Choosing between Rose xeon CGF an Canyon Ultimate cf slx

vtorstein

I am about to buy me a new road bike and have come down to either Canyon ultimate cf slx ore Rose Xeon CGF.
I now have a Cannondale synapse. I dont want more than 4-5 cm drop from seat to the the bar and are not sure I will get that on the canyon. The Rose bike is a gran fondo bike, so it wont be a problem on that bike. But the Canyon bike looks better and is lighter. Rose frame size 57
I am 86 cm inseem an 183 cm tall. Canyon frame size 56.
Does anyone have any opinions that could help me?:)

rickeverett

Personally Rose look lighter, better value bikes with a quicker build/dispatch time. The customer service is supposed to be excellent and you can customise the bikes more + there's lots of on-line and cutomer help.

Only issue with the CGF is the rear brake is underneath near the BB. - Now the Germans have nice smooth, efficient clean roads where the likes of cow crap, salt ad other rubbish wont be fired up onto the calliper.

The alternative to the Ultimate CF SLX is the

Rose Xeon X-Lite range : http://www.rosebikes.co.uk/products/bik ... on-x-lite/

or

Rose Xeon CRS range : http://www.rosebikes.co.uk/products/bik ... /xeon-crs/

I think the frames are the same on both ranges.

Bar Shaker

That Rose is amazing value.

The brake calliper position wouldn't worry me. Rear callipers get splattered wherever they are.

vtorstein

My major concern is the geometry on the Canyon bike, i have had an issue with neck pain in the past . I am beacuse of that dependent on a slightly more upright seating position on the bike , but i am not sure i will get that on an canyon ultimate cf slx. I see the rose cgf bike as an safe alternative if we look at the geometry.
The brake callipers dont worry me, I clean the bike after use anyway. And in my experience a normal positioned calipper get wet if the roads are wet too.

ai_1

The Canyon Ultimate head tubes are moderate rather than very aggresive plus their Acros headset collar adds 1cm to the stem height. So you may well be okay with the height. You can always flip the stem if necessary. If you think the fit will be okay I'd go for the Canyon but I'm sure the Rose would do the job very well too and you'll get it sooner and can configure it to your liking!

vtorstein

Its because of the not so aggresive geometry i am considering the ultimate slx. But with the rose i can get the amount of spacers that i want when i order and regulate the hight of the bar as i want it.

rickeverett

If geometry and comfort is a concern then I would go for the CGF then.

Or customise the CRS or XLite to suit.

charlie_potatoes

rickeverett wrote:

If geometry and comfort is a concern then I would go for the CGF then.

Or customise the CRS or XLite to suit.

Do you work for Rose, Rick?

sloppyschleckonds

Charlie Potatoes wrote:

rickeverett wrote:

If geometry and comfort is a concern then I would go for the CGF then.

Or customise the CRS or XLite to suit.

Do you work for Rose, Rick?

He seems very opinionated about it.

Has the Rose frame won any proper races?

Sprool

CGF frames built more for comfort on longer rides are not likely to be winning many races. I am also deliberating between Canyon and Rose. What has put me off are the few reviews on the Rose Xeon CRS that say it is a more aggressive position, a bit twitchy, not so much a comfort ride, whereas the Canyon frames have more reviews on the internet extolling the virtues of comfort. So I decided it had to be the CGF if I was going to go for a Rose. Still leaning towards a canyon though I love Rose system for speccing the bike.

brownbosh

nice problem to have. both nice kit.

rgasuk

I am the same measurements as you and after speaking to canyon I went with there large frame 58cm . I have 2 slipped discs and a ruptured disc and been riding a trek madone for last few years and would always after a while get pain in lower back . I had 2 bike fits and lots of alterations . I then got a racy cx frame and discovered the postion was spreading the weight more evenly across the frame .
I was lucky enough to test ride a mates canyon CF SL and found I encountered no stiffness or lower back frame so I went with a SLX , flipped the stem till I get used to the lower postion but so happy I went that route instead of a more sportive frame again .

Good luck and I'm sure you won't be disappointed with either ,

Regards

vtorstein

rgasuk wrote:

I am the same measurements as you and after speaking to canyon I went with there large frame 58cm . I have 2 slipped discs and a ruptured disc and been riding a trek madone for last few years and would always after a while get pain in lower back . I had 2 bike fits and lots of alterations . I then got a racy cx frame and discovered the postion was spreading the weight more evenly across the frame .
I was lucky enough to test ride a mates canyon CF SL and found I encountered no stiffness or lower back frame so I went with a SLX , flipped the stem till I get used to the lower postion but so happy I went that route instead of a more sportive frame again .

