TDF2015. Time for a Rouleur's Tour

calvjones

I'm bored of all this Nibs v Quintana v Froome(dog) v Bertie talk. Yet again the Tour is well over before Week 3 and I'm already circling Het Volk in the diary. How about for 2015 route:

- No HC climbs.
- No MTF longer then 5k
- Max 30km of ITT, and a similar length TTT
- A few cobbles if you like
- Bring back win bonifications - 30s / 15s or maybe even 60s / 30s / 15s. And some seconds for intermediate too.

That would open the field of potential winners from half a dozen to a couple of dozen. The Tour would be able to go places it never usually would.I have absolutely no idea who would win it.

Does anyone have Christian's number?

Crozza

yes, but I'm not giving it to you, you loon

RichN95.

So basically you want to make it like the Green Jersey which was well over before the end of week one.

calvjones

RichN95 wrote:

So basically you want to make it like the Green Jersey which was well over before the end of week one.

Not at all. Green Jersey has no time element, no?.

above_the_cows

This would be the Sagan, Gerrans, Kwiatkowski Tour.

ugo.santalucia

That's called the Tour of Britain...

above_the_cows

ugo.santalucia wrote:

That's called the Tour of Britain...

Ha ha ha ha!

I must say if they did this I might for once be able to do the Etape without being sick on myself at some point.

calvjones

Above The Cows wrote:

This would be the Sagan, Gerrans, Kwiatkowski Tour.

Well the live TV Wheelie quotient would increase: can that be a bad thing?







Oh.

pinno

The tour organisers should take a leaf out of the Giro book. I think there was 9 different wearers of the Pink Jersey this year and I enjoy the Giro more than the Tdf. It is less predictable. I guess it is not Nibali's fault that Froome and Contador are out.
Also, Nibali looks too comfortable with too much to spare and I am now suspicious.
Hopefully next year will be a Froome/Nibali/Contador/Quintana affair?

ugo.santalucia

pinarello001 wrote:

Also, Nibali looks too comfortable with too much to spare and I am now suspicious.

Yeasterday he did a time trial up Hautacam and only gained one minute over just-above-average contenders (over the last 5 Km didn't gain anything)... in the days someone like Pantani used to put minutes into top contenders... so I wouldn't say Nibali performance was OTT

pinno

ugo.santalucia wrote:

pinarello001 wrote:

Also, Nibali looks too comfortable with too much to spare and I am now suspicious.

Yeasterday he did a time trial up Hautacam and only gained one minute over just-above-average contenders (over the last 5 Km didn't gain anything)... in the days someone like Pantani used to put minutes into top contenders... so I wouldn't say Nibali performance was OTT

No, I didn't say OTT - have you seen him actually break sweat? and Pantani was a pure climber.

No_Ta_Doctor

pinarello001 wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

pinarello001 wrote:

Also, Nibali looks too comfortable with too much to spare and I am now suspicious.

Yeasterday he did a time trial up Hautacam and only gained one minute over just-above-average contenders (over the last 5 Km didn't gain anything)... in the days someone like Pantani used to put minutes into top contenders... so I wouldn't say Nibali performance was OTT

No, I didn't say OTT - have you seen him actually break sweat? and Pantani was a pure climber.

There was sod all pure about Pantani.

above_the_cows

No tA Doctor wrote:

pinarello001 wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

pinarello001 wrote:

Also, Nibali looks too comfortable with too much to spare and I am now suspicious.

Yeasterday he did a time trial up Hautacam and only gained one minute over just-above-average contenders (over the last 5 Km didn't gain anything)... in the days someone like Pantani used to put minutes into top contenders... so I wouldn't say Nibali performance was OTT

No, I didn't say OTT - have you seen him actually break sweat? and Pantani was a pure climber.

There was sod all pure about Pantani.

Not even the stuff he put up his nose.

RichN95.

pinarello001 wrote:

The tour organisers should take a leaf out of the Giro book. I think there was 9 different wearers of the Pink Jersey this year and I enjoy the Giro more than the Tdf. It is less predictable.

The geography of Italy is considerably different to France though. It's basically a volcanic ridge, while France is mostly flat.

FJS

Paris-Nice this year went more or less down that route.

DeadCalm

Above The Cows wrote:

This would be the Sagan, Gerrans, Kwiatkowski Tour.

And why not?

But actually, it would be way more complex and tactical than that. With a carefully designed parcours, the number of possible winners would be vastly increased, and so the effort required to keep the break in check throughout the entire three weeks would be immense and certainly beyond the team that Cannondale would be able to put out. I think tactically it would be fascinating and would potentially make for some incredibly exciting racing.

OPQS

I'm all in favour of anything that keeps the race open. This is the 3rd procession Tour we've had in a row. Boring from a GC perspective.

RichN95.

OPQS wrote:

I'm all in favour of anything that keeps the race open. This is the 3rd procession Tour we've had in a row. Boring from a GC perspective.

If you want an open race just disqualify the top five riders with the bookies after stage 1. The nature of the race is that the strongest usually wins. And it's unusual for strength to be evenly matched at the peak of GC.

