Struggling up steep hills. Change chainring or cassette?

dubcat

My bike has a 10sp 12-25T cassette on the back and 50/34 tooth chainrings. I struggle up a few of the steeper hills in my area. Is it worth changing something gearing wise or should I persevere with what I have? If I should change something what should I change and to what?

mfin

Dubcat wrote:

My bike has a 10sp 12-25T cassette on the back and 50/34 tooth chainrings. I struggle up a few of the steeper hills in my area. Is it worth changing something gearing wise or should I persevere with what I have? If I should change something what should I change and to what?

Well, you're already running a compact chainset, so persevere as you say or you can get a cassette with with a 26,27,28...

(Or, get fitter / lose weight / don't ride such steep hills / try harder / change to triple and relevant shifters and front mech)

...most sensible if you're gonna do it is probably to try a 12-27, you'll notice it (your location says Surrey though so surely there's nothing too steep).

nochekmate

Changing cassette is the easiest/cheapest option and given that you are running a 50/34T compact already then changing that is not really a viable option as previous poster stated.

To be honest with a combination of 34/25 all you should really need is a few miles in the legs as this should be more than good enough for most climbs.

dubcat

Thanks guys. If the gearing I have is a good middle ground I will work harder and mtfu

mfin

Its not middle ground gearing. It's low gearing for surrey.

antfly

Isn't Leith Hill in Surrey ? Most people use a 27 or lower cassette anyway, 25 isn't that low for hills.

chrisaonabike

I use a 30T for Leith and White Down.

I could get up them both on 34/28 which was my lowest gear before I changed the cassette but 30 is noticeably easier on the knees.

Just ignore anyone that's so lacking in imagination that they think that because they can easily get up Surrey hills on a 53/11 at 40mph, so can everyone else.

trek_dan

Change to an 11-28. No shame in running gears appropriate to your climbing ability, better to spin up hills slowly in a low gear than ruin your knees.

zingaiya

I got an 11-32 to replace my 11-28 so I have a chance of getting over the Pennines. Only reason I didn't get the 11-34 was because it probably wouldn't fit.

slowbike

mfin wrote:

(your location says Surrey though so surely there's nothing too steep).

How steep is too steep ... where I am is similar geology to Surrey - I can get to 8%, 13%, 15% or 17% gradients on my way home.
None of these are long climbs - just "short" and sharp.
You can ride up them on a 39/26 - in fact I've ridden up to 25% on that combination - I wouldn't want to do it too frequently though - it's faster to do it on a lower ratio ...

For the OP - easiest way is to get a 28/11 cassette - you can then train yourself for some climbs by not using the bottom gear, but it's still there as a getout ...

northpole

I would suggest you fit a new cassette with minimum 27 tooth large ring. When I first changed from 25 to 27 cassette it made a huge difference and more often than not, now provides a psychological comfort that, should I need to, I can change into the 27.

Everyone is different and you may end up preferring to run with a triple to get over the worst climbs. However, this is an expensive option and quite a change having to manage three front rings instead of two.

I would also be inclined to run with 12 on the small cassette ring instead of 11 - it slightly reduces the gap between gears across the range which should provide a marginally more linear change up/ down. (Unless you are a speed demon on the descents - I find in Surrey Hills that I spin out in short order!).

Peter

carrock

fit a 30 tooth cassette if your derailleur will cope with it-

I have done this and get up 25% gradients on a 39 tooth chainring.

And I am 16 stone.

elderone

Ignore the heroes,who get up everything on a 25.If they do then bully for them.Stick a 30 on the back if it will or biggest you can get on there.I don,t understand this mtfu crap.It,s riding a bicycle for fun ffs not going into battle.

slowbike

carrock wrote:

fit a 30 tooth cassette if your derailleur will cope with it-

I have done this and get up 25% gradients on a 39 tooth chainring.

And I am 16 stone.

The OP has a compact chainset - so 34/50

Your 39/30 combination gives 34inches
To get 34 inches on a 34 compact set he needs a 26 rear cog.
His current 34/25 combo gives him 36" ...

A triple with 30/39/50 and 26-11 would give him a lowest gear of 30" - about the same as a 34/30 combo.

The OP says he struggles up some of the steeper stuff - so he does make it then .. ?

chrisaonabike

elderone wrote:

Ignore the heroes,who get up everything on a 25.If they do then bully for them.

