Which clutch mech?

Kowalski675

Does anybody know what the differences between the SRAM X7 and X9 type 2 clutch mechs are? Their website is (as usual) no help - both seem to have the same features listed, and the X7 acyaully has the lighter claimed weight:

http://www.sram.com/sram/mountain/produ ... derailleur

http://www.sram.com/sram/mountain/produ ... derailleur

So what, if anything, does your extra £20 buy you on the X9? :? Maybe some parts ally where the X7 is plastic? The X7 construction is listed as "Material:Alloy B knuckle, Alloy links, High Strength Grilon® Composite P-Knuckle, Serviceable sealed pulley, 3K Carbon Cage", but there's no X9 list to compare that to.

ej2320

I have an X9 type 1 with no clutch and it's been great
I have no comparison with X7 though

It may be like Shimano where it's just lighter or made stronger

lawman

The X7 will be cheaper made and won't last as long, but given how long Sram stuff lasts these days, I'd go for the X7 as it's cheaper. Or in all honesty, I'd go shimano.

rockmonkeysc

Both are crap. I have X0 and wouldn't recommend that.
Get Shimano XT.

Kowalski675

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Both are crap. I have X0 and wouldn't recommend that.
Get Shimano XT.

As dismissively unhelpful as ever, lol. I'm hardly going to spend a fortune changing the whole transmission to XT on an £850 bike, when the existing SRAM X7 set up works just fine. Anyone got a more helpful reply, lol?

Kowalski675

ej2320 wrote:

I have an X9 type 1 with no clutch and it's been great
I have no comparison with X7 though

It's specifically the clutch mech that I want - the annoying chain slap on descents does my nut in, lol.

Kowalski675

lawman wrote:

The X7 will be cheaper made and won't last as long

Aye, i figured that was about the size of it, just wondered if anyone could tell me the actual differences. I'm guessing maybe the X9 has more ally construction where the X7 may have plastic parts - that would explain the lighter claimed weight of the cheaper (£49.99 currently) X7. The X7 would last me years anyway with my mileage, unless I smacked it on a rock or something equally daft. If the X9 offered any real world advantage it would be worth the extra £20, but as far as I can tell from the website specs it doesn't, unless I'm missing something.

97th choice

I've sent one x9 type 2 back under warranty in six months, and there have been a few reports of premature failure of the clutch mechanism.

lawman

As I said before the new Sram stuff doesn't last well, I've heard of clutches going after a few months under really hard use. As a whole they just aren't as well made as Shimano kit is. For not a whole lot more than an X7 mech, or for the price of X9, you could replace the rear mech and shifters with Slx and have a much better and longer setup. You'd only need to change these as the front mech will be fine with the slx shifters.

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... lleur.html

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... evers.html

£75 for the Slx vs £50 for the X7, no contest in my mind, the slx would be far better and last longer. £25 extra well spent.

rockmonkeysc

SRAM mechs last about half as long as Shimano.
Just get a SLX mech and shifter from ze Germans. They are cheap enough.

Kowalski675

lawman wrote:

As I said before the new Sram stuff doesn't last well, I've heard of clutches going after a few months under really hard use. As a whole they just aren't as well made as Shimano kit is. For not a whole lot more than an X7 mech, or for the price of X9, you could replace the rear mech and shifters with Slx and have a much better and longer setup. You'd only need to change these as the front mech will be fine with the slx shifters.

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... lleur.html

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... evers.html

£75 for the Slx vs £50 for the X7, no contest in my mind, the slx would be far better and last longer. £25 extra well spent.

Cheers. I have no complaints about the current X7 shifting (I just want a quieter drivetrain, the chain slap's so annoying), and at full price I'd have no intention of changing to the SLX parts, but at those prices it could be a different matter. The reviews are all very positive, and I could keep the X7 parts towards going 2 x 10 on my Kraken maybe. I don't like the gear indicators, but it appears they're removable like the XT ones (and presumably have the little blanking caps hidden inside them like the XTs do). Which cage length would I need? I thought probably medium, but that's showing out of stock.

If i wanted to swap the existing shifters and rear mech to my Kraken to go 2 x 10, what else would I need? Obviously cassete and chain, presumably cranks and chainwheels too, but could I keep the X7 front mech from the 3 x 9 setup?

Chunkers1980

Do you have neoprene chain stay protector?

lawman

Kowalski675 wrote:

lawman wrote:

As I said before the new Sram stuff doesn't last well, I've heard of clutches going after a few months under really hard use. As a whole they just aren't as well made as Shimano kit is. For not a whole lot more than an X7 mech, or for the price of X9, you could replace the rear mech and shifters with Slx and have a much better and longer setup. You'd only need to change these as the front mech will be fine with the slx shifters.