Good luck and I'm sure you won't be disappointed with either ,

Regards

That was a very helpful contribution , think i might be heading for a SLX bike:) A bit more expensive than a rose bike. But a nicer and lighter frame.

rando

rgasuk wrote:

I am the same measurements as you and after speaking to canyon I went with there large frame 58cm . I have 2 slipped discs and a ruptured disc and been riding a trek madone for last few years and would always after a while get pain in lower back . I had 2 bike fits and lots of alterations . I then got a racy cx frame and discovered the postion was spreading the weight more evenly across the frame .
I was lucky enough to test ride a mates canyon CF SL and found I encountered no stiffness or lower back frame so I went with a SLX , flipped the stem till I get used to the lower postion but so happy I went that route instead of a more sportive frame again .

Good luck and I'm sure you won't be disappointed with either ,

Regards

Did you go with the VCLS 2.0 seat post ? Or stick with the normal VCLS post?
Either way how do you find comfort on the Canyon over longer rides . I too only look at more sportive geometry bikes and purchased a trek domane last week but not ridden it yet (did test ride one from shop though) and have 14 days to return if I wish. Now this thread has got me thinking of a less sportive geometry bike and both canyon and rose offer superb VFM and certainly canyons get excellent reviews. Tempted now to return my trek and buy canyon and save £500 in the process.

ai_1

rando wrote:

....Did you go with the VCLS 2.0 seat post ? Or stick with the normal VCLS post?
Either way how do you find comfort on the Canyon over longer rides . I too only look at more sportive geometry bikes and purchased a trek domane last week but not ridden it yet (did test ride one from shop though) and have 14 days to return if I wish. Now this thread has got me thinking of a less sportive geometry bike and both canyon and rose offer superb VFM and certainly canyons get excellent reviews. Tempted now to return my trek and buy canyon and save £500 in the process.

I've ordered a Canyon in the SL model and decided to go with the VCLS 2.0 post but it'll be a while 'til I get it.
All the reviews are complementary regarding comfort of the SLX and I'd expect the SL to be similar. However, I think the right geometry and choice of tyres and tyre pressure are more important than the frame compliance.

Coach H

Just remember that if you want the VCLS 2 post you need to have a minimum amount showing.
I am 184 (don't know inside leg but relatively short) in height and have a 58 Ultimate CF (basically the same dimensions) and for the kind of bar drop you are looking for I don't think you would have enough seatpost showing for a VCLS 2.

IMO if you want this you would have to go with a Med and flip the stem due to seat tube length on the large.

vtorstein

Coach H wrote:

Just remember that if you want the VCLS 2 post you need to have a minimum amount showing.
I am 184 (don't know inside leg but relatively short) in height and have a 58 Ultimate CF (basically the same dimensions) and for the kind of bar drop you are looking for I don't think you would have enough seatpost showing for a VCLS 2.

IMO if you want this you would have to go with a Med and flip the stem due to seat tube length on the large.

What kind of drop do you have from saddle to bar?

pedalbasher

For what it's worth, I've had a Canyon Ultimate CF SLX for almost a year now and absolutely love it.

As far as geometry is concerned, it can be set up pretty relaxed / sportive-friendly as there are a number of spacers and the unique Acros headset takes up an extra cm or two. As it happens, I have recently switched the spacers so as to lower the bars by a couple of cm - I did a lot of long distance rides (upto 150 miles) on it last summer as I was training for an Ironman, but am now focussing on shorter rides without too many all-dayers, so I've dropped the bars.

It's a pretty versatile set-up.

I had a couple of issues adjusting the headset initially, but Canyon have been really helpful and have even sent out a couple of replacement parts for free after I threaded a headset screw.

I don't think you can beat them for VFM. Only downsides are (obviously, but as per the Rose) you can't try before buying and you have to deal with issues via phone or email rather than just rocking up and demanding things get fixed (although they do have a place in Kingston, SW London, I believe).

Coach H

vtorstein wrote:

Coach H wrote:

Just remember that if you want the VCLS 2 post you need to have a minimum amount showing.
I am 184 (don't know inside leg but relatively short) in height and have a 58 Ultimate CF (basically the same dimensions) and for the kind of bar drop you are looking for I don't think you would have enough seatpost showing for a VCLS 2.

