Andy Murray

heavymental

Ballysmate wrote:

Heavymental wrote:

Ballysmate wrote:

Heavymental wrote:

Ballysmate wrote:

I am half Scots, half English, bit of a British mongrel really and have always regarded myself as British .
Andy Murray's remark about supporting anybody playing England was obviously light hearted, but struck a nerve with a lot of people because that attitude is becoming perceived more prevalent north of the border.
As regards Murray himself? He is not exactly a ray of sunshine, is he?
If I hear him described as a dour Scots tw@t, it is hard to mount any defence.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... CMP=twt_gu

"So Murray isn't going to win the Merryville Festival of Grins any time soon. What difference does it make to you, you needy pr1cks? Can't he just play tennis without having to turn around after each point and pull a happy face just for you, like he's your dad watering plants in the garden and you're a toddler watching him through the kitchen window? What do you want, a tennis champion or Mister Tumble? Make your mind up, because you're not getting both."

Please show me in my post where I said I wanted him to be champion or I wanted him to change his personality. I don't give a flying f*ck about tennis or him really. I didn't even mention tennis and I remarked that he was perceived as dour. So you are quite correct, it makes no difference to me.
If you are going to start calling me a prick, please take the trouble to read the post properly.
Prick

Sigh. It's a quote from the linked article. How ironic.

I am aware it is a quote.I read the article you linked. It is an entire paragraph lifted from the article.
You posted a link and then to really draw attention to the point you were making, you lifted a paragraph and linked it specifically to what I had written.
Not ironic at all.

It's like you're reading my mind, man!

seanoconn

Heavymental wrote:

Ballysmate wrote:

I am half Scots, half English, bit of a British mongrel really and have always regarded myself as British .
Andy Murray's remark about supporting anybody playing England was obviously light hearted, but struck a nerve with a lot of people because that attitude is becoming perceived more prevalent north of the border.
As regards Murray himself? He is not exactly a ray of sunshine, is he?
If I hear him described as a dour Scots tw@t, it is hard to mount any defence.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... CMP=twt_gu

"So Murray isn't going to win the Merryville Festival of Grins any time soon. What difference does it make to you, you needy pr1cks? Can't he just play tennis without having to turn around after each point and pull a happy face just for you, like he's your dad watering plants in the garden and you're a toddler watching him through the kitchen window? What do you want, a tennis champion or Mister Tumble? Make your mind up, because you're not getting both."

Think you're quoting the wrong post there, Ballysmate's post is the most balanced so far. Murray doesn't always come across well in front of the cameras and of course the 'likability' factor is going to play a part in whether Joe public wish him success or failure.

I can remember the days when Jeremy Bates limping into the last 16 at Wimbledon was the highlight of the British tennis year. Murray's a great player, he's British and I'll be cheering him on.

As an 18 year old he makes a throwaway, lighthearted comment about not supporting England and that makes him racist! Barmy For starters he was joking and even if he wasn't, I know a lot of Scotch( ) and most of them love to see England getting stuffed at football. It's not a big deal, they're just jealous

Go Murray!

heavymental

thegreatdivide wrote:

The BBC doc about him that was on a few weeks ago was a bit of an eye opener for me tbh. He didn’t come across as dour at all - and I wasn’t aware that he was in the school during the Dunblaine shootings – that’s not something you’re average sporting ‘personality’ has had to deal with in their life.

To be honest, spend 5 minutes watching youtube vids of Murray or reading a few articles and you'll find him to be far from dour.

Andy Murray admits being boring in news conferences to avoid rows... http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/22721532

Hope he cruises through the semi today. Be good to see him in another final.

Pituophis

Jesus, what was supposed to be a jokey comment has certainly fell a bit flat :oops:

It was supposed to be a light hearted comment that everyone can say what they want about the English, but it's considered racist when the English say anything back, so I just tried to turn it around :roll: I wish I hadn't bothered now as it seem to be correct. :roll:

crescent

On a more general note, how many British sports 'stars'in the past have had the support of the nation because they were likeable, cheeky chappies? I'm thinking along the lines of Frank Bruno, Eddie Edwards, maybe even Tim Henman to a lesser extent. In other words the classic plucky losers who actually achieved very little of note. Murray has actually won a number of meaningful titles within his field and is no different to many other top sportsmen/women in the sense that he has a 'game face' when he is playing. Mark Cavendish for instance does not seem the most humorous of people when he is at work, but very successful. Murray's "anyone but England" quote was misguided and probably intended as humour. I'm sure the journalist who asked the question was delighted to recieve the response he obviously wanted and I'm also certain there are plenty of English people who are now happy to have a justifiable reason to dislike him without seeming slightly racist themselves.

