First 100 done; now analysis + what next before marmotte?

barrybridges

I'd really like some help & assistance from others if you wouldn't mind sparing it.

I'm training for the marmotte which is just over a month from now. On Saturday I rode the Norwich 100 which was supposed to be my final 'long training ride' before the event, although I realise it's not particularly indicative of Alpine conditions, given that it's pan-flat!

I went round in 5:28 and learnt quite a few things, but now I'm just not sure what I ought to be focussing on in the next 5 weeks, if there's any time left to 'focus' on things at all.

Here's what I took out of the century:

I felt very comfortable with 100 miles and could have gone on for a fair bit longer. Beforehand, I was worried that it was inevitably I would blow up, but I didn't and didn't even come close to it. I think I could have gone on another 25 miles without too much misery; but a further 50 miles would have had me crying.

My groin was quite chafed, even with a generous application of chamois cream.

I felt strong on the climbs - I was riding in a group and on many occasions found myself hanging back at the top of a hill having outpaced them up it.

I had a decent speed and plenty of 'spare capacity' for the first 80 miles. I think I could have just about hung on to a sub-5 hr group if I had had the confidence to go with them from the start (I'm pessimistic and didn't think I'd be able to cope).

After 80 miles, I wouldn't say I was hanging on at all; I was riding with a friend and could have matched any accelerations he made, but at the same time I wouldn't have welcomed any bursts that he put in (not that he did). In other words, beyond 80 miles I wasn't 'enjoying it' but was thinking about the finish.

My heart rate was fairly stable the whole way; around 120 - 130 bpm for most of the event, kept under 150 on the climbs, but drifted towards 140/150 in the final 20 miles.

I'm 30 years old, 5'11", 13 stone.

With around 5 weeks left to the Marmotte, I'd really like to have some focus to my training.

For the final 2 weeks I'm going to be in Cyprus where my in-laws live, and so hope to use that time to get some decent climbing in (hiring a bike, lots of reasonable tough alpine-esque ascents around there).

Including that though, I'm unsure what to focus on.

Obviously, losing a few lbs will help, but where else should I look? Is it worth trying to insert one or two even longer rides (125 miles?) in the next month?

What I want to achieve is a point where I'm not 'hanging on', as I know that in the marmotte any fatigue will be amplified tenfold at the end of the ride and 'hanging on' will become 'dying'.

jibberjim

No, forget the idea of longer and longer rides - it's a misguided obsession that so many people fall into and all it does is lead to days off after the event as they "recover".

You've proven you can do a good duration riding in one go and feel strong, that's all long rides are really for - getting that confidence and the experience of eating and sitting for that long.

Training is generally much more productive when you can do it consistently - ie 2 hours every day is generally better than 6 hours one day and 2 days off, or even 6 hours and some "recovery rides"

Gentracer

I did the Marmotte a couple of years back.

I would concentrate on climbing, and long strches of it. If you are in Cyprus forget the flat riding go up into the mountains and get used to climbing for over an hour at a time, in the heat.

The Marmotte is the best sportive I have ridden, and the fact that it is circular is a definate bonus, but don't underestimate the climbs. The first climb is harder than it looks on paper, there is a stretch at the beginning of the Galibier coming out of Valloire that is tough as its generally a straight road until you hit the hair pin and the real climbing begins. Don't be scared of them, just break it down into sections and then tick them off a you go.

Biggest thing is make sure you have your gears right. I rode with a compact and a 29 on the rear, and it was needed to keep things spinning up the climbs. I passed loads of people pushing as they couldn't turn their gears on the steep sections. Also its a mental thing. Climbing for two hours can be just as tiring mentally as it can be on the legs. Perpare yourself for a long day in the saddle.

Final point I would make is take time to look around and enjoy the views. Sounds naff, but you won't go up thier that many times and its an amazing place, and the views will enspire you on. The descent from the Galibier to the base of the Alpe is fantastic, just watch the tunnels, cars and other riders.

I managed 8 hours 25 on the day, outside a Gold time by about 30 mins. Amazing ride, but remember it on open roads so don't cut too many corners.

bernithebiker

jibberjim wrote:

No, forget the idea of longer and longer rides - it's a misguided obsession that so many people fall into and all it does is lead to days off after the event as they "recover".

You've proven you can do a good duration riding in one go and feel strong, that's all long rides are really for - getting that confidence and the experience of eating and sitting for that long.

Training is generally much more productive when you can do it consistently - ie 2 hours every day is generally better than 6 hours one day and 2 days off, or even 6 hours and some "recovery rides"

+1 on this, good advice. Strava especially, with it's 'Junedoggles'! can lure riders into just trying to do as many kms as possible.

Just because you can ride 200 miles+ doesn't make you a better rider than someone who can't (or won't!)

Far better to do some intense 30 to 60 minute efforts to simulate a tough climb, with 30 mins easy either side.

You're already happy (more or less) with 5 hour + rides so no need to repeat until exhaustion.

imposter2.0

barrybridges wrote:

Including that though, I'm unsure what to focus on.

Obviously, losing a few lbs will help, but where else should I look? Is it worth trying to insert one or two even longer rides (125 miles?) in the next month?