IMO if you want this you would have to go with a Med and flip the stem due to seat tube length on the large.

What kind of drop do you have from saddle to bar?

40mm.
On my 58 this means the Acros cap and one 5mm spacer.
I could have had the same contact points on a 56 (geometry not available on a SLX/SL) with a 120mm stem, but by the time I got my frame and found this out they had no 56's left. This is the only problem with Canyon as the geometry charts, particularly headtube + headset length, set up slightly differently to my other bikes due to the deep fork crown. Aesthetically I would have been better on a 56 but in my case I still got the correct contact points.

For my bodyshape, in the SLX/SL, I am in between sizes. The large, pretty much the same geo as my 56 UCF, comes up with a short seatpost (which looks a bit duff in modern terms) and the medium has to much saddle to bar drop for my long body, short arms and legs shape.

ai_1

pedalbasher wrote:

For what it's worth, I've had a Canyon Ultimate CF SLX for almost a year now and absolutely love it.

As far as geometry is concerned, it can be set up pretty relaxed / sportive-friendly as there are a number of spacers and the unique Acros headset takes up an extra cm or two. As it happens, I have recently switched the spacers so as to lower the bars by a couple of cm - I did a lot of long distance rides (upto 150 miles) on it last summer as I was training for an Ironman, but am now focussing on shorter rides without too many all-dayers, so I've dropped the bars.

It's a pretty versatile set-up........

What size is yours?

Coach H wrote:

....This is the only problem with Canyon as the geometry charts, particularly headtube + headset length, set up slightly differently to my other bikes due to the deep fork crown......

I'm waiting on a M/56 size Ultimate CF SL which is the same frame as the SLX except for the layup (was going to get the SLX but went cheap at the last minute!)
I'm aiming to do a half Ironman this year and, all going well, a full distance event next year. But mostly I do hilly cycles, sportives and some sprint/olympic triathlons.
The only concern I have is that the bar height range might not be spot-on and the odd sized stem will make adjustments much trickier.

pedalbasher - if you have the same size I'm getting could I trouble you for some measurements?

Coach H - When you say a deep fork crown do you mean there's more space between the wheel and the bottom of the headtube?
Could either of you give me a measurement from the wheel centre to the bottom of the head tube?
My best guess is a 150mm headtube on a typical bike would leave me needing about 20mm of spacers but the Acros headset would reduce this to 10mm according to the Canyon geometry data. If the fork pushes it higher I might end up with no spacers. Perfect as long as I never want to go even lower!

pedalbasher

Al_1 - as it happens, I've still got the print out of measurements on my noticeboard from when I was umming and ahhing whether to go for S or M frame.

Here are the main M measurements:

Top tube length = 537mm
Head tube length = 138mm
Head tube angle = 72.5 deg
Seat tube angle = 73.5 deg
Chainstay length = 410mm
Wheelbase = 971mm
Stack = 546mm
Reach = 374mm

For what it's worth, I'm about 5"8 with fairly long legs and shortish torso. Most people will probably tell me I should have gone for the S frame, but Canyon disagreed and I'm glad I went for the M. I had a bike fit and they told me the reach (with a 100mm stem) was at the maximum of recommended, but still fine. So I'm switching out the stem for an 80mm which I think will make things perfect.

How Far is too Far

I have a large Canyon CF SL and a 56 CM Cannondale Supersix. I am 5'11" and find the Canyon far more relaxed to ride than the Cannondale. It is not a full on race Geo but a good happy medium for longer rides and also riding quick. Although the Canyon was less than half the price of my Cannondale it is as good quality in every respect.