The Little Onion

Pross wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Stevo 666 wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Having little interest in tennis, but being English, I don't care who wins so long as it's not Andy Murray

It's a win-win situation really. If he wins he's British, if he loses he's Scottish

No, I'm afraid he will always be an anti English "racist" to me.
It's not cool to remember that though

Really? That probably says a lot more about your thin skin than anything about Murray. If saying he supports whoever plays England in an obvious attempt at banter whilst still (from memory) being a teenager constitutes "racism" in your world then at least you can't have many serious problems there.

To be honest I hate all the nationalistic stuff that a bit of British success brings out at this time of year in what is a sport that's all about personal glory. However, that was a brilliant game of tennis and seeing the way Murray has transformed his physical fitness and mental strength over the last 6 or 7 years shows what you can achieve by hard work to go with talent.

Ah yes, tennis players transforming their physical fitness. Nothing dodgy about the way that happens. No suspicions at all.

(I don't necessarily think that Murray's fitness regime is more dodgy than anyone elses, rather that there is a general cloud over tennis in general. Although there are some spanish male players and US female players who seem particularly dodgy).

ballysmate

Heavymental wrote:

thegreatdivide wrote:

The BBC doc about him that was on a few weeks ago was a bit of an eye opener for me tbh. He didn’t come across as dour at all - and I wasn’t aware that he was in the school during the Dunblaine shootings – that’s not something you’re average sporting ‘personality’ has had to deal with in their life.

To be honest, spend 5 minutes watching youtube vids of Murray or reading a few articles and you'll find him to be far from dour.

Andy Murray admits being boring in news conferences to avoid rows... http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/22721532

Hope he cruises through the semi today. Be good to see him in another final.

So Andy Murray deliberately portrays a boring public persona and you take umbrage because that is how he is perceived?
Hmm :?

seanoconn

The Little Onion wrote:

Pross wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Stevo 666 wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Having little interest in tennis, but being English, I don't care who wins so long as it's not Andy Murray

It's a win-win situation really. If he wins he's British, if he loses he's Scottish

No, I'm afraid he will always be an anti English "racist" to me.
It's not cool to remember that though

Really? That probably says a lot more about your thin skin than anything about Murray. If saying he supports whoever plays England in an obvious attempt at banter whilst still (from memory) being a teenager constitutes "racism" in your world then at least you can't have many serious problems there.

To be honest I hate all the nationalistic stuff that a bit of British success brings out at this time of year in what is a sport that's all about personal glory. However, that was a brilliant game of tennis and seeing the way Murray has transformed his physical fitness and mental strength over the last 6 or 7 years shows what you can achieve by hard work to go with talent.

Ah yes, tennis players transforming their physical fitness. Nothing dodgy about the way that happens. No suspicions at all.

(I don't necessarily think that Murray's fitness regime is more dodgy than anyone elses, rather that there is a general cloud over tennis in general. Although there are some spanish male players and US female players who seem particularly dodgy).

I think the French women are in the clear...



Wimbledon finalist Marion Bartoli. Not a good advert for the ladies game.

ballysmate

What you trying to say, Sean?

seanoconn

Ballysmate wrote:

What you trying to say, Sean?

No, I said 'Ladies' game :roll:

MickTup

I'm waiting for the penny to drop it's just a posh over privileged sport and we're sh1t at it. But we have it rammed down our throat for two weeks a year by our lovely BBC. Who employ jolly foreigner as pundits and commentators because we such credibility in the sport. FFS there's a real sport happening at the moment and we're quite good at it.

The Little Onion

With regards privilege, it is worth noting that the longstanding head of the LTA (the governing body for tennis in the UK) recently resigned because despite getting hundreds of millions in lottery and other funding for community work, it has made absolutely no progress towards getting more kids from non-privileged backgrounds into playing the sport.

