Training for higher vo2?

BMKN

To achieve a higher vo2 which should help me go faster am I better to do sets like you do in running like hill reps one day intervals another day and a long ride with a group. Or am I better to increase my milage at a 75% of max heart rate level. I currentl6 tick over 180-200km per week from commute and extra riding.

napoleond

If you want to increase your VO2 max you are better doing short sharp intervals. I do 4-6 4 minute intervals with up to 4 mins recovery in between. I go as hard as I can in that 4 minutes (paced though, I don't sprint then fade, the idea is you are going as hard throughout but by the end you are spent).
Bear in mind some people can't increase their absolute VO2 max at all. I am one of these unfortunately. I can, however, increase my power at VO2 max.

No doubt a professional coach will be along shortly...

ric/rstsport

BMKN wrote:

To achieve a higher vo2 which should help me go faster am I better to do sets like you do in running like hill reps one day intervals another day and a long ride with a group. Or am I better to increase my milage at a 75% of max heart rate level. I currentl6 tick over 180-200km per week from commute and extra riding.

it may help to define what your goals are - so that people can give some general advice. however, it's somewhat impossible to give specific suggestions to increase such physiological markers, because

1) some of the answer depends on your goals
2) some of the answer depends on your current fitness
3) some of the answer depends on the time you have available
4) some of the answer depends on how you respond to training
5) some of the answer depends on the training you're currently doing
etc.

it isn't a simple binary answer of endurance rides or hill intervals. so, for e.g. when we develop coaching programmes for our riders we start off with a 15 page questionnaire which starts to look at these issues...

ric

JayKosta

VO2max is not really that important unless your limiting factor truely is lack of O2.

Leg power and endurance are much more important to develop as a base for increasing riding speed. 1-2 hour rides at a brisk speed (as fast as you can maintain without becoming exhausted) are good for building base.

Doing interval training will increase your power and VO2max, but they need to be hard and unpleasant .... nobody's idea of fun. And doing intervals will probably make you tired for the rest of the day.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA

ric/rstsport

VO2max is extremely important for (endurance) bike racing (and riding), as VO2max sets the upper limit at which you can function.

Given that the vast majority of people are able to exercise within a tight(ish) range (as a % of VO2max or MAP) and given that efficiency is also within a tight range then it's likely that to increase physical performance one has to increase VO2max as well as lactate threshold. It's true that you could be only able to operate at the low end of these ranges and that training will allow you to move higher up the range but there's an upper limit at which you can operate (e.g. ~90% of VO2max for 1 hr). Accordingly, once you can work at that level, then the only way to significantly improve physical fitness (over moderate durations) is to increase VO2max.

Ric

BMKN

Cheers for responses. My goal is to be a good racer above average. I find my legs slow me down alot ad I try and push myself but I rarely get my heart rate above 160bpm and im 28 male so I should be able to get it higher. What im hearing is incresse milage and not worry about vo2? I am starting to do a weekly club spin to help my speed will that be sufficient? I would like my average speed to go up is my main goal.

ric/rstsport

like i mentioned before it's *impossible* to say from the info provided what you need to do. we use a 15 page questionnaire to start this process off.

it's also impossible to say from the data provided whether you should be able to exceed 160 b/min.

ric

bahzob

As above speaking to a good coach will help.

Also I'd suggest getting this book. http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/193403083X

The author is a nob end but nonetheless the info in this book is pretty good. It's also ideal if you have to combine training with real life and for this time of year when you may want to train indoors/keep outdoor rides short.

It includes 2 12 week plans for would be racers, one for beginners, one for more experienced. By their nature the emphasis is on shorter workouts which in turn will help you get a good feel for what your HR by zone is plus getting you used to doing the sort of drills that will improve, amongst other things, VO2.

If you follow one or other of these plans should get yourself into good shape for any early 2014 season races, which in turn will give you a lot more information on what your future training needs may be.

JayKosta

If you are a typical and healthy 28-year-old, without cardio or respiratory problems - you should be able to achieve a HR more than 160bpm on the bike by doing hard hills that almost force you to dismount and walk.

For indoor leg exercise, I use a 'step bench' -
1) step up onto bench with one leg, and do knee lift and return to floor with the other
2) step down so both feet are on floor
repeat with the other leg

Adjust the height of the step so you can do the motions with good form and at a pace and intensity that you can maintain at an endurance level.
For additional intensity you can hold weights in your hards to increase the amount of work without changing pace or step height.

My HR increases fairly slowly, and it takes about 30 minutes to plateau my HR.
For me, a 40 minute duration is good - breathing hard, sweaty, and legs starting to get fatigued.

And use a large fan to cool your head and torso!

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA

ric/rstsport

While many/most 28 yr olds can exceed 160 b/min, it isn't a given that they can. for e.g. i did a VO2max test with a 16 yr old, who couldn't get above 165 b/min and there was nothing wrong with his heart.

upton

Ric/RSTSport wrote:

While many/most 28 yr olds can exceed 160 b/min, it isn't a given that they can. for e.g. i did a VO2max test with a 16 yr old, who couldn't get above 165 b/min and there was nothing wrong with his heart.

Dumb "question" coming up:

Would not being able to reach (roughly) theoretical max bpm have an impact of how fast you were against someone of close age/level of training etc. Does only being able to reach a fraction of that value put you at a disadvantage? Eg, would his power be lower @165bpm than another similarly trained 16yo @165 which might be 80% of his max?
Sorry to hijack; i'm sure it's not black and white.

Alex_Simmons/RST

upton wrote:

Ric/RSTSport wrote:

While many/most 28 yr olds can exceed 160 b/min, it isn't a given that they can. for e.g. i did a VO2max test with a 16 yr old, who couldn't get above 165 b/min and there was nothing wrong with his heart.

Dumb "question" coming up:

Would not being able to reach (roughly) theoretical max bpm have an impact of how fast you were against someone of close age/level of training etc. Does only being able to reach a fraction of that value put you at a disadvantage? Eg, would his power be lower @165bpm than another similarly trained 16yo @165 which might be 80% of his max?
Sorry to hijack; i'm sure it's not black and white.

It's complex and there are many factors in play with O2 delivery and uptake, but the simplest answer assuming all else the same (it rarely is though) is they may actually have the same cardiac output, that is the volume of blood they pump per unit time.

One may have a slower maximal HR but have a heart and associated circulation infrastructure that enables them to to pump more blood per heart beat.

Toks

JayKosta wrote:

IFor indoor leg exercise, I use a 'step bench' -
1) step up onto bench with one leg, and do knee lift and return to floor with the other
2) step down so both feet are on floor
repeat with the other leg

Adjust the height of the step so you can do the motions with good form and at a pace and intensity that you can maintain at an endurance level.
For additional intensity you can hold weights in your hards to increase the amount of work without changing pace or step height.

My HR increases fairly slowly, and it takes about 30 minutes to plateau my HR.
For me, a 40 minute duration is good - breathing hard, sweaty, and legs starting to get fatigued.

And use a large fan to cool your head and torso!

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA

Perhaps I missed something!.. as we like to say in the UK. You're having a laugh, right?

okgo

Chris Froome max HR isn't very high irrc, circa 160 odd?

carrock

I know anecdotally of a former national TT champion with a max HR of 120.

I think many people underestimate their max HR for the simple reason that to reach your max HR is brutally hard.

And bear in mind that max cycling HR will probably be lower than max running HR