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... lleur.html

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... evers.html

£75 for the Slx vs £50 for the X7, no contest in my mind, the slx would be far better and last longer. £25 extra well spent.

Cheers. I have no complaints about the current X7 shifting (I just want a quieter drivetrain, the chain slap's so annoying), and at full price I'd have no intention of changing to the SLX parts, but at those prices it could be a different matter. The reviews are all very positive, and I could keep the X7 parts towards going 2 x 10 on my Kraken maybe. I don't like the gear indicators, but it appears they're removable like the XT ones (and presumably have the little blanking caps hidden inside them like the XTs do).

If i wanted to swap the existing shifters and rear mech to my Kraken to go 2 x 10, what else would I need? Obviously cassete and chain, presumably cranks and chainwheels too, but could I keep the X7 front mech from the 3 x 9 setup?

Yeah the Slx shifters have the little caps behind the shift windows Your chainrings will be fine, most 9 speed rings with 10 speed no problem, my old TA specialite chainrings were great with 9 or 10 speed. The front mech will also be fine, so really all you need is a chain and cassette, such as this, which at £35 for an Slx chain and cassette is a bloody bargain!

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... chain.html

You may have to replace the chainrings if they've had a lot of miles put on them though, but the existing cranks will be fine.

Briggo

Thought about a Bionicon v2 chain guide? Works well for me, reduced slappy slap.

£30 and you don't have to worry about failing clutches.

Kowalski675

Chunkers1980 wrote:

Do you have neoprene chain stay protector?

Yup.

Kowalski675

lawman wrote:

Your chainrings will be fine, most 9 speed rings with 10 speed no problem, my old TA specialite chainrings were great with 9 or 10 speed. The front mech will also be fine, so really all you need is a chain and cassette, such as this, which at £35 for an Slx chain and cassette is a bloody bargain!

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... chain.html

You may have to replace the chainrings if they've had a lot of miles put on them though, but the existing cranks will be fine.

The bike's 2007, but only done a few miles. It hung unused in my garage until I dragged it out this spring to try out this mtb lark, then bought the Boardman after a few rides. The chainrings are steel too, so heavy, but aren't showing any visible signs of wear, just scratching on the teeth paint from the chain. So would I just need to adjust the high limit srew on the front mech and remove the big ring (which only ever got used for catching on rocks anyway, unless I ventured briefly onto tarmac).

CRC have the SLX rear mech in stock in medium and long cage for the same £49.99, or the XT at the same price too. The customer reviews on CRC are a lot more mixed though, with mentions of broken clutches, worn out jockey wheels and easily broken mechs blamed on the direct mount system.

lawman

Kowalski675 wrote:

lawman wrote:

Your chainrings will be fine, most 9 speed rings with 10 speed no problem, my old TA specialite chainrings were great with 9 or 10 speed. The front mech will also be fine, so really all you need is a chain and cassette, such as this, which at £35 for an Slx chain and cassette is a bloody bargain!

http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/m ... chain.html

You may have to replace the chainrings if they've had a lot of miles put on them though, but the existing cranks will be fine.

The bike's 2007, but only done a few miles. It hung unused in my garage until I dragged it out this spring to try out this mtb lark, then bought the Boardman after a few rides. The chainrings are steel too, so heavy, but aren't showing any visible signs of wear, just scratching on the teeth paint from the chain. So would I just need to adjust the high limit srew on the front mech and remove the big ring (which only ever got used for catching on rocks anyway, unless I ventured briefly onto tarmac).

CRC have the SLX rear mech in stock in medium and long cage for the same £49.99, or the XT at the same price too. The customer reviews on CRC are a lot more mixed though, with mentions of broken clutches, worn out jockey wheels and easily broken mechs blamed on the direct mount system.

I would imagine the chainrings would be fine then with the new chain. As for the front mech, yes as you described, but removing the big chainring will require shorter bolts as well. I wouldn't worry about the direct mount issues, as your boardman has a standard mech hanger. Not many bikes come the relatively new direct mount standard. I've run two clutch mechs, an Xtr and a Zee for a year with no issues at, still working like new and the jockey wheels are still great. I would even say a new deore shadow plus would be better than an X7 type 2.

Kowalski675

lawman wrote:

I would imagine the chainrings would be fine then with the new chain. As for the front mech, yes as you described, but removing the big chainring will require shorter bolts as well. I wouldn't worry about the direct mount issues, as your boardman has a standard mech hanger. Not many bikes come the relatively new direct mount standard. I've run two clutch mechs, an Xtr and a Zee for a year with no issues at, still working like new and the jockey wheels are still great. I would even say a new deore shadow plus would be better than an X7 type 2.

