?Stevo_666 said:
Not with the EU, that's for sure.rick_chasey said:
No one who knows about trade deals and has experience says that is possible.Stevo_666 said:
Not really.surrey_commuter said:
I think I get it.Stevo_666 said:
Neither.surrey_commuter said:
are you arguing that we are not negotiating with the EU or that we are not negotiating an FTA?Stevo_666 said:
OK, let me spell this out more simply: all of the other FTAs that the EU have been party to have taken a long time. It is not necessarily the complexity of the deal, it is the nature of the EU itself that has contributed to the long timescales.rick_chasey said:
But this is a deal with the EU?Stevo_666 said:
It could have impacted the time taken to get deals done.surrey_commuter said:
And?Stevo_666 said:
The EU was the common factor in all of those...rick_chasey said:
So what was it about every single other trade deal that took years to agree?TheBigBean said:
I think a bare bones trade deal can be done by the commission without the requirement for national parliaments. As bells and whistles are added, it requires national parliaments. This is one of the reasons the UK doesn't want one agreement to cover everything.surrey_commuter said:
it will take 6 months to get the legislation through the different national parliaments so end of June is when you give up, conclude a deal or ask for an extension.pblakeney said:
Ah! Okay, so negotiations finish on 30th June? I thought it was 31st December.surrey_commuter said:
The deadline is June 30th, so yes there will be 6 months to prepare for whateverpblakeney said:Well, they could go for no deal today and give businesses 6 months to transition.
Or they could huff and puff for 6 months and come straight out with no deal.
Certainly looked that way from the progress...
No deal looking more certain in that case.
As I say we do not act like somebody who wants a deal.
Still confused? I am saying it might take a long to agree stuff with the EU because of who they are. Not sure I can put it much more simply than that.
We still have time to do a trade deal because the other trade deals which took several were with the EU and as we are doing a trade deal with the EU then there is no reason why it should take several years
A basic trade deal should be do-able by year end between two countries, but is less likely to be do-able in that time frame with the EU.
We don’t need several years to do a FTA with the EU because they can be done a lot quicker, the only ones that take several years all involve the EU, as we are negotiating with the EU it does not have to take several years.
I'll give it one last go. Tell me what part of 'the EU takes a long time to negotiate free trade agreements' isn't clear to you.0 -
Sorry, should have said - who said this? "Our relationship with the EU is already very well developed. It doesn’t seem to me to be very hard to do a free trade deal very rapidly indeed."surrey_commuter said:
The problem is that every other FTA in history has involved two economies converging. An FTA between two parties intent on diverging presents a whole new set of problems.kingstongraham said:
Our relationship with the EU is already very well developed. It doesn’t seem to me to be very hard to do a free trade deal very rapidly indeed.0 -
Sounds like the EU might not be that confident they have a competitive market place if they cant handle all those little Englanders diverging from them. The fact the EU cant do a deal with a currently compliant nation kind of tells you all you need to know about the EUs confidence in its offering.0
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Every FTA ever struck has assumed the parties are converging. How do you structure a deal when one side is insistent upon divergence?kingstongraham said:
Sorry, should have said - who said this? "Our relationship with the EU is already very well developed. It doesn’t seem to me to be very hard to do a free trade deal very rapidly indeed."surrey_commuter said:
The problem is that every other FTA in history has involved two economies converging. An FTA between two parties intent on diverging presents a whole new set of problems.kingstongraham said:
Our relationship with the EU is already very well developed. It doesn’t seem to me to be very hard to do a free trade deal very rapidly indeed.0
