Help me stop loathing climbs.

gazman428

Has anyone else had this issue? I really cannot stand climbs on a road bike, but this seems strange as I've been a mountain biker for the last 20 yrs and I still don't mind climbing on them. Even my 30 odd pound 6 inch travel bike with its 1x10 gearing doesn't bother me.

But as soon as I hit a hill on my carbon road bike I want to turn around. If I'm on my own I plan routes to avoid hills were possible, I don't know if it the gearing (11-25 with compact chainrings) or if it is the fact I'm never comfortable climbing on it.
Any ideas

drlodge

Try lower gears..any hill is easy as long as you have a gear low enough. A 12-28 cassette should be cheap enough, quick to fit and help you out on the steeper sections.

Anonymous

How steep are the hills?

Not sure gearing is the answer.
No harm in putting a bigger cassette on but that might just lesson the pain rather than solve the problem.

I think you just need to add in a few small hills and learn to conquer/enjoy them.
Either short sharp one or longer drags.
You will hopefully start to enjoy the achievement and look for bigger challenges ;-)
If you do not go up, you cannot come down :-)

Hills are a third power, a third technic and a third mental attitude IMO.

You need a cassette that has the range of gears you need on any given ride.
If you are loathing/avoiding hills I don't see how you know what that range is yet.

ai_1

Could it be that you feel you should be going faster when you're on your road bike so you either push too hard or get frustrated?
I think most beginners hate hills until they learn not to push too hard at the bottom. I know I was like that when I started and occasionally when I haven't been in the hills for a while I still revert to that tendency. I'm not suggesting you're a beginner, just that maybe because you switch between MTB and road, you associate your road bike with speed so you get frustrated when you have to slow down on the hills? Just a theory!

drlodge

and lower gears will make you faster :shock:

DiscoBoy

They aren't going to get easier if you keep avoiding them.

drlodge

Can you clarify - what can't you stand? Is it your legs giving out, or your lungs, or your mind?

If (1) try lower gears
If (2) go more slowly
If (3) just HTFU (rule #5) and repeat a lot.

markhewitt1978

Initially I found standing next to impossible, but as my fitness has improved then I don't mind it any more - at least it doesn't knacker me for the next 20 minutes like it used to!

It depends on the slope of the hill in general you should be aiming to be putting out the same power on the climb as you do on the flat but gearing means you'll be going slower.

kajjal

Break the hill into sections and learn the gears, effort and techniques needed to get up more efficiently. Fitness is only part of it.

If you run out of gears get a lower geared cassette like 12-28 or 12-30, 11-25 is for fitter riders or where it is less hilly.

Bozman

I used to have a major problem needles, then a few years back I ended up in hospital and probably had 20 injections over a couple of days, needless to say needles don't bother me anymore.

Daz555

I have the same problem - on some days, not all. MTB climbs can be tougher in places but where they get hard they often get technical - your concentration makes you forget the climb as you focus on maintaining traction and picking the right line. Road climbing can at times feel like nothing but relentless pain with no distractions.

So have a think about whether the pain is the problem, or the boredom.

The good news is that going down the other side is as much fun in either sport!

markhewitt1978

A lot of climbing is mental, you can get mentally defeated by a hill before you even start the climb.

florerider

Are you running out of gears or is it any climb?

defride

Also a recent convert from 20 yrs+ on an mtb and I'm the complete opposite, it's the descents on the mtb but the climbs on the road bike. I'm on a compact c/set and the road bike came with a 12/30 cassette which I've since swapped out for a 11/28, I noticed the difference when I dropped down but it's probably helped in the longer run. I'm no racer but I've hit a couple of KOM's on lesser known routes and am pretty consistently near the front page on most climbs that I've had a pop at. I'd struggle to get up some of the steepest around here if I ran a 39/25 lowest gear and find 34/25 tough when it hit's 20%+, I do use 34/28 particularly on a longer ride if I want to just spin up comfortably. Would recommend putting a cassette with a 28 or 30 on and if you're not using one already try a compact c/set and then have another go. Best of luck