Ah, i see. So on a direct mount compatible frame the mech mounts without hanger? That seems a bit daft - is part of the mech hanger's function not meant to be to bend/break before the mech does in an impact, so you can hopefully fit a new hanger and carry on riding?

I'm guessing that you'd say go for the XT mech over the SLX at the same price? Any disadvantages to the XT? If it's a case of the XT being lighter, but potentially more fragile I'd probably rather carry a more few grammes more in exchange for durability / less maintenance.

Kowalski675

Briggo wrote:

Thought about a Bionicon v2 chain guide? Works well for me, reduced slappy slap.

£30 and you don't have to worry about failing clutches.

No, I hadn't. Just googled it. Looks nice and simple (nothing to go wrong), but does it not create drag? It does the same job as a clutch mech re stoppping damn annoying noises on descents?

lawman

Kowalski675 wrote:

lawman wrote:

I would imagine the chainrings would be fine then with the new chain. As for the front mech, yes as you described, but removing the big chainring will require shorter bolts as well. I wouldn't worry about the direct mount issues, as your boardman has a standard mech hanger. Not many bikes come the relatively new direct mount standard. I've run two clutch mechs, an Xtr and a Zee for a year with no issues at, still working like new and the jockey wheels are still great. I would even say a new deore shadow plus would be better than an X7 type 2.

Ah, i see. So on a direct mount compatible frame the mech mounts without hanger? That seems a bit daft - is part of the mech hanger's function not meant to be to bend/break before the mech does in an impact, so you can hopefully fit a new hanger and carry on riding?

I'm guessing that you'd say go for the XT mech over the SLX at the same price? Any disadvantages to the XT? If it's a case of the XT being lighter, but potentially more fragile I'd probably rather carry a more few grammes more in exchange for durability / less maintenance.

This explains the direct mount for you, it basically removes part of the mech that's weak - http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Shimano-Of ... leurs.html

ej2320

Kowalski675 wrote:

ej2320 wrote:

I have an X9 type 1 with no clutch and it's been great
I have no comparison with X7 though

It's specifically the clutch mech that I want - the annoying chain slap on descents does my nut in, lol.

I know how you feel, got an SLX clutch for my new build cause the chain bounces off the outer chain ring

Kowalski675

lawman wrote:

This explains the direct mount for you, it basically removes part of the mech that's weak - http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Shimano-Of ... leurs.html

Cheers, that makes sense.

Kowalski675

ej2320 wrote:

Kowalski675 wrote:

ej2320 wrote:

I have an X9 type 1 with no clutch and it's been great
I have no comparison with X7 though

It's specifically the clutch mech that I want - the annoying chain slap on descents does my nut in, lol.

I know how you feel, got an SLX clutch for my new build cause the chain bounces off the outer chain ring

I've got the neoprene chainstay protector on, and I'm usually concentrating too hard on bumpy descents to look down, but I'm guessing the noise is coming from the chain slapping against the front mech cage and/or the chain ring itself.

frankspencer1979

I've got an x9 type 2. Had it about 2-3 months and it's been brill (paired to x7 shifter.) Changes are swift and precise, chain slap eliminated and no more dropped chains.

However, from what other people have said, Shimano would give me a much better experience and i'm already half way through the life of the rear mech so hey ho.

Kowalski675

frankspencer1979 wrote:

I've got an x9 type 2. Had it about 2-3 months ... i'm already half way through the life of the rear mech so hey ho.

You expect a mech to last 4-6 months? Wtf? :shock:

shindig

Buy a Blackburn stinger chain device. Simple and only £20. I have type 1 X9 9speed for the last 6 years and no issues with reliability. Have the x9 on FS and hardtail. Have SLX 9 speed shadow on my enduro bike and don't like it as much.

supersonic

I got rid of my XTR clutch mech. Couldn't really tell a difference in chain slap, and stiffened the shifting.

Kowalski675

shindig wrote:

Buy a Blackburn stinger chain device. Simple and only £20.

Just googled those, but their site says it needs a bashring to function correctly.

russyh

I use a Bionicon chain guide which was about £30'and works a treat

Kowalski675

Russyh wrote:

I use a Bionicon chain guide which was about £30'and works a treat

Notice any extra drag from it?

frankspencer1979

Kowalski675 wrote:

frankspencer1979 wrote:

I've got an x9 type 2. Had it about 2-3 months ... i'm already half way through the life of the rear mech so hey ho.

You expect a mech to last 4-6 months? Wtf? :shock:

I expect it to last a while, earlier posts in the thread suggest they have as short life span