My next bike is very likely to be another Canyon as I don't think they can be beaten for performance per £.

rgasuk

Did you go with the VCLS 2.0 seat post ? Or stick with the normal VCLS post?
Either way how do you find comfort on the Canyon over longer rides . I too only look at more sportive geometry bikes and purchased a trek domane last week but not ridden it yet (did test ride one from shop though) and have 14 days to return if I wish. Now this thread has got me thinking of a less sportive geometry bike and both canyon and rose offer superb VFM and certainly canyons get excellent reviews. Tempted now to return my trek and buy canyon and save £500 in the process.

i stuck with the normal seat post as @ 95kg i thought it may be better, although in the future i may be tempted to try 1 out as i hear good reports . i havnt had a full day in the saddle yet but from what i have rode ive found it very comfy, no road buzz and the roads up north are awfull .i had mavic kysiurms on my last bike with 25mm tyres and i still felt most bumps and road buzz so for me its money well spent.

my bike below , now fitted with new ultegra 6800 pedals

viewtopic.php?f=40044&t=12956261

Coach H

Ai_1 wrote:

Coach H - When you say a deep fork crown do you mean there's more space between the wheel and the bottom of the headtube? Yes
Could either of you give me a measurement from the wheel centre to the bottom of the head tube?

I can do, but mine is the older Ultimate CF so would be of limited value. On mine, in real terms, the headtube is 10mm longer than stated due to the fork crown. Don't know if this is the same on the new models

vtorstein

I ended up buying a Rose CGF , it turned out to be an easy choice since Canyon didn`t answer any of my e-mails. Rose on the other hand was very helpful and has a very good costumer service.

rando

vtorstein wrote:

I ended up buying a Rose CGF , it turned out to be an easy choice since Canyon didn`t answer any of my e-mails. Rose on the other hand was very helpful and has a very good costumer service.

Will be really interested in how the Rose CGF rides. I have been having an email exchange with Rose about this bike as I can't decide between this in ultegra version or a Trek Domane or Canyon Ultimate CF. Much better value on the Rose but am slighlty put off with the placing of the rear brake although I notice a few bikes now have it placed on the bottom bracket - Trek Madone, Scott Solace and this Rose.
When is the delivery date for yours ?

Sprool

great looking bike, very nearly ordered a Rose CGF (loving the stealth rear brake calliper) but just ended up going for a Canyon CF SL in the end; they promptly answered all my email questions and were very friendly and helpful on the phone. Arrives in about 10 days.

vtorstein

I havent got a delivery date yet,ordered it yesterday, I` m from Norway , so maybe all my emails to Canyon was sent to an office there ore something, well its there loss. Very exited about this bike, I have equiped the bike with carbon steering post and mavic ksyrium sls wheels, full Dura ace group. very light for a endurance bike, and half the price of what you can get from retailers.

rando

vtorstein wrote:

I havent got a delivery date yet,ordered it yesterday, I` m from Norway , so maybe all my emails to Canyon was sent to an office there ore something, well its there loss. Wery exited about this bike, I have equiped the bike with carbon steering post and mavic ksyrium sls wheels, full Dura ace group. very light for a endurance bike, and half the price of what you can get from retailers.

That is a spec and a half!!

vtorstein

I`ve been riding my new rose team cgf bike for a week now and thought I post a review. The bike lookes great but they hadnt mounted the bar tape that i specced the bike with so i sent them a mail and they sent me the right bar tape, they also had mounted with 100 mm stem(i ordred it with 90 mm) but i found that it suited me pretty well.
The bike is stiffer and more responsive than my previous bike(cannondale 2012 synapse) . The new dura ace 9000 gear system is superb , that was actually what impressed me the most, especially the front derailleur changes gears alot easier than than ultegra 6700 . The bike comfortable on rough roads, at least as comfortable as cannondale synapse.
The bikes runs great in dry condition is wasnt until i took a ride in rainy weather i had first negative experience, it seems that small stones and gravel sticks to the brake calipper and after riding for 2 hours the rims starts to touching the dirt/stones on the brake callipper especially when standing up and pedal, I think i will have to ride with some serious rim clearance in such conditions next time. The other thing is that the qsyrium sls rear wheel fills up with water , there not drilled any drain holes in the rims so i have to drill some hole myself, a bit dissapointing for such pricey wheels. I ordered a 57 sized frame with 172.5 mm pedals, maybe i should have gone with 175 mm pedals cause the seat is pushed all the way back to get my knees in the right position over the pedals. My inseem height is about 86.5 cm, so if you have 87 cm ore over inseem height you should go for the 59 frame. I now have 5.5 cm drop from seat to bar , but i think maybe have to raise the seat a bit. l have 2.5 cm with spacers .

Mikebike01

Hello,

I'm considering bying a Rose XEON CGF 3000.
But now I'm doubting about it, because of the rear brake position. How is your experience until now ?
I live in Belgium, where we have the Ardens, but also a lot of rainy days. and the roads ar not always very clean.

thanks