In reality there have been frequently periods of domination by riders - Anquetil, Merckx, Hinault, LeMond (ish), Indurain, Armstrong. But this year we will have our seventh consecutive different winner - and that hasn't happened since the 30s. This is as open as it gets.

above_the_cows

DeadCalm wrote:

Above The Cows wrote:

This would be the Sagan, Gerrans, Kwiatkowski Tour.

And why not?

But actually, it would be way more complex and tactical than that. With a carefully designed parcours, the number of possible winners would be vastly increased, and so the effort required to keep the break in check throughout the entire three weeks would be immense and certainly beyond the team that Cannondale would be able to put out. I think tactically it would be fascinating and would potentially make for some incredibly exciting racing.

Or some incredibly boring racing as no one would be able to control anything and so teams just ride to survive and effectively neutralise every stage. It would be like asking them to do a classic every day, but you won't get the excitement of the classics because people can't race like its a classic every day.

We have various one week chipper races for rouleurs, Tour Down Under, Tour of Britain and the Tour of The Benelux Road Furniture. A GT should be a little different in my opinion.

DeVlaeminck

I'd like to see more challenging non mountain stages,similar to the Sheffield stage or the cobbles They are heading for Brittany next year so the potential for a lumpy first week is there. That seems to be the way they are going in recent years, not so scared of gaps on GC early on and long may it continue.

Coachb

I would like to see one huge Muthur fudging stage. Something like going over 10 mountains. They would have to start first light. Next day would be a rest day

I would also like to see a mountain ITT were 2 riders go at the same time. It would be great to see for instance Froome and Nibs racing side by side up the d' Huez.

These are the best ideas ever...

Mad_Malx

Am I the only one who has enjoyed this years?
GC sown up too early, but that wasn't Nibali's fault.

Individually, almost every stage has been a good contest, far more than usual.

RichN95.

There should be a hilly stage, but no-one is told how long it is. They just know there's a 300km potential route and that someone will be there with a portable finish line and checkered flag somewhere after 80km

RichN95.

Mad_Malx wrote:

Am I the only one who has enjoyed this years?
GC sown up too early, but that wasn't Nibali's fault.

Nibali deserves massive credit. He could have just sat in wheels from the moment Contador crashed out and he hasn't.

mididoctors

Mad_Malx wrote:

Am I the only one who has enjoyed this years?
GC sown up too early, but that wasn't Nibali's fault.

Individually, almost every stage has been a good contest, far more than usual.

I think its been a great watch, i have followed the tour in RL and on media since 87

Mad_Malx

RichN95 wrote:

Mad_Malx wrote:

Am I the only one who has enjoyed this years?
GC sown up too early, but that wasn't Nibali's fault.

Nibali deserves massive credit. He could have just sat in wheels from the moment Contador crashed out and he hasn't.

Absolutely.

davidof

RichN95 wrote:

In reality there have been frequently periods of domination by riders - Anquetil, Merckx, Hinault, LeMond (ish), Indurain

oh my gawd Indurain, now that was boring, huge spaniard on huge gears grinding away up the grand cols. At least Armstrong was a bit mad with all his fratboy staring out other riders before he launched some wacky doped fueled attack to take 10 minutes over a small climb.

RichN95.

davidof wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

In reality there have been frequently periods of domination by riders - Anquetil, Merckx, Hinault, LeMond (ish), Indurain

oh my gawd Indurain, now that was boring, huge spaniard on huge gears grinding away up the grand cols. At least Armstrong was a bit mad with all his fratboy staring out other riders before he launched some wacky doped fueled attack to take 10 minutes over a small climb.

Armstrong may have been high as a kite, but there was some panache and tactical progression there at least. (Althought he 60k TTTs didn't help matters). With Indurain it was 'I've beaten you climbers six minutes or more in a 50k TT, what are you going to do about it?".

I would though say that I have seen many top sportsmen close up, but Indurain was the one that looked like a Greek god to me.

FJS

DeVlaeminck wrote:

I'd like to see more challenging non mountain stages,similar to the Sheffield stage or the cobbles They are heading for Brittany next year so the potential for a lumpy first week is there. That seems to be the way they are going in recent years, not so scared of gaps on GC early on and long may it continue.

Dont forget the wind. Stge 2 next year will finish in Zeeland, echelons guaranteed

knedlicky

FJS wrote:

DeVlaeminck wrote:

I'd like to see more challenging non mountain stages,similar to the Sheffield stage or the cobbles They are heading for Brittany next year so the potential for a lumpy first week is there. That seems to be the way they are going in recent years, not so scared of gaps on GC early on and long may it continue.

Dont forget the wind. Stge 2 next year will finish in Zeeland, echelons guaranteed

Zeeland = Stage 1, I think, stage starting in Utrecht (after prologue there the day before).

Stage 2 supposedly begins in Antwerp, which might allow including a few of the easier cobbled roads, like those in the Scheldepreis.

(AdH next year too)

The_Boy

I seem to remember reading a story in some cycling mag or another which quoted a threat from Proudhomme to design a race with 21 middle mountain stages. I'd totally pay to watch that.