Jumping Red Lights

Paulie W

There is some evidence that complying with traffic lights is dangerous. A TfL study suggests that more women cyclists die on the roads because women are more likely to comply with lights. I cant find a link to the study now.

mattsaw

Paulie W wrote:

There is some evidence that complying with traffic lights is dangerous. A TfL study suggests that more women cyclists die on the roads because women are more likely to comply with lights. I cant find a link to the study now.

I'm sure it's not complying with lights that is dangerous, but rather the manner in which they are being complied with.

iPete

Yes unfortunately more people will get squished waiting around than those 'darwin' risk it all swivel eyed probably ride fixes and listen to metal music loons. Although this is generally down to poor road positioning and or poor road layout.

I believe that you can safely jump some red lights and you can.

I try not to get angry at this, ride with zen and accept people make errors regardless of mode of transport.

If you do everything to the letter of the law, then yes it is very very naughty.

drlodge

Jumping red lights is illegal. It is not always dangerous.

Going through a green light can be dangerous but it is legal. Common sense has to prevail.

vertigo16

Mattsaw wrote:

Paulie W wrote:

There is some evidence that complying with traffic lights is dangerous. A TfL study suggests that more women cyclists die on the roads because women are more likely to comply with lights. I cant find a link to the study now.

I'm sure it's not complying with lights that is dangerous, but rather the manner in which they are being complied with.

Was it this one?

http://www.rudi.net/node/16395

Doesn't look the strongest bit of analysis....

gozzy

Ai_1 wrote:

Gozzy wrote:

To be honest, given the number of car drivers that run red lights, speed and make however many other illegal manouvres, i reckon motorists are on pretty shaky ground to complain about cyclists behaviour. So sod em. Next time a driver calls you out about an rlj, ask them how many amber/reds they've run that day or whether they've stuck to the speed limit. Chances are that the moral high ground will come crumbling down. And they'll want to hit you even more, the dickheads.

See my last post. See yourself in there anywhere? No?

So to re-iterate: The exact argument you've made above is why you should NOT jump red lights.
You say jump lights because some car drivers do stuff. Some car drivers say the very same thing about you. Guess who's NOT solving the problem?

Yes, yes, I do. I see myself as agreeing that all road users are at fault in their own way and we all need to just get along, not have a go at each other. I've long since realised that arguing with motorists is either pointless, or downright dangerous.

The trouble with threads like this is that some people take it so seriously that the temptation to inject a little fun is too high.

chris_bass

I heard that Jimmy Saville used to jump red lights.

just saying!

Joeblack

So, just been out on the bike,

red lights jumped = 1
Dead me = 0
Angered motorists = too hard to tell
Other dead/cyclists cyclists = 0 (as far as I know)
Third world debt risen = 1.5685%
Strava pb's = 0
Chavs shouting abuse from car = 1
Dangerous driving from motorists = 0.5

Out of all those statistics (which I'm sure you'll all be pleased to read) the only one that bothers me is strava

Joeblack

iPete wrote:

Yes unfortunately more people will get squished waiting around than those 'darwin' risk it all swivel eyed probably ride fixes and listen to metal music loons. Although this is generally down to poor road positioning and or poor road layout.

I believe that you can safely jump some red lights and you can.

I try not to get angry at this, ride with zen and accept people make errors regardless of mode of transport.

If you do everything to the letter of the law, then yes it is very very naughty.

+1 everyone makes mistakes regardless of how they travel lets not vilify them because of it.

(I just choose when to make my mistakes ;p )

arran77

Chris Bass wrote:

I heard that Jimmy Saville used to jump red lights.

just saying!

He used to 'jump' a lot of things didn't he

ai_1

Joeblack wrote:

So, just been out on the bike,

red lights jumped = 1
Dead me = 0
Angered motorists = too hard to tell
Other dead/cyclists cyclists = 0 (as far as I know)
Third world debt risen = 1.5685%
Strava pb's = 0
Chavs shouting abuse from car = 1
Dangerous driving from motorists = 0.5

Out of all those statistics (which I'm sure you'll all be pleased to read) the only one that bothers me is strava

All irrelevant nonsense as I'm sure you know.

homers_double

I must admit to rolling slowly through a pedestrian crossing once the pedestrian has crossed and everyone is just idling for green, never a junction though.

Joeblack

Ai_1 wrote:

Joeblack wrote:

So, just been out on the bike,

red lights jumped = 1
Dead me = 0
Angered motorists = too hard to tell
Other dead/cyclists cyclists = 0 (as far as I know)
Third world debt risen = 1.5685%
Strava pb's = 0
Chavs shouting abuse from car = 1
Dangerous driving from motorists = 0.5

Out of all those statistics (which I'm sure you'll all be pleased to read) the only one that bothers me is strava

All irrelevant nonsense as I'm sure you know.

