Planet X Kaffenback 2

rubertoe
rubertoe Posts: 3,994
edited November 2014 in Road buying advice
Was going to buy a Ribble 525 for a winter/commuter/tourer.

Planet X sent me an email to this
Should I get it? and why?

Bare in mind that I am only allowed 1 bike (the focus and peugoet are going as well as 2 x weelsets, shifters, and basically all that i own bike wise) and this will need to get me to work and home all through the week and all other riding.

And I have a Max budget of £800 (plus maybe another £100 at a push) so what else should i be looking at, 700c, steel, Discs, Steel (£800).

Thoughts?
"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
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Comments

  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    I think you should buy it... Planet X has gone through a lot of hassle over the years to copy the Genesis Croix de Fer and propose the same product at a lower price... it is a nice bike, that does everything... it is not a road bike, it is not a competitive cross bike, but it can do both well for the amateur cyclist... most importantly it can take all sorts of tyres, from 23 mm to 40-45 mm. The BB7 disc brakes are a revelation, once you go disc, you don't want to go back to thrashed rims disappearing pads

    Get it, it's nice!
    left the forum March 2023
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    ugo - look at the sig for my focus. Discs....
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • 16mm
    16mm Posts: 545
    The PX is a lump, especially the steel disk forks.
    But it will take tires up to (and maybe over) schwabe marathon winters, so you should never have to ride another bike.

    It depends on what you want. It won't feel anything like as nippy as your cross bike, so if you want an exciting ride it's maybe not for you. The ribble may feel the same though. And I've road raced against someone on a kaffenback...
    Kaffenbacks have been around for years, (2006 BR review)? I don't think they copied the (2010) croix de fer?
  • Monty Dog
    Monty Dog Posts: 20,614
    I had one of the original blue Kaffs - it rode a lot more like a road bike than a CX bike - I was running one with a front disc about 9 years ago, before Genesis bikes existed!
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
  • Barteos
    Barteos Posts: 657
    edited August 2013
    It's a nice bike. Better tyre clearance and disc brakes - no brainer.

    Whether this "lump" is going to be fast and nippy or not depends only on the rider and the setup :wink:
  • night_porter
    night_porter Posts: 888
    Unlike some people who offer their opinion I actually own a Kaffenback 2 which has Sram Rival on it. I do not consider it a lump at all, yes it is slightly heavier than my Defy or carbon PX but once up to speed it rides perfectly and it has the advantage of larger tyres and disk brakes so will cope with winter much better.

    It is a steel framed road bike and makes a very good winter trainer/tourer/commuter and it is definitely not a copy of Genesis' cross bike, as said before the Kaffenback has been around a lot longer than the CDF and was always a steel trainer.
  • redvee
    redvee Posts: 11,922
    I built a K1 up in March. The two main reasons I went with the Kaffenback were the disc brakes and the location of the rear calliper on the chainstay. I've noticed MK2 Kaffenbacks have the disc mount on the seatstay which makes the choice in pannier racks a bit limited.
    I've added a signature to prove it is still possible.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    16mm wrote:
    The PX is a lump, especially the steel disk forks.
    But it will take tires up to (and maybe over) schwabe marathon winters, so you should never have to ride another bike.

    It depends on what you want. It won't feel anything like as nippy as your cross bike, so if you want an exciting ride it's maybe not for you. The ribble may feel the same though. And I've road raced against someone on a kaffenback...
    Kaffenbacks have been around for years, (2006 BR review)? I don't think they copied the (2010) croix de fer?

    THe Genesis was disc pre 2010, but it had a carbon fork. At the time I was looking at something like that and the only two available were the Genesis and Focus Mares disc which was not available anywhere in early 2010 when I got the CdF. Didn't spot the Kaffenback then.
    Anyway, more importantly, I had very exciting rides with it, you need a good road/off road for an exciting ride, not 5 K worth of glorified plastic... :wink:
    left the forum March 2023
  • Ber Nard
    Ber Nard Posts: 827
    This was exactly the bike I was looking for last year and would have snapped it up no question. I think it's a bargain.

    Personally, it wouldn't be a replacement for any of my road bikes, not even my winter bike. Unless it's for load lugging or riding in really bad weather (snow and ice) I'd go for the Ribble. Seeing as you ride a cross bike, the versatility may be important to you.

