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damaged forks recon silver tk's need advice

muggsmuggs Posts: 15
edited October 2013 in MTB workshop & tech
hi everyone

please check out this vid to let me know what my options are, basically i think the dent is causing the shock up down motion to catch on it which causing the shock to stick when riding.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8zVeDDA6PM
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  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    I got dizzy after 30 seconds of wobbly wheel. How about just posting a decent pic or two?
    I don't do smileys.

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  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    4bb50395-3206-41b3-8730-db541f17cbdb.jpg

    its hard to see with pics tbh...just imagine that point where the arrow is pointing is a dent thats made the tube circular shape not circular anymore....the silver scrape/scratch is the actual damage
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    Nice close up of the tyre. Maybe similar from a few angles of the leg.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

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  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    its pointless doing a side shot because from the side it looks like a scrape, im choosing such shots because they are the better angles to see the damage from. heres another

    20131020_175531.jpg


    lets just pretend the bottom fork casing is bent, enough to stop the smooth motion of a working suspension fork, it sticks and stops compressing at a much much early point than before...what do you reckon i should do? can i buy a new bottom housing, or maybe take it off and pull the dent out? or just buy some new forks?
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    im checking out other recons, ive seen a few but all have crown turn keys and not poplocs, i was wondering could i just take the poploc mechanism out of my damaged forks and put them in the new recons? everything on both folks are identical bar the lock out mech
  • You could certainly fit new lower legs just make sure they are same year . I wouldn't advise you trying to shove anything down to try and get dent out as you are likely to kill any internal bushings and make matters worse.
    Go to sram website , rockshox service section . They have pdf technical manuals that have diagrams of the fork internals and explain how to service them . Will not solve problem but would help if you decide to put your fork internals into new/ second hand lower legs . Petra cycles are a good and reliable source of rockshox parts in uk . Used them recently http://www.sram.com/service/rockshox/10
    Note poploc works alongside the right leg damper cartridge so you would need to swap that and the poploc over .
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    Cheers dude.

    I have the part number, I think I'm going to take the lower legs off just to inspect the tubes inside to see if they are bent before I order. The bend is pretty far down so I'm fairly sure the inner tubes are ok. I'll try get a quote today and update this thread.


    Edit just got a quote from petra, they said 146quid. Would be silly to pay that as the full fork 2013 Model can be had for just a few quid more. I'll try another place and see what they say
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    Ok so I got another quote and it was 150, so I have decided that I won't be able to find the lower leg part for a sensible price which means new fork. I think my Max is 200quid to spend. Steering diameter is 1 1/8 travel 100 26inch wheel. Any recommendations? I ride road on weekdays and the odd weekend I go in the woods gravely paths and fields. Probably be OK with the cheap rock shox xc 32 2013 for 149. Actually I seen some recons on ebay for 124 but they have crownkey turn nobs, I really need to know if my existing poploc would fit these
  • What year is your fork?
    99% sure you will be fine . As I said just remove all of the damper components from the right leg. Poploc remotes on their own don't work they rely on the damper cartridge being remote compatible.
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    well my bike is a 2012 rockrider so im guessing 2012 forks. i actually asked the dude on ebay what year his forks are and if my poploc would fit, even gave him a link to my bike spec. he replied saying "no sorry you cant do this" he didnt tell me what year his forks are. heres the add http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... TQ:GB:1123

    on crc it says turnkey is compatible with poploc/pushloc remotes


    seen these(take no notice of the picture as they may not be the actual forks)
    http://www.merlincycles.com/bike-shop/f ... -2013.html

    cheapest ive found, im pretty sure you are right in regards to the motion cartridge swap, but just to be on the safe side i will ring merlin up tomorrow and clarify with them then buy if its a go. seen a vid on removing the cartridge, its well straight forward.
  • I swapped cartridge over on my sid . Literally 2 minutes with a 24mm socket. To be honest I have never felt the need for a remote lever . Certainly clarify with merlin I wouldn't want to mislead . Good luck .
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    ok so i rang merlin yesterday before i ordered and the lady on the phone spoke to the mechanic and he said it wouldnt work, when i was on sram site it mentioned turnkey is compatible with remote poploc, i told the lady that and she said well if it says that on the site then it should be ok, i had the felling the mechanic thought i only had the poploc remote and not the cartridge even tho i said wanted to swap the out the whole system from my old forks. well i ordered anyway.

    so its here now but before it came i decided to take the old forks off, i messed up lol the forks came off but the headset bearings and spacers went everywhere. im pretty sure the black spacers remain visible im just not sure which orientation the other three bits go in. please check the pic and let me know if you can.
    20131023_120515.jpg

    that washer on the steerer, does the blue bearing sit ontop of that?


    and also the steerer tube is well long, can i cut this myself?
    20131023_120043.jpg

    and finally on the first pic if you look at the steerer tube and follow it down, you can see the bottom bearing then under that theres a rubber washer, on the new forks theres no washer. i think i may end up damaging the rubber washer trying to get it out of the original forks, are you supposed to get new ones when changing forks?
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    If that thing on the steerer tube is a compression washer it's on upside down (goes on top of the bearing) but it looks like a crown race. Which goes under the bottom bearing on top of the fork crown.
    You will need to swap the crown race over whatever unless you are buying a new headset) and the rubber thing is probably a seal, so leave it out and your bearing will be fubared very quickly.