StillGoing

I used to hate hills and tried to avoid them. At the time I was overweight by a long way, but didn't realise how much difference weight made when you're trying to carry it up hill. I was constantly seeking another gear at the back of the cassette and when there wasn't one, was left puffing and panting out my backside until I hit the top. This year I've lost a chunk of weight and found that getting up hills is infinitely easier. So much so I'm in the middle of the cassette with plenty of gears to spare. To emphasise how much effect weight has, I put 7lbs on when I couldn't get out cycling and didn't reduce my food intake. Hitting the same hills again I found myself at the back of the cassette again. When my youngest daughter was born a week ago today, she weighed just over 8lbs and holding her for an hour made me realise just how heavy that weight is. Get the weight down and the hills become easier.

gazman428

Ai_1 wrote:

Could it be that you feel you should be going faster when you're on your road bike so you either push too hard or get frustrated?
I think most beginners hate hills until they learn not to push too hard at the bottom. I know I was like that when I started and occasionally when I haven't been in the hills for a while I still revert to that tendency. I'm not suggesting you're a beginner, just that maybe because you switch between MTB and road, you associate your road bike with speed so you get frustrated when you have to slow down on the hills? Just a theory!

I think you have just hit the nail on the head.....
I ride hills on the way to work and until recently I had the KOM s on them.

I find I hit them and just start suffering and work my way down into the btm gear, eventually I start struggling, then I have to stand. But after 20 ft or so I'm sat down again and completely knackered.
Maybe some lower gears and a slower pace will help. I tried hitting one of the worst local ones again tonight at a slow pace, and although my heart rate was lower my legs still gave out.

I guess the distraction offroad must help, plus I never stand offroad till I'm virtually cresting the summit.

gazman428

philthy3 wrote:

I used to hate hills and tried to avoid them. At the time I was overweight by a long way, but didn't realise how much difference weight made when you're trying to carry it up hill. I was constantly seeking another gear at the back of the cassette and when there wasn't one, was left puffing and panting out my backside until I hit the top. This year I've lost a chunk of weight and found that getting up hills is infinitely easier. So much so I'm in the middle of the cassette with plenty of gears to spare. To emphasise how much effect weight has, I put 7lbs on when I couldn't get out cycling and didn't reduce my food intake. Hitting the same hills again I found myself at the back of the cassette again. When my youngest daughter was born a week ago today, she weighed just over 8lbs and holding her for an hour made me realise just how heavy that weight is. Get the weight down and the hills become easier.

also a bug part of the problem I think. I'm 15 stone, given my build I could probably drop down to 13 and 1/2 stone if I really tried.

pippi_langsamer-2

I'd find the hilliest circuit you can and do it lots

Start with just riding up it comfortably without pushing yourself- enjoy the scenery and look around a bit

Initialised

I suggest you sign up for Hell of Hexham 100 miles of Pennines with 10000ft of climbing, see you there August 9th?

Seriously though, what got me liking hills was a daily struggle to break 50mph on the way back down. I'd alternate the climbing between sticking to the big ring and grinding my way up the hill and down the gears. The next day I'd try to keep the cadence in the 80s all the way up. Over time it became more about the climb and less about the descent.

Weight loss also helps, I was ~16 stone when I started taking on that hill most days I'm around 13 stone now

To get over the mental side you stare at the tarmac right in front of you and just keep spinning, don't look at how much hill is left. I know this may not feel natural for an MTBer used to looking as far down the trail as possible.

I'm still a terribly slow climber by roadie standards and I run an 32T cassette and a 50/34T compact.

With a health measure of gravity assisted resistance training you will lose weight and get faster.

Silly Old Hector

markhewitt1978 wrote:

A lot of climbing is mental.

I agree

daxplusplus

I don't know how many miles you've done but I think for a lot of people appreciating hills is a journey.

