Is it FTP I need to focus on?

supermurph09

Hi

Apologies if asked before but the forum search doesnt seem to work.

Having done my first FTP test last week, I now know where I am at and what my power zones are etc, my FTP is 246. (I'm 6ft, 74KG if that makes any difference). As I only have limited time to train/ride I need to be clear what to focus on now I have my power meter to assist me and can do 2 midweek sessions, 2 hours each, 3 hour ride on a weekend.

Focus is on hill climbing, short and steep (under 0.5 miles 10%+) and medium to long (1 to 2 miles 5-10% average). But essentially hard efforts ranging from 2 minutes to 15 minutes.

My FTP obviously relates to the power I can hold for one hour, but my objectives relate to shorter times than that. Can someone clarify that if I just work on my FTP that the power I can hold for say 2min, 5min or 15min will increase in line with that so it is increasing my FTP that I purely need to focus on?

eddiefiola

Brand new to power so just thinking outloud with no real knowledge or experience.

But wouldn't it be VO2 max, as in the zone, that you need to work on? I guess FTP will increase but it's the higher Power Zone that you're trying to train, was looking at TP plans myself but noticed they have http://home.trainingpeaks.com/products/ ... ower-based which seems to start with more intense bursts?

supermurph09

Eddie, I'll take a look at the link but the VO2 max training was what I was thinking too. Hopefully the great and the good will come along to help us shortly....

Escher303

I'd work on both FTP and VO2 max. 2 x 20's, 3 x 10's and similar for FTP and various 5 x VO2 intervals or hill repeats or something of the right length. Do you want to train only on the road? Or will you use a turbo? A combination of both will see better gains IMO if you are short on time.

For example two turbo sessions a week - one VO2 max, one FTP, plus some road riding, mostly recovery pace plus a 3-4 hour tempo ride at the weekend will see you make good gains (assuming that you aren't at the top of your potential fitness), that's assuming you have a good base.

But you could also do a hill repeat session one day, 2 x 20's on the road on another then some recovery pace rides and a longer ride at the weekend. Will add up to the same thing really but will take more time than including some turbo sessions.

I have used the training plans from Flamme Rouge to good affect until learnt how to design my own. They will give you the structure to achieve progressive overload, they are quite cheap but very good and you won't go to far wrong with either of these http://www.flammerouge.je/wwpp/manualftp.htm http://www.flammerouge.je/wwpp/manualvo2.htm or one of the other plans if they suit you better. There's loads of useful information on that site too.

supermurph09

madasahattersley wrote:

2-15 minutes is a very broad range. 2 minutes is primarily anaerobic so you might want to concentrate on (dare I say it) leg strength and development of fast twitch muscle fibres. 15 minutes is mostly aerobic, on the complete other end of the spectrum, in which case yeah you want to focus on increasing your FTP.

Are we talking about hill climb TTs?

Thanks for the reply, yes we are talking about hill climb TT's.

supermurph09

Escher303 wrote:

I'd work on both FTP and VO2 max. 2 x 20's, 3 x 10's and similar for FTP and various 5 x VO2 intervals or hill repeats or something of the right length. Do you want to train only on the road? Or will you use a turbo? A combination of both will see better gains IMO if you are short on time.

For example two turbo sessions a week - one VO2 max, one FTP, plus some road riding, mostly recovery pace plus a 3-4 hour tempo ride at the weekend will see you make good gains (assuming that you aren't at the top of your potential fitness), that's assuming you have a good base.

But you could also do a hill repeat session one day, 2 x 20's on the road on another then some recovery pace rides and a longer ride at the weekend. Will add up to the same thing really but will take more time than including some turbo sessions.

I have used the training plans from Flamme Rouge to good affect until learnt how to design my own. They will give you the structure to achieve progressive overload, they are quite cheap but very good and you won't go to far wrong with either of these http://www.flammerouge.je/wwpp/manualftp.htm http://www.flammerouge.je/wwpp/manualvo2.htm or one of the other plans if they suit you better. There's loads of useful information on that site too.

Thanks for the detailed reply, I have a Tacx Flow, but would prefer to do my intervals / hill repeats outside. For 2 x 20s the turbo would be better because I could keep things constant (ie not changes in gradient to worry about). I'll take a look at the flamme rouge stuff.

RChung

Supermurph09 wrote:

I have a Tacx Flow

My Flow was inaccurate but consistent in trainer mode but inaccurate and pervesely maddeningly unusably consistent in ergo mode.

Sounds like you could be interested in functional reserve capacity analysis, which tells you how your power declines with duration. However, it may require pretty high data quality since it needs to be accurate over a wide range of power, not just at or around FTP.

supermurph09

Hi, I don't use the Tacx to look at power, I have a Stages PM. I have access to my power curve so I can see how it drops off. As an example my 2 minute power from the limited data I have recorded is 400W, I'd hope this is one area I can improve on and track my progress.

RChung

I hope you can, too.

Alex_Simmons/RST

madasahattersley wrote:

2-15 minutes is a very broad range. 2 minutes is primarily anaerobic so you might want to concentrate on (dare I say it) leg strength and development of fast twitch muscle fibres. 15 minutes is mostly aerobic, on the complete other end of the spectrum, in which case yeah you want to focus on increasing your FTP.

Are we talking about hill climb TTs?

Even a maximal 2-minute effort is 60+% fuelled by aerobic energy metabolism.

Not sure how long the OP is required to ride before getting to such hills, but fitness required to arrive fresh to attack is another consideration.

Training that improves FTP and Maximal Aerobic Power (which is many and varied forms of training across a range of intensities and durations) will pretty much support an improvement for most power durations longer than a around minute, even then aerobic condition matters a lot, even for sprinters aerobic condition has a big effect on recovery ability / repeatability.

However as always specificity is important, so a focus on training at times that specifically replicates the demands of goal events is also important. However you need to be judicious in dosing out high intensity work.

supermurph09

Alex, thanks for your comments,

"Training that improves FTP and Maximal Aerobic Power (which is many and varied forms of training across a range of intensities and durations) will pretty much support an improvement for most power durations longer than a around minute",

This pretty much sums up what I needed to know, now just need to workout how best to go about things. Thank you.