Knocked off, Broken Thumb. what to do next?

macleod113

Hi All,

just looking for advice if possible from those who have been here.

last night i was knocked over on my commute home from work. the driver was slow moving after some ped crossing lights went from red to green and me moving quicker was filtering on his inside. as i drew level the driver turned left and only indicated as he was turning. the result was me hitting his passgenger door and going ass over elbow and luckily only damaging my hands and elbow.
Thankfully the police were passing at the time but they have decided to take no further action (fine with me i dont think the driver hit me on purpose he just didnt look in his mirror or signal early enough). they have taken statements from 2 witnesses ans i have a reference as it looks like the driver and i will sort any damage out between ourselves.
i was able to freewheel my bike to the local hospital where the other half picked me up. not sure of the damage to the bike but the chain was all over the place. will check it soon ish.
a&e visit showed a broken left thumb and am currently in plaster. back to hospital tomorrow as they may need to operate to 'wire it up'?
what do i do next though with the other driver? im not with british cycling for any cover.
i assume i'll take the bike to my LBS for a check over for any structural damage and then let the driver know. one of the police officers who stopped advised me i had damaged the drivers door and he mentioned the driver asking for damages. nice!
any thoughts or advice on what to do next would be very much appreciated. thank you

Mac

veronese68

First off, sorry to hear that and glad you are not too badly hurt.
Have a read of this thread.
Do not underestimate how much of an effect a broken thumb will have. I got hit by a car door whilst passing between two lanes and broke a finger amongst other things. It took several months to get anything like normal movement back and I had to go for a lot of physio to keep the hand moving.
If he is talking about damages I would take some advice. When you realise how much grief a hand injury is you may wish you'd made a claim.
Hope you heal fast, good luck.

markhewitt1978

First thing is DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES "sort any damage out between ourselves", this is always the worst course of action. Every single time I've had this happen or heard of it happen the driver changes their mind or their story when they learn what the cost is going to be.

You need to go through their insurance company. Assuming you have the details you need to phone up and make a claim for your bike. I know you probably won't like the idea of it, but you're due a personal injury payout for your injuries, that you'll only get through going through their insurance company.

For the bike - get a quote from your LBS, a reasonable one. You're also entitled to any out of pocket expenses, if for example you had to get the bus while your bike is off the road.

wishitwasallflat

If it was just bike damage I would just establish the costs involved *quote from trused LBS is simplest) and claim myself direct from the driver's insurance - Ive done that myself and it was pretty painless once I had the drivers insurance details - BUT - as you have personal injuries you can use a legal claims firm. Leigh Day were reccomended to me and I found them very helpful. Legal Claims firms will take your claim as they can recover their costs so why bother with the hassle yourself? If they are good they may get you more compensation than you could have got yourself.

PS - I dont believe in or endorse our insane claim culture but if you have a genuine claim I believe you should get all you can in compensation so use an expert to get you that.

veronese68

wishitwasallflat wrote:

PS - I dont believe in or endorse our insane claim culture but if you have a genuine claim I believe you should get all you can in compensation so use an expert to get you that.

I completely agree. Hence my comment that I suspect a broken thumb may be a lot more inconvenience than the OP realises. I spent a few hundred pounds that I wouldn't have had to on public transport as I couldn't ride or drive for a few months. Never mind the inconvenience and the grief I had to put my wife through.
Leigh Day dealt with my case and were excellent. At the end they were keen to push for more but I told them I was more than satisfied and I didn't think it was worth any more.

cougie

Friends of mine have used these guys before with good results - http://www.bikeline.co.uk/

As above - dont try and sort it yourself - you don't know what you're doing and you'll likely get screwed over.

Heal well.

timothyw

I wish you a speedy and successful recovery, although must point out the elephant in the room - undertaking/filtering on the left is a pretty bad idea at the best of times, but when a left turn is available it becomes flat out suicidal (particularly if you bring a HGV or tipper truck into the equation).

I don't suppose you were on a cyclepath at the time (that would be a pretty big mitigating circumstance and certainly shift the blame onto the driver)?

macleod113

Absolutely lesson learnt about that particular junction now. always expect the unexpected. i believe filtering is a common practice these days but i guess more cautious judgement from me will be used in future. im my defence i was lit up like a xmas tree with 2 high power dipped lights and 4 individual led type silicone lights. the driver, had he indicated before the manoever would have been spotted and easily avoided. thankfully we weren't going at high speed.
no cycle lane but there was plenty of room for me to filter ( i did pass a few cars before being struck as the cars were just starting up from a red light at a ped crossing, hence i was going faster)

Pross

Filtering is normal but down the left it shouldn't be. Very few drivers check their left side before turning as they just don't expect anyone to be there. It's obviously still their fault but you are the vulnerable party. Hope you recover quickly.

navrig2

Worth reading this as a start:

http://www.cyclelaw.co.uk/overtaking-an ... st-cycling

Perhaps the most important advice for cyclists contemplating filtering through traffic is to avoid doing so on the approach to a junction. This advice is echoed in Rule 167 of the Highway Code: ‘Do not overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example, approaching or at a road junction on either side of the road’. Obviously the risk of doing so is that a car ahead may turn into a side road without warning, leaving the cyclist with inadequate time to brake or change direction.

navrig2

By the way I broke my thumb a few years ago after falling off my bike.