As for the British/Scottish thing, it is a bit Tebbit-test isn't it? You can either be British or Scottish, but there is no place for complexity or multiple overlapping identities. Mixing in with this is the typical london-centric media idea that English=British.

(to declare my interest, I am a Scot, who has lived in England for nearly a decade, who has an English wife, who would vote against independence, but considers themselves both Scottish and British, although perhaps slightly more of the former than the latter)

MickTup

(made absolutely no progress towards getting more kids from non-privileged backgrounds into playing the sport).
Wonder why? because it's seen as privileged

Wunnunda

MickTup wrote:

(made absolutely no progress towards getting more kids from non-privileged backgrounds into playing the sport).
Wonder why? because it's seen as privileged

In my limited experience as a father of kids who were put off tennis : There is plenty of coaching available for kids as beginners. The problem starts when they move up to 'proper' games, in 'proper' clubs (as opposed to council courts). Then you begin to realise that the adults regard the facilities as a social club for them where they can play the game (sic) of tennis whenever it suits them. The kids are barely tolerated IMO. Now I'd class my kids as relatively privileged and if they are put off then there is no chance that an inner city kid 'from the 'hood' is going to bother. People I have spoken to also say that golf can have similar barriers to entry.

BTW - football, rugby, and cricket don't seem to have the same issues. Because they are team games and have a different ethos?

MickTup

Totally agree both sport for the boys, club for the boys. It's a sports club not a social club their attitude's need changing. Priority should be given to up and coming players not also rans who fancy a knock about. You narrow the field to find the best of what undoubtedly is out there if youngsters aren't encouraged or aloud to play. These club members will probably be the first to moan about the state of the sport. Is there not an academy facility for tennis of the like we have for cycling over in Italy. With the amount of money pumped into it we should have. We didn't become world beaters at cycling without overhauling the structure.

Pross

MickTup wrote:

(made absolutely no progress towards getting more kids from non-privileged backgrounds into playing the sport).
Wonder why? because it's seen as privileged

Didn't look that way when I was watching groups of kids getting coached at Newport Sports Village yesterday whilst my daughter was in her swimming lesson. Maybe there are too many people prepared to trot out the stereotypes nd that perpetuates what may have been the case 20 or 30 years ago. No doubt there are some snobby clubs but there are also some good facilities that are no more elitist than any other sport. I'm not even a big fan of tennis but some of the guff that gets trotted out about the sport is annoying. I can think of a sport where you can splash a grand on equipment and still be the poor relation amongst your rivals by a long way - now that sounds elitist!

Pross

The Little Onion wrote:

Pross wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Stevo 666 wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Having little interest in tennis, but being English, I don't care who wins so long as it's not Andy Murray

It's a win-win situation really. If he wins he's British, if he loses he's Scottish

No, I'm afraid he will always be an anti English "racist" to me.
It's not cool to remember that though

Really? That probably says a lot more about your thin skin than anything about Murray. If saying he supports whoever plays England in an obvious attempt at banter whilst still (from memory) being a teenager constitutes "racism" in your world then at least you can't have many serious problems there.

To be honest I hate all the nationalistic stuff that a bit of British success brings out at this time of year in what is a sport that's all about personal glory. However, that was a brilliant game of tennis and seeing the way Murray has transformed his physical fitness and mental strength over the last 6 or 7 years shows what you can achieve by hard work to go with talent.

Ah yes, tennis players transforming their physical fitness. Nothing dodgy about the way that happens. No suspicions at all.

(I don't necessarily think that Murray's fitness regime is more dodgy than anyone elses, rather that there is a general cloud over tennis in general. Although there are some spanish male players and US female players who seem particularly dodgy).

Yep, I agree - the sport really doesn't help itself on that side of things with its head in the sand attitude. Although I think Murray is one of the few who has spoken out on the subject from memory. That Spaniard was certainly very well developed at 16 - 17 years old!

