UKIP manifesto help please

pinno

mamba80 wrote:

pinarello001 wrote:

That's right...the by-pass.

You are right... even less tax.

We as a nation should embrace the EU or leave, i want us to stay and become a full partner, instead of this 1/2 way house, where we swop between the uSA and europe, it just doesnt work.

^ Right, I am totally with you now.

The current high unemployment currently across Europe was a result of a Banking Crises, not because of the EU. Folks on here are getting the two things mixed up.

@Bally, no one is saying that we will fall off the end of the world. I asked the question, how much would it cost us if we withdrew as an EU member?

ballysmate

Pina, if the article in The Scotsman is correct, the answer to your question is evidently "Not much"

The anti euro zone sentiments are just the xenophobic ramblings of Island mentality loons.

Really?

pinno

Ballysmate wrote:

Pina, if the article in The Scotsman is correct, the answer to your question is evidently "Not much"

The anti euro zone sentiments are just the xenophobic ramblings of Island mentality loons.

Really?

I was referring to you and i'm dead right.

ballysmate

We seem to be on the same page though reference the work ethic. I agree with you that there should be advantage in seeking work rather than relying on benefits. The high level of benefits available have eroded some people's desire to work.

Welcome to the blue side Tory Boy.

pinno

Ballysmate wrote:

We seem...desire to work.

Welcome to the blue side Tory Boy.

That's it Bally, i'm going to skin you alive for that one.

You see, I am an immigrant. That's why it's easy for me to get work here.

ballysmate

Kenya's gain is our loss I suppose.

Kerguelen

CYCLESPORT1 wrote:

http://www.ukip.org/
Vote UKIP

No.

pinno

Kerguelen wrote:

CYCLESPORT1 wrote:

http://www.ukip.org/
Vote UKIP

No.

That's not enough, come on - what's your twopence worth?

ballysmate

pinarello001 wrote:

Kerguelen wrote:

CYCLESPORT1 wrote:

http://www.ukip.org/
Vote UKIP

No.

That's not enough, come on - what's your twopence worth?

Surely in your Euro loving world that should be 2 cents worth?

pinno

Ballysmate wrote:

pinarello001 wrote:

Kerguelen wrote:

CYCLESPORT1 wrote:

http://www.ukip.org/
Vote UKIP

No.

That's not enough, come on - what's your twopence worth?

Surely in your Euro loving world that should be 2 cents worth?

At the current conversion rate, 3.

iron-clover

I'm not too sure about any manifesto they produce to be honest- when asked whether what they'd written down was their final policy decisions Farage said, "I've read and understood it thoroughly and think it's a great piece of work."
Didn't really inspire me with confidence that he'd actually put much into it- rather than passed it onto someone else to try and make something that looks nice.

I wouldn't trust them as far as I can throw them (and having the classic cyclist 'T-rex' build that's not far ) as most of what they were talking about before sounded as if they had picked an issue from that day's edition of the Daily Mail rather than actually know how to run a country- especially looking at the track record with their MEPs.

blackpoolkev

The UK pays in more than it gets out (in purely cash terms) of the EU. Other countries pay in less than they get out.
So the UK seems to be lowering it's own prosperity in order to finance others. There also seems to be an EU black hole that cannot be accounted for when the the auditors come calling.
The fact that UKIP are challenging this state of affairs is a valid position.

mamba80

blackpoolkev wrote:

The UK pays in more than it gets out (in purely cash terms) of the EU. Other countries pay in less than they get out.
So the UK seems to be lowering it's own prosperity in order to finance others. There also seems to be an EU black hole that cannot be accounted for when the the auditors come calling.
The fact that UKIP are challenging this state of affairs is a valid position.

Yes the UK does, but despite what we are all told, the uk is a very wealthy country, building a fair and economically viable europe is in all our interests, people complian about migration, well, a properous Poland, means less Poles coming here and another country where we can export some more range rovers.
Also, how much is the EU responsible for keeping europe from continuing its centuries long tradition of wars?

There is a lot wrong with the EU and we should try and chnage it but leaving, i believe will be a huge mistake, we need to get stuck in and make change by being a full partner - remember by continuing to face towards the US, we then got very involved in 2 costly and un necessary wars.

ballysmate

All very laudable Mamba, but surely British taxpayers have an expectation that tax revenue be used to improve their lives and situation. I obviously have no idea of your income but I'm sure you could understand that people on minimum wage or just above may feel aggrieved to see money being used to finance the EU.
Perhaps if the EU didn't suck money out of the UK into its financial black hole perhaps more British people could afford to buy Range Rovers?

VTech

blackpoolkev wrote:

The UK pays in more than it gets out (in purely cash terms) of the EU. Other countries pay in less than they get out.
So the UK seems to be lowering it's own prosperity in order to finance others. There also seems to be an EU black hole that cannot be accounted for when the the auditors come calling.
The fact that UKIP are challenging this state of affairs is a valid position.

EXACTLY.

Also, I always find it tough trying to discuss the issue of jobs with people, the reason for that is because we have plenty of jobs in the UK, the problem is that so many brits don't want the jobs on offer or don't want to work. We have become a lazy nation.
If it were the difference between paying for the food my kids eat by doing a job I didn't like or simply claiming benefit I can assure everyone that I would choose to work for the money.
Sadly this isn't the case with an absolutely huge portion of our country.
Europeans come here for jobs our people won't do.
I do realise that many of these people are exploited but the problems occurred due to brits not wanting to work and for taking the "easy road"

Reality: it probably isn't fixable, 100% not fixable in my life time.

mr_goo

With all this In/Out EU discussion, I was reminded of an interview I heard many years ago on the radio in the late 90s/early 00s. I believe the gentleman concerned was this fellow. Makes for interesting reading, no matter what your political leanings are. Are warning from history? I certainly believe in a lot of what he says.