They pinned the bones together and fitted a cast to hold it all in place. Once the pins were pulled it was simply a case of getting back to normal. I found that you use your thumbs so much that they are sufficiently exercised that I didn't need physio.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tv-gy10swsE

4 years later no issues.

bernithebiker

I broke my toe in a motorbike accident when I was a student.

Filtering down the right of stationary traffic a young chappie in a Golf GTI decides to do a violent U-turn as I was alongside.

Bike was pretty much OK, and at the time I didn't realise my toe was broken, so we 'agreed to sort it out amongst ourselves.'

He came round with £50 the next day. But by then I'd changed my mind, as I was on crutches and the bike did in fact need a few hundred spent on it.

Long story short, I made a claim, and 2 years later, just as I was stone broke and finishing uni, I got a cheque for £5000.

smoggysteve

Im sorry to hear about your accident but from what you say it sound like the driver has done nothing wrong. If you were travelling faster and on his left hand blind spot I think you have to take some responsibility for your actions here. Being a more vulnerable road user you should never assume the vehicle in front has seen you.

Hope the thumb heals soon

cougie

SmoggySteve wrote:

Im sorry to hear about your accident but from what you say it sound like the driver has done nothing wrong. If you were travelling faster and on his left hand blind spot I think you have to take some responsibility for your actions here. Being a more vulnerable road user you should never assume the vehicle in front has seen you.

Hope the thumb heals soon

Mirror
Signal
Manoeuvre

Clearly the driver didnt use his mirror - if the OP was in his blindspot then he was right alongside him - so he was turning too fast after indicating.

The OP might share some blame - always expect this kind of behaviour - but it was the car that hit the bike - not the other way round.

smoggysteve

cougie wrote:

SmoggySteve wrote:

Im sorry to hear about your accident but from what you say it sound like the driver has done nothing wrong. If you were travelling faster and on his left hand blind spot I think you have to take some responsibility for your actions here. Being a more vulnerable road user you should never assume the vehicle in front has seen you.

Hope the thumb heals soon

Mirror
Signal
Manoeuvre

Clearly the driver didnt use his mirror - if the OP was in his blindspot then he was right alongside him - so he was turning too fast after indicating.

The OP might share some blame - always expect this kind of behaviour - but it was the car that hit the bike - not the other way round.

If I was approaching a junction and the car in front was moving obviously slower than normal I would slow down and certainly not move along side on the blind side. Your putting yourself in a difficult position to try and call tje driver culpable. Maybe the driver was late indicating but as you say its to be expected. If its a 50/50 incident then fair enough. You pick yourself up and move on but I thimk it would be a difficult to get a successful claim out of the drivers insurance as some suggest trying

veronese68

Read the original post again. The driver is already talking about damages, hence my saying the OP should take some advice. Whilst the cyclist should take care the driver is the one that moved out of the lane without checking it was safe to do so. He is the one that is more at fault.

jgsi

Veronese68 wrote:

Read the original post again. The driver is already talking about damages, hence my saying the OP should take some advice. Whilst the cyclist should take care the driver is the one that moved out of the lane without checking it was safe to do so. He is the one that is more at fault.

Yes, important point... if it comes to a 'counter' claim then without BC/CTC.. membership that gives you 3rd party cover.. an ambulance chaser company may leave you in the lurch... but howevr, as someone kindly pointed out in another thread.. your home insurers may be the answer in any devious move by the driver.

smoggysteve

I agree the OP should take advice. Im not on about that. Im on about the OP mentioning going to their LBS and letting the driver know. Not sure the driver will be that interested myself when they want damage to the car paid for. If the OP was in a motor vehicle and hit the side or rear of another car in the balance of probability the law woukd go with the rear vehicle being at fault no matter how fast, slow early or late indicating or how hard they braked in the event of a rear end shunt.

merkin

I hope your thumb heals up as quickly and painlessly as possible but more importantly I hope the bike turns out to be ok.
However I can't help but feel that, given what I understand of what happened, you do bear some (but not all) responsibility for this accident.
You say it happened on your way home and you passed a few cars before being struck. If it was dark and those cars had their headlights on it could be that the car driver did look but did not see you due to the following cars brighter headlights. Obviously had he been indicating in good time it may never have happened but I always try to be aware of being in other vehicles blind spots.

diy

If I read this correctly the cyclist was behind the car and passed on the inside at a junction following a change in the lights where the cyclist was quicker off the mark and passed on the inside without considering the risk of the vehicle turning without indicating (assuming he wasn't in a left only lane) On the other hand the driver should have checked his inside before turning at the junction.