    Rob
  • ownerofpi
    ownerofpi Posts: 108
    night_porter wrote:
    Unlike some people who offer their opinion I actually own a Kaffenback 2 which has Sram Rival on it. I do not consider it a lump at all, yes it is slightly heavier than my Defy or carbon PX but once up to speed it rides perfectly and it has the advantage of larger tyres and disk brakes so will cope with winter much better.

    It is a steel framed road bike and makes a very good winter trainer/tourer/commuter and it is definitely not a copy of Genesis' cross bike, as said before the Kaffenback has been around a lot longer than the CDF and was always a steel trainer.

    Sorry to butt in but I am also considering one of these as a winter bike/commuter (as well as debating a CX too). How do you find the steel fork when it comes to road buzz/comfort? (I've been riding a carbon forked bike for the last few years and havn't tried any other fork hence my asking!)

    The 525 from Ribble is also on my short list.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    ownerofpi wrote:
    night_porter wrote:
    Unlike some people who offer their opinion I actually own a Kaffenback 2 which has Sram Rival on it. I do not consider it a lump at all, yes it is slightly heavier than my Defy or carbon PX but once up to speed it rides perfectly and it has the advantage of larger tyres and disk brakes so will cope with winter much better.

    It is a steel framed road bike and makes a very good winter trainer/tourer/commuter and it is definitely not a copy of Genesis' cross bike, as said before the Kaffenback has been around a lot longer than the CDF and was always a steel trainer.

    Sorry to butt in but I am also considering one of these as a winter bike/commuter (as well as debating a CX too). How do you find the steel fork when it comes to road buzz/comfort? (I've been riding a carbon forked bike for the last few years and havn't tried any other fork hence my asking!)

    The 525 from Ribble is also on my short list.

    I have a steel fork on my CdF, which is the same thing, basically. Yes, it can be a bit harsh, but it's not the material, it's because it has no "rake", or better "no curve"... you can invest another 200 quid and the get the Lynskey carbon fork, but it's a bit OTT to be honest
    left the forum March 2023
  • 16mm
    16mm Posts: 545
    night_porter wrote:
    Unlike some people who offer their opinion I actually own a Kaffenback 2 which has Sram Rival on it. I do not consider it a lump at all, yes it is slightly heavier than my Defy or carbon PX but once up to speed it rides perfectly and it has the advantage of larger tyres and disk brakes so will cope with winter much better.
    I offered the opinion the keffenback is a lump. And I do currently own a kaff. It's not a slow bike in a straight line, but they're heavy, and it feels like you're steering a boat out of the saddle.

    Offroad it's great, but on road it handles like a steady tourer.

    I make these comparisons to a Basso road bike, and Fondriest crosser.

    It's a great bike, but I'd need to also own an 'exciting' bike.
  • ben16v
    ben16v Posts: 296
    saw this too, think about replacing my winter bike with a do it all, anyone know how heavy it is?
    i need more bikes
  • 16mm
    16mm Posts: 545
    ben16v wrote:
    saw this too, think about replacing my winter bike with a do it all, anyone know how heavy it is?

    Old School Heavy as fsck. Winter, do it all, lightweight. For less than a grand, choose two.
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    is this new Kaff different from the old Kaff?

    When did you get your kaff 16mm?
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • 16mm
    16mm Posts: 545
    edited August 2013
    Mine is a swapout kaff. If the new K2 weighed much less then PX would be on about it in all the advertising.
    SInce they're not I assume it weighs about the same.

    The K2 is 24.5 lbs, 11kg.
    http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/CBP ... _road_bike

    Add a couple of waterbottles and it's about twice the UCI limit ;-)
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    Not sure the weight limit really applies to a commuter who weighs slightly more than your average tour rider.. :roll:
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • 16mm
    16mm Posts: 545
    rubertoe wrote:
    Not sure the weight limit really applies to a commuter who weighs slightly more than your average tour rider.. :roll:
    Ben16v asked, and the weight backs up the label ' lump'. It doesn't matter that it's 11kg, but it does weigh almost 2 bikes.

    On the plus side, once it gets up to speed it rolls great. :D
  • night_porter
    night_porter Posts: 888
    The Kaff 2 steel fork has a very nice curve to it so it feels exactly the same as a carbon fork, if anything it is a little softer on the hands. That is why I bought a steel bike anyway because steel is more forgiving and the fatter tyres give a softer ride. Think of it as a comfortable go anywhere bike that will carry a load and you won't go far wrong.