MickTup

Lets just stick to sitting down sports

Frank the tank

I'm half English, half Scott and I want AM to win cos he's a Brit. If he looks on himself as a Scott and nationalistic fair do's to him,who isn't proud of their country/heritage?

rick_chasey

MickTup wrote:

(made absolutely no progress towards getting more kids from non-privileged backgrounds into playing the sport).
Wonder why? because it's seen as privileged

Only if you care about that stuff

Membership in my village for tennis was cheaper than a season with the local kids football team. I know which was more inclusive and which one you could do without the express permission of the team coach and it wasn't the football.

mfin

Pross wrote:

That Spaniard was certainly very well developed at 16 - 17 years old!

That made you sound so dodgy

mfin

I actually like Murray, I like the fact he's a bit grumpy and down to earth, compared to Tim Henman who all the fat arsed women at Wimbledon were so eager to say 'ooo, he's such a lovely man, what a lovely well spoken chap he is' (puke), Murray is a breath of fresh air. The middle classish nice-boys get on my nerves in all sports, lovely Tim, and people like that 'ooo doesn't he present himself well, what a lovely man' Jonathan God-Bothering Edwards.

Fairdoos to Murray, where he could have hit a level a few years back he's really applied himself and deserves to be where he is I reckon.

jezzpalmer

mfin wrote:

I actually like Murray, I like the fact he's a bit grumpy and down to earth, compared to Tim Henman who all the fat arsed women at Wimbledon were so eager to say 'ooo, he's such a lovely man, what a lovely well spoken chap he is' (puke), Murray is a breath of fresh air. The middle classish nice-boys get on my nerves in all sports, lovely Tim, and people like that 'ooo doesn't he present himself well, what a lovely man' Jonathan God-Bothering Edwards.

Fairdoos to Murray, where he could have hit a level a few years back he's really applied himself and deserves to be where he is I reckon.

+1 this ^

Frank the tank

jezzpalmer wrote:

mfin wrote:

I actually like Murray, I like the fact he's a bit grumpy and down to earth, compared to Tim Henman who all the fat arsed women at Wimbledon were so eager to say 'ooo, he's such a lovely man, what a lovely well spoken chap he is' (puke), Murray is a breath of fresh air. The middle classish nice-boys get on my nerves in all sports, lovely Tim, and people like that 'ooo doesn't he present himself well, what a lovely man' Jonathan God-Bothering Edwards.

Fairdoos to Murray, where he could have hit a level a few years back he's really applied himself and deserves to be where he is I reckon.

+1 this ^

Here, here.

I bet, like me you always wanted Ovett to beat Coe as well.

mfin

Frank the tank wrote:

Here, here.

I bet, like me you always wanted Ovett to beat Coe as well.

Yep, Coe's another one, and as he's got older he's got worse. At the olympics, those speeches he did, :evil: :evil: ...talking about what 'we can achieve'...it was about as inclusive as the Queen saying 'we', it wasn't 'we' Seb, it was either 'I' or 'you', because the second you say 'we' the subsets of 'i' and 'you' must cross, and hardly anybody is like you are they? Most people don't talk like they are in the presence of God wherever they go ...talking so it sounds about as natural as if they are slowly reading from a f**king hymn book.

Yes, I think you can safely say I didn't want Coe to win, and as the voice of the Olympics I think its sh1te that we had such a tosser speaking for us (and I don't care what he organised, loads of people could have done the same job or better), it's not a class thing, as Boris J is likeable, its a god-botheringly and sickeningly polite, 'trying to sound sincere' thing I can't stand.

Just imagine going to the pub with Tim Henman, Seb Coe and Jonathan Edwards. Jesus F***** Christ that would be awful, like going jet-skiing for free and finding you've got to give the two unfunny fatties Lisa Tarbuck and Miranda both a backie all the time you were doing it. Potential fun completely ruined.

Mikey23

Well done to the above poster for alienating almost the whole planet in one rant... Sounds like a severe case of class envy to me

thegreatdivide

It made me laugh. 'Class' posts mfin

daviesee

:P :P :P

8)

Frank the tank

Jocko beats Djocko.

Now "suck my plumbs" you racist b@st@rds.

Stevo_666

Stevo 666 wrote:

Pituophis wrote:

Having little interest in tennis, but being English, I don't care who wins so long as it's not Andy Murray

It's a win-win situation really. If he wins he's British, if he loses he's Scottish

Well done that Brit