I think this is 50/50 at best, particularly if the car was always ahead of the cycle. Obviously get proper advice, but read the following too:
http://swarb.co.uk/clenshaw-v-tanner-an ... -nov-2002/

The earlier case of the U-turning-GTI is a different situation. No junction, no expecation of a turning vehicle. Just setting expectations.

What happens next. His insurers chase you you find someone to chase him - they agree who pays what.

Pituophis

I also hope the OP gets over his injury, and gets back out on his bike as soon as possible.
I don't think this will go down too well, but I can't help think that the OP was undertaking a car that was trying to turn left. I hope I am wrong, but I don't think the lack of indication will carry much weight in the circumstances. If he were in a car we would no doubt agree that he was a "bloody maniac", but as we are all used to dodging idiot drivers on a daily basis, we tend to think it must be the drivers fault. I'm not sure it was.
We get that many warnings about undertaking that I don't do it myself, but see many more do it than not. I expect my accident on a roundabout instead. :shock:
This thread did at least get me to finally join British Cycling though, just to be a bit more prepared.

diy

Its stupidly cheap when you think about the cover you get.

veronese68

diy wrote:

Its stupidly cheap when you think about the cover you get.

Very much so. I went for a family membership as the Mrs rides to the station and the boy rides to school, unfortunately the girl doesn't cycle much but I hope that will change. We are all covered for something like £44 a year. Why wouldn't you?

navrig2

I tend to agree that the OP must take some of the blame which is why I posted a link to a discussion on the Highway Code.

I suspect that the OP will get little in the way of a settlement if he pursues it.

macleod113

Thank you all for your comments. im not in this to fill my pockets i just want to ensure that i take the correct advise and cover my ass in case the driver gets funny and starts asking for money.
in my opinion its the drivers fault for not indicating but yes i must accept some responsibility for not anticipating such a manoever. i am worried about being so defensive in future and if i slow down in such a way at each set of lights it will take me 2 hours to cycle home :-) of course i need to be more careful, i'm not daft. my only gripe is the driver who was stopped at the lights not far from the left turn could have indicated but didnt making me believe that he was going straight not left.
we live and learn and this incident is just fuel on the fire for the other half to try and get me to stop commuting by bike :-s

bernithebiker

You only have to ride in London for 5 minutes to see that cyclists filter down the left and right hand side of traffic all the time.

Cars can turn left or right or simply pull over to the left.

To my mind, if they do that then they are obliged to Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre.

They are driving over a tonne of steel, surely they should be obliged to be careful how they do so?

cougie

I'd think that any settlement may be negotiated down - they both share the blame - but the driver is the person who wasn't looking where he was going at the end of the day - it doesn't give him carte blanche to do stupid moves.

smoggysteve

cougie wrote:

I'd think that any settlement may be negotiated down - they both share the blame - but the driver is the person who wasn't looking where he was going at the end of the day - it doesn't give him carte blanche to do stupid moves.

Stupid moves? Like trying to filter on the left hand side behind a vehicle thats moving slowly on the approach to a junction? You mean that kind of stupid?

dinyull

To filter/undertake in moving traffic at a junction/turn off is risky business, especially when it's pitch black no matter how well your lit up. As someone pointed out earlier, a cyclist is easily lost in headlights looking in mirror sat in traffic - as soon as this is pointed out any claim/counter claim will be dismissed.

Not filtering might make your commute 2 hours long, but getting home safe has to be the priority.

veronese68

Whilst I completely agree that filtering down the left can be dangerous, so I tend not to, it is also quite a common occurrence so the driver should have been looking out for it. As the OP says he was lit up like a Christmas tree so had the driver looked properly he would have seen him. The driver moved out of his lane and should have looked properly. Making a manoeuvre without looking is definitely the more stupid move that took place in this incident.

bernithebiker

SmoggySteve wrote:

cougie wrote:

I'd think that any settlement may be negotiated down - they both share the blame - but the driver is the person who wasn't looking where he was going at the end of the day - it doesn't give him carte blanche to do stupid moves.

Stupid moves? Like trying to filter on the left hand side behind a vehicle thats moving slowly on the approach to a junction? You mean that kind of stupid?

It's a stupid move if he doesn't look behind, check it's clear, then indicate.

What if an HGV had been steaming up the inside?