    As for the weight that only matters if you use the "pick up a bike to see if it any good" method. Mine has a compact chainset with an 11-32 cassette and I believe I could climb anything on it. Would I use it for racing, well at 57 I don't do racing anyway so no. Would it be good for sportive/audax/lejog/touring/commuting/training/etc. yes it would so it counts as a do it all bike to me.
  • ben16v
    ben16v Posts: 296
    cheers, my winter bike is 10kg so wouldnt be too bad, although after guards and a rack would add a few more g`s.
    will keep an eye on it!
    i need more bikes
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    Why is this so damn hard?

    Any other suggestions for do it all bikes (rack and full guards, Disc brakes) around the £800 mark?
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    rubertoe wrote:
    Why is this so damn hard?

    Any other suggestions for do it all bikes (rack and full guards, Disc brakes) around the £800 mark?

    I don't think the PX kaffenbeck can be matched as Value for money... the only reason not to get one is because you don't like it!
    In fact I don't understand what is hard about your choice... I find it very easy... :D
    left the forum March 2023
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    rubertoe wrote:
    Why is this so damn hard?

    Any other suggestions for do it all bikes (rack and full guards, Disc brakes) around the £800 mark?

    I don't think the PX kaffenbeck can be matched as Value for money... the only reason not to get one is because you don't like it!
    In fact I don't understand what is hard about your choice... I find it very easy... :D

    I know your right, I am just trying to convince myself that I am missing something...
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    rubertoe wrote:
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    rubertoe wrote:
    Why is this so damn hard?

    Any other suggestions for do it all bikes (rack and full guards, Disc brakes) around the £800 mark?

    I don't think the PX kaffenbeck can be matched as Value for money... the only reason not to get one is because you don't like it!
    In fact I don't understand what is hard about your choice... I find it very easy... :D

    I know your right, I am just trying to convince myself that I am missing something...

    The WWW has made us all paranoid that we are missing on the best possible deal.. it is a form of FOMO (fear of missing out)... get over it, even if a better deal was to be found somewhere, you still get a pretty amazing bike for 800 quid, which is great value.

    Remember the constant search for the lowest price has only resulted in job losses in the western world and lower quality across the board... we have been fooled into believing this is a better and more efficient system, hence the lower prices, but it's not... it's just modern days slavery and crap manufacturing...
    Modern components are shamefully pathetitc... in this context the PX Kaffenback stands out... :wink:
    left the forum March 2023
  • YIMan
    YIMan Posts: 576
    rubertoe wrote:
    Why is this so damn hard?

    Any other suggestions for do it all bikes (rack and full guards, Disc brakes) around the £800 mark?

    It's not hard. Buy the similary specced Genesis Croix de Fer for £1150 then beat yourself up about it if you want to make it harder on yourself.

    PS - I've just ordered one on Cyclescheme.....
  • samsbike
    samsbike Posts: 942
    YIMan wrote:
    rubertoe wrote:
    Why is this so damn hard?

    Any other suggestions for do it all bikes (rack and full guards, Disc brakes) around the £800 mark?

    It's not hard. Buy the similary specced Genesis Croix de Fer for £1150 then beat yourself up about it if you want to make it harder on yourself.

    PS - I've just ordered one on Cyclescheme.....

    Is the key difference between teh cdf and kaffenback the weight?

    I am thinking of getting one to replace my genesis equilibrium in the new year, but am unsure of which one.
  • night_porter
    night_porter Posts: 888
    Well the Croix de Fer is heavier (reported as 12kg) but I think you will find the key difference is about £350 more for the Genesis. You could always buy the cheaper CDF but it has lower spec components and brakes.

    As far as the bikes are concerned the CDF is "marketed" as a cyclo cross bike for the road whereas the Kaffenback is a road bike. Planet X's cross bike is the Uncle John.

    As Ugo said the Kaff 2 is the best valued steel all rounder you can buy at the moment.
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    Ordered.
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • ben16v
    ben16v Posts: 296
    damn it the new genesis has mounted the disc inside the rear triangle which seen as i would want a rack is a big deal, how easy have anyone else with the genesis/kaffenback gotten round the mounting issues?
    i need more bikes
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    ben16v wrote:
    damn it the new genesis has mounted the disc inside the rear triangle which seen as i would want a rack is a big deal, how easy have anyone else with the genesis/kaffenback gotten round the mounting issues?

    I have fitted a Blackburn Expedition 1 disc, which mounts through the skewer... I've had it for 3 years with no issues (except if you puncture, which is a bit of a pain, but not a major one)
    left the forum March 2023

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