It's not the fact that they can do it that winds me up - I have the greatest admiration for the guys that come hurtling past me and into the distance, on hills where I'm only just not falling off on my 34/30... it's that they spout crap such as "surely anyone can do X hill in Y gear", when what they mean is that they can.

I shouldn't let it annoy me, but it does ... muppets... :roll:

shamrock134

Is there anything steeper/longer than White Down Lane in Surrey? Just curious, as that is the longest steep & sustained climb without much rest I've found so far.

drlodge

Dubcat wrote:

My bike has a 10sp 12-25T cassette on the back and 50/34 tooth chainrings. I struggle up a few of the steeper hills in my area. Is it worth changing something gearing wise or should I persevere with what I have? If I should change something what should I change and to what?

You will certainly find a 27 or 28 cog easier and if a new cassette is cheap then go for it.

I have a 34/50 with 12-27 cassette, and I can tell you there is quite a big difference between the 25 and the 27 cogs. I went up the south approach to Leith Hill yesterday, with a bit of illness so taking it gently. My Garmin showing its about 12% and I remained seated in bottom gear, HR was a relaxed 164 and I actually got a PR up it! On the steeper climbs like Whitedown, Coombe and Barhatch where it gets to 20% or so, I would really struggle in the 25 cog, the 27 is definately needed.

Assuming you are Shimano, try and get a cheap 12-28 cassette and give it a go.

drlodge

shamrock134 wrote:

Is there anything steeper/longer than White Down Lane in Surrey?

Yes - Barhatch Lane, 21% at the top and its a lot longer. Starts off around 10-12% but then ramps right up at the end.

The climb to Leith Hill via Cold Harbour is longer and quite tough, but not as steep. I think this is the highest ascent segment on Strava I have done.

styxd

I would say persevere with what you have, 34/25 is really a low gear, especially considering what people used to ride hills on.

If you can't manage to climb a hill with a 34/25 then you need to question your fitness really. If you keep going with a 34/25 then your fitness will increase and you'll find the hills you're struggling with at the moment, straightforward.

zingaiya

styxd wrote:

If you can't manage to climb a hill with a 34/25 then you need to question your fitness really. If you keep going with a 34/25 then your fitness will increase and you'll find the hills you're struggling with at the moment, straightforward.

With the best will in the world, bollocks.
I live in the bottom of a valley. I'm a fatty, and if I want to get anywhere even vaguely interesting, I have to go up some fairly hefty hills. Changing my cassette has given me the ability to escape the valley and go for some longish rides, which will do a damned sight more for my fitness than being disheartened by the feeling of an imminent heart attack trying to grind up a hill within seconds of leaving the front door.

styxd

Well yeh, if you're fat then use whatever gears you want. Or get a motorised scooter.

I just assumed average cyclists build.

navrig

styxd wrote:

If you can't manage to climb a hill with a 34/25 then you need to question your fitness really. If you keep going with a 34/25 then your fitness will increase and you'll find the hills you're struggling with at the moment, straightforward.

He doesn't say he can't manage, he struggles. If he is riding with mates and they leave him behind because he is struggling surely he is better to change his cassette so he can keep up the cadence and gradually improve his fitness.

Don't give up the day job and take up sports coaching! :roll:

styxd wrote:

I just assumed average cyclists build.

With the current trend and take up of cycling the average cyclist build is probably verging on the tubby side. Why? Because they want to get fit/trim down in which case I refer you to my comment above.....

chrisaonabike

styxd wrote:

Well yeh, if you're fat then use whatever gears you want....I just assumed average cyclists build.

Well I'm not fat. 5'9", 73kg. I can sit here 'questioning my fitness' all I want, but it doesn't change the fact that there are hills in Surrey I couldn't get up on a 34/25 at all, get up but hurt my knees with 34/28, and can now get up comfortably on 34/30.

What do you suggest? Change to a 25T, and either fail to get up the hills or injure my knees, or carry on with the 30T, and gradually get faster and stronger over time?

It's what's known as a no-brainer. As is having the opinion that everyone should be able to get up hills on 34/25, although the term no-brainer has a slightly different meaning in the latter case.

:roll:

Edit: I think in future it will just save me some typing if I reply "tw4t" to posts like this. Nothing personal, think of it just as an abbreviation.

paul2718

Judging from the OP's Strava link he isn't unfit or fat. He already has a low gear, certainly in the context of the Surrey hills. He doesn't have many cycling miles logged, and they are mostly offroad type rides. So the obvious advice is to live with it for a while and see if the strength comes.