    I suggest you read Parktools below.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

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  • From memory the compression washer on the top of your steerer goes above the top bearing (As already said its upside down in your pic). Also as cooldad said you need to swap the crown race over from your old fork the is a bit of a recess in between the forks and crown race if you look, I managed to get a little flat bleaded screwdriver in there (switch between suspension and rigid forks on my 8.1) and twist it then work my way round carefully till it is off. Its quite tricky but seen as your removing it from scrap you wont have to worry about scratching the fork tops :)

    If you get stuck re-assembly give us a shout and i will strip and send you pics of my rockrider so you know the order but its straightforward once you put it back together :)
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    okay thanks for all replies and offers for help.

    so first ive taken the washer right at the bottom of the steerer with a flat blade and it came of nicely. so thats on the new fork. im looking up what fork crown means as im not sure. okay so a crown race like you say cool goes under the bottom bearing,well if you look at the pic with the mudguard you can just see the crown race infact its the thing i called washer that i got off with a screw driver.

    i took the bits to my local bike shop and he said what you did cool, that the compression washer is on wrong, thing is when everything came flying off that compression washer was the only thing left on the way you see it pictured(and the bottom bearing and crown race). so im thinking it must have been placed in wrong in manufacturing.

    kinda glad i damaged my forks now because i can now raise the handle bars,something i couldnt do with my old forks as the steerer was short(maybe some adapters could have sorted it not sure). im just not sure how much to cut the steerer now, i'll have to look into the pro's and cons of higher handle bars, which means i maybe riding around with a bare metal steerer poking out.

    hey danny i would be highly greatful if you could strip and send us pics as like i said that compression washer was the only thing left on so basically it was like that before i opened my headset. also notice the bearing on the table has a thin washer over it, when i picked it up of the floor it was stuck to it like it is in the pic, do you know if thats correctly placed?

    would it be a good idea to put red rubber grease on the rubber bits, i have normal grease too to smear on the bearings?
  • BigAlBigAl Posts: 3,122
    DannyJames wrote:
    i will strip and send you pics of my rockrider

    Now there's an offer!
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    cooldad wrote:
    I suggest you read Parktools below.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    No way was the compression ring on upside down or your bars etc would have been wobbly as censored .
    You also can't have bare steerer tube poking out the top as you won't be able to pre load the bearings.
    You can stack spacers on top of the stem.
    So...
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    cooldad wrote:
    cooldad wrote:
    I suggest you read Parktools below.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    cooldad wrote:
    No way was the compression ring on upside down or your bars etc would have been wobbly as censored .
    You also can't have bare steerer tube poking out the top as you won't be able to pre load the bearings.
    You can stack spacers on top of the stem.
    So...

    I could have put it on upside down because I did take it off before a photo's it. So how come it was the last thing that was on there, could it not go under the top bearing? But wouldn't it make its way down the bar then after time?

    I fixed it all together but there was slight play in the headset. I just loosened everything and tightened it again and it was gone.
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    cooldad wrote:
    cooldad wrote:
    cooldad wrote:
    I suggest you read Parktools below.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    cheers dude reading now
  • TaDA,

    DSC_0579_zps6f71cd6a.jpg

    I think you sussed the bottom out the top is as per pic, If you want to lift the bars up you need to fit more spacers to lift the stem up, The top of the stem (where the cap goes) has to be slightly higher than the top of the steerer to preload the bearings as Cooldad says and take his hint and search the parktools site or similar because if you cut the steerer too short you will be in trouble :wink:
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    Tada.
    Teach a man to fish.
    Etc.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    nice one danny man, i actually have it set like that at the moment, yep got you on the steerer has to be slightly lower than the stem or spacer. originally the rockrider had 2 5mill spacers under the stem. now it has a 5mm and a 10mm under the stem and a 10mm ontop of the stem and the steerer is maybe 5mm under the spacer, will take a pic tomorrow.

    went to bike shop again and another guy said you just want max 30mm worth of spacers under stem, anymore and it will put too much pressure on the bearings plus steering wont be as good, he said i could get a more upright stem if i wanted to heighten my handle bars.

    im thinking of cutting the steerer again to the original size because i hear fork manufactures have a limit or something on how high the stem should be on their forks, so im guessing btwin has just 10mm of spacers for a reason maybe.

    anyways thanks again going to bed now
  • cooldadcooldad Posts: 32,599
    He's talking rubbish.
    Leave it, ride it and cut it when you know what feels right.
    You can fiddle by shifting spacers above and below the stem.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • cooldad wrote:
    He's talking rubbish.
    Leave it, ride it and cut it when you know what feels right.
    You can fiddle by shifting spacers above and below the stem.

    +1 sounds like he was after selling a stem :roll:
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,804
    muggs wrote:
    went to bike shop again and another guy said you just want max 30mm worth of spacers under stem, anymore and it will put too much pressure on the bearings plus steering wont be as good, he said i could get a more upright stem if i wanted to heighten my handle bars.
    Either a moron or a crook, the leverage on the bearings comes from the height of the grips above the bearings however that is achived it will mean the same load, either of which is a tiny load compared to hammering up a 3" step anyway.
    Current steed - Whyte T129, 2013 frame, mongrel Revelations, Giant dropper, Stans S1 wheelset. 12, Magura Trail Sport brakes, 1x11. 12.8Kg
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    Damn too late, I cut it after coming from the bike shop, I did some quick research before I cut it and that's when I came across fork manufactures having a certain limit for stem height. Well I guess I got another 15mm extra Over the original.
  • muggsmuggs Posts: 15
    what do you think?

    20131024_181507.jpg


    hey danny, that third ring down, think its a compression ring....well did you notice a split in it like mine had? i still dont get why my compression ring was the last thing on the steerer when everything flew off.

    edit actually danny i can see the split, so guess it was put in under the bearing instead of on top of it.
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