You start off not really liking them .. I mean it's hard work and it's so much easier to just ride around on flat or undulating roads instead. Then, as your experience and mileage racks up, you slowly begin to realise that actually they are what make most rides memorable - the feeling of achievement, the b@stard steep bits,the improved times, blowing up, the different tactics to get up em. It all adds up to interest and extra dimension to rides.

Riding fast on the flat might seem great but god, after a few thousand miles, it would be boring not having any hills.

Sometimes it just takes a while to realise this.

(get a bigger cassette, see what happens to your cadence, try spinning up the hills and vary it ..and just practise doing hills .. in fact bigger the better)

ai_1

gazman428 wrote:

Ai_1 wrote:

Could it be that you feel you should be going faster when you're on your road bike so you either push too hard or get frustrated?
I think most beginners hate hills until they learn not to push too hard at the bottom. I know I was like that when I started and occasionally when I haven't been in the hills for a while I still revert to that tendency. I'm not suggesting you're a beginner, just that maybe because you switch between MTB and road, you associate your road bike with speed so you get frustrated when you have to slow down on the hills? Just a theory!

I think you have just hit the nail on the head.....
I ride hills on the way to work and until recently I had the KOM s on them.

I find I hit them and just start suffering and work my way down into the btm gear, eventually I start struggling, then I have to stand. But after 20 ft or so I'm sat down again and completely knackered.
Maybe some lower gears and a slower pace will help. I tried hitting one of the worst local ones again tonight at a slow pace, and although my heart rate was lower my legs still gave out.

I guess the distraction offroad must help, plus I never stand offroad till I'm virtually cresting the summit.

It definitely sounds to me like you're just pushing too hard on the hills. Instead of working your way down to the bottom gear as you tire, just get into an easier gear at the start of the hill. If you still have something in the tank as you approach the top you can always accelerate, if you don't then you were going the right speed already. It's better to finish fast than start fast.

Best thing I ever did to improve my climbing was going up mount Teide in Tenerife. It's a 35km ride from sea level to about 2200m and it climbs every meter of the way. On a climb like that you're under no illusion that you can push harder and get the hill over with in a hurry! You just have to settle in for the long haul and keep turning the pedals. I even had enough left at the top for a sprint to the summit sign!
It demonstrated to me that so long as I pace myself I can keep climbing for over 3hrs non-stop (well okay I stopped a few times to eat and top up water - difficult to eat when you're climbing). I'm still not a strong climber but I'll get over just about anything, I'll just be slow. Forget about the KOMs. If you start enjoying climbing again then you can start thinking about speed but for the moment why not just back off a little at the bottom of the climbs and see what happens.

markhewitt1978

Initialised wrote:

I suggest you sign up for Hell of Hexham 100 miles of Pennines with 10000ft of climbing, see you there August 9th?

I second that notion! I did the shorter route last year and it's an amazing course!

markhewitt1978

Ai_1 wrote:

Best thing I ever did to improve my climbing was going up mount Teide in Tenerife. It's a 35km ride from sea level to about 2200m and it climbs every meter of the way. On a climb like that you're under no illusion that you can push harder and get the hill over with in a hurry! You just have to settle in for the long haul and keep turning the pedals. I even had enough left at the top for a sprint to the summit sign!
It demonstrated to me that so long as I pace myself I can keep climbing for over 3hrs non-stop (well okay I stopped a few times to eat and top up water - difficult to eat when you're climbing). I'm still not a strong climber but I'll get over just about anything, I'll just be slow. Forget about the KOMs. If you start enjoying climbing again then you can start thinking about speed but for the moment why not just back off a little at the bottom of the climbs and see what happens.

Such climbs are very unusual in the UK, for the most part they are sharp effort then you're at the top. Sure you might be climbing for 30-45 minutes but we don't have many 3 hour climbs.

rolf_f

+1 DaxPlusPlus post above.