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/865

mamba80

Ballysmate wrote:

All very laudable Mamba, but surely British taxpayers have an expectation that tax revenue be used to improve their lives and situation. I obviously have no idea of your income but I'm sure you could understand that people on minimum wage or just above may feel aggrieved to see money being used to finance the EU.
Perhaps if the EU didn't suck money out of the UK into its financial black hole perhaps more British people could afford to buy Range Rovers?

I am known for my laudableness
However, the real issue with the UK is as you say, a reliance on benefits, not unemployment ones because they are shockingly low, tops £73 per week and nothing if you ve got any reasonable savings - germany pays out something like 80% of the previous take home pay?

Tax payers are subsidising very profitable firms to pay their workers low salaries, they then go to the state for hand outs eg working tax credit and housing benefit, these 2 alone can double some ones take home pay, so when you read Tesco made 2.1 billion and their shares are up by 30% it is really the tax payer and me (i dont get anything from the state) who are paying for Mr Tesco s directors bonuses and tbh i am very fuggin pi55ed off about it, goes to show that when Brown introduced min wage and tax credits to boost the benefit of work, i doubt he had any idea this would be the consequence.

I read recently that companies in this country are very cash rich, as they not been paying more or investing due to recession, shame they dont start paying a living wage instead of paying themselves huge pay rises.

Help should be given to companies that actually need it to boost employment, instead of hand outs to those that dont.

I m sure that if people stopped and thought about tax credits and housing benefit (which goes into the pockets of some very wealthy properties sharks) they d be a whole lot more pee d off about this than what is paid to the EU.

pinno

Ballysmate wrote:

All very laudable Mamba, but surely British taxpayers have an expectation that tax revenue be used to improve their lives and situation. I obviously have no idea of your income but I'm sure you could understand that people on minimum wage or just above may feel aggrieved to see money being used to finance the EU.
Perhaps if the EU didn't suck money out of the UK into its financial black hole perhaps more British people could afford to buy Range Rovers?

Nothing to do with the cost of living? One could argue that it would be even higher if we were not in the EU.

ballysmate

Pina, Mamba made a point that it is in our interests to spend money to finance the EU and to help develop poorer states. I made the point that it would be difficult to sell that idea to people here on low incomes to see their tax going abroad when they can see plenty of scope to use the revenue to improve their own lot.
This is valid regardless of our cost of living.

pinno

I knew you'd come crawling out from under your stone at this time of night Bally.

I don't have any quarrel with mamba, just your sanctimonious cr4p.

ballysmate

pinarello001 wrote:

I knew you'd come crawling out from under your stone at this time of night Bally.

I don't have any quarrel with mamba, just your sanctimonious cr4p.

Crap? Maybe.

Sanctimonious?

sanctimonious
ˌsaŋ(k)tɪˈməʊnɪəs/Submit
adjectivederogatory
making a show of being morally superior to other people.

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/defin ... ctimonious

I thought it was all you lefties who thought they held the moral upper ground.

pinno

I don't think the very condescended working man takes issue with the EU when he gets his wage packet and blows it in Wetherspoon's after watching x-factor or Britain's got talent on his £2 grand 52" telly before heading to the kebab shop hoping for a fight along the way.

rick_chasey

Ballysmate wrote:

I thought it was all you lefties who thought they held the moral upper ground.

We don't think we do, we know we do.

ballysmate

Appears it's not just the UK whose people are starting to question levels of immigration.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-32372501

It appears that the crock at the end of the rainbow in the Rainbow Nation does not necessarily contain gold.

mamba80

Ballysmate wrote:

Appears it's not just the UK whose people are starting to question levels of immigration.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-32372501

It appears that the crock at the end of the rainbow in the Rainbow Nation does not necessarily contain gold.

it does if you loot the right shop.

secretsam

VTech wrote:

As a businessman I genuinely only count money when its paid into the business account, I remember years ago when someone said they were making an order and I got excited only to find out it wasn't real. I now work on real only.

You'll find your accountant (and HMRC) don't work on that basis. If you're talking about order books and projected income, that's a different thing. And I think deciding to pull an order from your firm is slightly easier than a government totally disinvesting in another country's produce.

What gets me with UKIP and the whole "Out of Europe" thing is what they are hoping to achieve - do they think that p155ing off our major trading partners and making trade with them more difficult will benefit our economy more than it will cost? Or am I missing something?

ddraver

SecretSam wrote:

What gets me with UKIP and the whole "Out of Europe" thing is what they are hoping to achieve - do they think that p155ing off our major trading partners and making trade with them more difficult will benefit our economy more than it will cost? Or am I missing something?

Like all nationalists, racists, xenophobes etc, they cant handle the reality that their countries problems are of it's own making and need someone, anyone, else to blame. There are a great deal of people who are content to blame the world rather than take responsibility. That holds true for global economics and forum arguments equally...

ballysmate

DDraver, as I have said, I am not a UKIP voter and if there was to be a referendum tomorrow, I honestly do not know which way I would vote. However, people have a right to their views and are not necessarily racists or bigots. The 'Yes' voters in the Scottish referendum were entitled to their opinion and were respected as such. I didn't agree with their views but respected them. I didn't think they were all 'Bravehearts' covered in wode.
Reverting to name calling doesn't further any argument.
It could be argued that people who want to leave the EU actually want to take control and responsibility for their own destiny be it for better or worse.
Whether we would be better in or out, I don't know.

ddraver

Not sure I was talking about you Bally....