In general I think the rush to ever lower gears is to be slightly resisted. This is because most of us don't live and ride routinely amongst the steepest or longest hills we will ever want to ride. If you use a 34x30 for Leith then what will you do in the Alps, or the Peak District, or Cornwall?

Additionally if you fit a cassette with a very wide spread then you always have big gaps between your low gears, so you can't just go up or down one as the gradient varies and hold a cadence and effort. The whole compromise is worth considering.

And in this case I think the OP has a Bianchi, probably fitted with Campagnolo, so the range of compatible cassettes may be rather narrower. 13-29 is available, but 50x13 as a top gear might be too low.

Paul

elderone

styxd wrote:

Well yeh, if you're fat then use whatever gears you want. Or get a motorised scooter.

I just assumed average cyclists build.

wow what a guy,you really need a long hard look inside yourself.You must have one hell of a tiny penis.

white91

Grab a 11-28 cassette, best thing I did to my bike, have a great bailout gear now for when I hit the wall, forget the idiots who claim to ride everything on a 53/39 11/23, all thats left is to learn to love the hills

rolf_f

paul2718 wrote:

Additionally if you fit a cassette with a very wide spread then you always have big gaps between your low gears, so you can't just go up or down one as the gradient varies and hold a cadence and effort. The whole compromise is worth considering.

If you are in hilly country, the gaps don't really matter as the terrain will always be less subtle than a one tooth change at the back.

Assuming you are already running a decent cadence, the right cassette is probably simply the one that covers your needs 95% of the time. And in hilly country, a high proportion of your time is spent climbing so, tbh, only a fool would recommend you compromise that. It's all really down to the scale of what you have to deal with. You hear lots of people say you don't really need much more than a compact with 25 or 26 for the Alps - I went for 29 and was reasonably quick; I'd certainly have been slower even with my 27.

Incidentally, my Alpine cassette was Campagnolo 11-29; made up of an 11-25 and a 13-29. You can splice Campag cassettes together perfectly nicely!

Downward

white91 wrote:

Grab a 11-28 cassette, best thing I did to my bike, have a great bailout gear now for when I hit the wall, forget the idiots who claim to ride everything on a 53/39 11/23, all thats left is to learn to love the hills

Agree
I went to a 12-28 after 3 years of struggling up the big hills on a 11-25 compact. Infact the major hill that I have never managed to get up I cracked on the 12-28 even after being off the bike for a couple of weeks. It makes a hell of a difference and makes hill climbing more bearable.

paul2718

Good information about Campagnolo cassettes.

I disagree about the gaps though, it's a significant compromise to run gears you seldom need.

FWIW I run 11-25 most of the time, 11-28 when it's hilly, and swap to a compact for special occasions. Part of it is attitude, if I can get up the Galibier on anything then Leith doesn't intimidate me, even on 39x25. If I decide I need 34x28 or lower to ascend Leith then how do I get into the right frame of mind for the Galibier? (names of climbs are indicative only...)

Paul

philbar72

Seems like something with a 27 or 28 tooth is the way forward at least in the interim. I'm surprised no ones really asked your style of riding, as that helps. Most spin up the steeper climbs where possible, I know I do. With a 28 on some makes there is a big step up to 24 teeth so it's best just to amble up in the lowest gear, on the steepest climbs.

I get up some of the steeper ones (like crocknorth) on an 11/25 with it in second bottom gear sometime as well... Just depends, but my cadence sometimes drops below 60, it just depends how comfy I am with the climb. Sounds, though like you'd benefit from a 12/27 or 11/28.

gingermagician

drlodge wrote:

shamrock134 wrote:

Is there anything steeper/longer than White Down Lane in Surrey?

Yes - Barhatch Lane, 21% at the top and its a lot longer. Starts off around 10-12% but then ramps right up at the end.

The climb to Leith Hill via Cold Harbour is longer and quite tough, but not as steep. I think this is the highest ascent segment on Strava I have done.

For me, Chalkpit Lane is tougher than either Barhatch or White Downs - the c.20% stretch after the hairpin is more sustained and unrelenting than anything the other two can offer.

Barhatch is a bit overrated, IMO. It's steep at the top, but the rest of the climb has plenty of spot where you can recover.