I actually know exactly when I realised I liked hills - I was on an Evans Sportive, climbing Dacre Bank near Pateley Bridge. I got to the top and thought "Wow, that was alright - I got up that and did a decent job of it and I feel great!" - from then on, hills became a challenge and really an essential part of most rides.

The thing is, a route with big climbs in it gives your mind something to focus on. You can be intimidated by them but once you get to them, they are a challenge and it usually only takes a few minutes to overcome them (it's actually usually the smaller climbs - still tough but they are unexpected and that I find hardest to deal with!). In contrast, I once did a sportive in Notts and it was dull - there were no real climbs and it felt a bit like a pointless out and back. I had no idea where I was and there was nothing to focus my mind.

markhewitt1978 wrote:

Such climbs are very unusual in the UK, for the most part they are sharp effort then you're at the top. Sure you might be climbing for 30-45 minutes but we don't have many 3 hour climbs.

Many? Name one!

markhewitt1978

You can bet your life if I said we didn't have any someone would pipe up with one . Mind you, the way I climb, most of them feel 3 hours +

g00se

Do you have a heart rate monitor? Use that and try to ascertain your lactate threshold heart rate (LTHR) - that's basically the max heart rate you can maintain for a 60 minute TT effort (various ways to find this out without doing 60 minute TT). From this, you can work out your 'sweetspot' which is about 95% of LTHR.

Get used to the feeling of riding between sweetspot and LTHR then take the hills at this effort - keeping an eye on your heart rate monitor to make sure - bearing in mind it may take a little while for your heart rate to run up to and stabilise at this level when you first hit the bottom of the hill (you don't want to push to hard and see your heart rate shoot past threshold and into the red).

If you can keep to the level of effort, you can keep climbing the hill for over an hour. But go over into the red for too long, and it'll end in pain.

ai_1

markhewitt1978 wrote:

Ai_1 wrote:

Best thing I ever did to improve my climbing was going up mount Teide in Tenerife. It's a 35km ride from sea level to about 2200m and it climbs every meter of the way...... .......It demonstrated to me that so long as I pace myself I can keep climbing for over 3hrs non-stop.....

Such climbs are very unusual in the UK, for the most part they are sharp effort then you're at the top. Sure you might be climbing for 30-45 minutes but we don't have many 3 hour climbs.

Agreed, same in Ireland. The longest I can think of that I've done is about 6.5km at 6%-7% gradient so probably not far off 30 mins for me!

My point was that the hills themselves aren't necessarily what we find difficult. Pacing is.
Of course once you get above a certain gradient a hill can be difficult regardless because you've got to work hard just to keep moving forward without slowing so much you fall off! But that doesn't apply to most hills.

Rolf F wrote:

.....The thing is, a route with big climbs in it gives your mind something to focus on. You can be intimidated by them but once you get to them, they are a challenge and it usually only takes a few minutes to overcome them (it's actually usually the smaller climbs - still tough but they are unexpected and that I find hardest to deal with!). In contrast, I once did a sportive in Notts and it was dull - there were no real climbs and it felt a bit like a pointless out and back. I had no idea where I was and there was nothing to focus my mind.....

Agreed, I usually find lots of small hills much harder to deal with, more tiring and less satisfying than a big climb - especially on a long ride. You can spend hours on a sportive anticipating and even fearing a big climb but that makes it all the more satisfying when you get over it and as you say, it gives "shape" to the ride.

motogull

Funny thing is, I love climbs despite being rubbish at them. I need to learn to hate them.

gazman428

Yes I do have a HRM, I can hold my HR at 170 for aslong as I want, I can do bursts up to 180 but I then need to back off to recover. I have had it as high as 199 :shock: on a club chain gang but I blew up and could only maintain walking pace for about 10 mins afterwards.

When climbing my pace gets up to around 185 and I just tire. I will try pacing myself better and seeing how I go.
I will ride to work tomorrow and take the hilliest route I can find and report back.

daxplusplus

gazman428 wrote:

I can hold my HR at 170 for as long as I want

Really? If true and not a typo .. bloody youngster