Well..... Jumping red lights doesn't seem to be nonsense to you :roll:

Mikey23

I'm just back from a 35 miler... Red lights encountered = zero. Opportunities to jump red lights therefore is also zero

homers_double

Number of combine 'arvesters avoided?

charlie_potatoes

I'm sure that the OP is full up now after you have all fed him for four pages.
Well done everyone :roll:

Joeblack

homers double wrote:

Number of combine 'arvesters avoided?

Damn!! I knew I'd forgot something

That's another 0!!!

chris_bass

Mikey23 wrote:

I'm just back from a 35 miler... Red lights encountered = zero. Opportunities to jump red lights therefore is also zero

so you didn't stop at a single red light, you make me sick!!! you should have carried on until you came to one just so you could stop!

Paulie W

vertigo16 wrote:

Mattsaw wrote:

Paulie W wrote:

There is some evidence that complying with traffic lights is dangerous. A TfL study suggests that more women cyclists die on the roads because women are more likely to comply with lights. I cant find a link to the study now.

I'm sure it's not complying with lights that is dangerous, but rather the manner in which they are being complied with.

Was it this one?

http://www.rudi.net/node/16395

Doesn't look the strongest bit of analysis....

Yes, that refers to the study I mentioned - not sure the strength of the analysis can be inferred from an article reporting on the report.

It was discussed at length on this site when it came out: viewtopic.php?f=40012&t=12641692. It was about (poor) road positioning but also more generally about cycling infrastructure and the impact these factors together had on outcomes.

sloppyschleckonds

iPete wrote:

If a cyclist runs a red in the early hours of the morning and no one is around to see it, did it ever happen?

Does a bear sh!t in the woods?

Bozman

There are two different worlds here.
If you cycle in a rural area and you come across a T junction with next to squat there, what's the issue? If it does bother you then I'll guess that you always put the toilet seat down and squeeze the toothpaste from the bottom of the tube.
If you cycle through a city or a build up area in busy traffic you're going to get issues.

arran77

SloppySchleckonds wrote:

iPete wrote:

If a cyclist runs a red in the early hours of the morning and no one is around to see it, did it ever happen?

Does a bear sh!t in the woods?

Well if it does but no one is there to see it how do you know it's bear shite?

Mikey23

@chrisbass... :-)

Colinthecop

Joeblack wrote:

Out of all those statistics (which I'm sure you'll all be pleased to read) the only one that bothers me is strava

There's a Strava Segment on one of my routes, it's just short of 11miles long and you can get a decent average speed on it.

Although half way along there's a narrow bridge which has traffic lights. Just because its quite narrow and an old duffer would take your mirror off if you met them coming the other way. Anyways, vision is good and I just cant bring myself to stop knowing it's a segment.

I appreciate I will probably burn in hell for eternal damnation, but the desire to one day reach the dizzy heights of the top 20 on the segment is strong....

8)

Crouching Peeky

Fundamentally I agree with those that say those that say anyone jumping a red light is a c*nt. Although I think there is a HUGE difference between going through as a light turns red and going through when it's been red for a period of time. ALL road users are guilty of the first example, pretty much only cyclists are guilty of the second!
What I will say though is, and perhaps my opinion is skewed because 90% of the riding I do is in and around central London, the law and their usage is wrong when it comes to red lights and bicycles. My commute is 13.7 miles each way. I've just counted on street view the number of sets of lights I go through in that distance.....83. Yes 83 sets of traffic lights. Thats a set of traffic lights every 290 yards!!! Thats f*cking insane!!
I'm not sure what the answer is but I believe something needs to change, but while the law is as it is, I will stop when a light is red.

mpie

Crouching Peeky wrote:

Fundamentally I agree with those that say those that say anyone jumping a red light is a c*nt. Although I think there is a HUGE difference between going through as a light turns red and going through when it's been red for a period of time. ALL road users are guilty of the first example, pretty much only cyclists are guilty of the second!
What I will say though is, and perhaps my opinion is skewed because 90% of the riding I do is in and around central London, the law and their usage is wrong when it comes to red lights and bicycles. My commute is 13.7 miles each way. I've just counted on street view the number of sets of lights I go through in that distance.....83. Yes 83 sets of traffic lights. Thats a set of traffic lights every 290 yards!!! Thats f*cking insane!!
I'm not sure what the answer is but I believe something needs to change, but while the law is as it is, I will stop when a light is red.

Interesting point. I'm in the 'don't RLJ' camp, but then I only have 2 sets of light on my 12 mile commute (regularly manage to not unclip between home and work) and most of my fun riding in on rural back roads, again with very few lights. So for me, the odd time I have to stop is a none issue. Perhaps in different circumstances is might feel differently about RLJing. Hope I never have to find out!

Mikey23

83 in 13.7 miles... That is insane