Jim's advice above is good. Other than that, I would just concentrate on knocking out as many 50-70 milers as you can between now and the day - some faster, some slower. Regularity and repeatability are the keywords here - no point smashing yourself to pieces on a 125 miler if it puts you off the bike for a couple of days after.

davidof

Cyprus should be good. Try and get as high as you can. The Galibier is 2600 meters and over 1600m you begin to feel the effects of altitude. Practise descending while you are there too.

The thing I would improve on the climbs, if I could, would be riding out of the saddle for long sections.

barrybridges

Thanks for your replies. I'm looking forward to Cyprus as it should be some good last-minute training, although it will probably mean some very early starts as it can easily be 30 degrees by 9am some days.

Lots of long, relatively consistent climbs, particularly along the coastal roads.

twotyred

I felt very comfortable with 100 miles and could have gone on for a fair bit longer.

Good that's where you want to be. Sounds like you are on track.

Like Jibberjim says forget 125 milers and keep the consistency going.

Make sure you have some threshold/tempo intervals in most rides you do- they don't have to be on hills

although it will probably mean some very early starts as it can easily be 30 degrees by 9am some days.

Don't avoid the heat, use it as an opportunity to acclimatise. When I did the Marmotte in 2011 and 2012 it was 35°C on Alpe d'Huez. If you are used to this heat it will be a good advantage.

bernithebiker

twotyred wrote:

Don't avoid the heat, use it as an opportunity to acclimatise. When I did the Marmotte in 2011 and 2012 it was 35°C on Alpe d'Huez. If you are used to this heat it will be a good advantage.

When I did the Etape in the Pyrenees in July 2012 it was 5'C on the Tourmalet, and raining most of the way round.

It can swing either way!

mrc1

bernithebiker wrote:

twotyred wrote:

Don't avoid the heat, use it as an opportunity to acclimatise. When I did the Marmotte in 2011 and 2012 it was 35°C on Alpe d'Huez. If you are used to this heat it will be a good advantage.

When I did the Etape in the Pyrenees in July 2012 it was 5'C on the Tourmalet, and raining most of the way round.

It can swing either way!

+1 to this - last year within a couple of days we went from sub zero and snowing to 28c and wall to wall sunshine, so make sure you check the forecast and pack appropriate kit (even on good weather days a windproof gilet is a lifesaver as the descents can be cold).

Your training all sounds good so I would only echo the advice of the guys above and say to focus on some sustained climbing on your two weeks before hand. The mental shock of going from UK climbs that are a few minutes long to climbing non-stop for two hours at a time can be a real tester even if you have the physical capacity to manage it. Getting used to that ahead of the Marmotte will give you a real confidence booster.

ric/rstsport

davidof wrote:

Cyprus should be good. Try and get as high as you can. The Galibier is 2600 meters and over 1600m you begin to feel the effects of altitude. Practise descending while you are there too.

The thing I would improve on the climbs, if I could, would be riding out of the saddle for long sections.

to clarify, your power starts to decrease much earlier than 1600m (for most low landers - there's presumably some exceptions to the rule). Even at 500m, your FTP would likely be decreasing (probably a couple of %), at about 1000m you're probably likely to have dropped about 5%.

if it's extremely hot and you're not acclimated to that, then that can cause further significant reductions in power output. Case in point, yesterday i was riding the turbo (short on time) without a fan (packed before our move) in direct sunlight and what felt quite hot (for me) after the naff winter we've had, and this caused quite a large drop in power (over something i should have been able to do).

ric

bernithebiker

Ric/RSTSport wrote:

davidof wrote:

Cyprus should be good. Try and get as high as you can. The Galibier is 2600 meters and over 1600m you begin to feel the effects of altitude. Practise descending while you are there too.

The thing I would improve on the climbs, if I could, would be riding out of the saddle for long sections.

to clarify, your power starts to decrease much earlier than 1600m (for most low landers - there's presumably some exceptions to the rule). Even at 500m, your FTP would likely be decreasing (probably a couple of %), at about 1000m you're probably likely to have dropped about 5%.

if it's extremely hot and you're not acclimated to that, then that can cause further significant reductions in power output. Case in point, yesterday i was riding the turbo (short on time) without a fan (packed before our move) in direct sunlight and what felt quite hot (for me) after the naff winter we've had, and this caused quite a large drop in power (over something i should have been able to do).

ric

Interesting - having lived and cycled around Geneva, the consensus was generally 'no effect below 1500m', but I see from some of the studies that a drop can be measured even at 500m.

I generally feel it above 2000m, but presumably there's already some loss going on that's too small for me to 'feel'.

I wonder how long you need to spend at 1000m+ to acclimatise? (get more red blood cells). I'll be in Geneva for 3 days beforehand but that's not even 500m, so that's not going to do a lot!

ric/rstsport

probably close to 10 - 15% by 2000m.

longish periods. it's why people sleep for long periods of time in altitude tents

richp77

Hi, not sure when you arrive in Cyprus but this could be of interest/use?

http://www.cyclingcy.com/index.php?opti ... 01&lang=ru


Race will start in Limassol near the Atlantica Miramare Hotel, head towards Ypsonas, Kouris Dam pass through scenic rural roads from Lofou, Pera Pedi and Platres to finish in the Olympus peak Troodos.

The route: Atlantica Miramare Hotel, head towards Ypsonas, Kouris Dam pass through scenic rural roads from Lofou, Pera Pedi and Platres to finish in the Olympus peak Troodos

The facts

Distance 68km
Total Ascent 2216m
Total Descent 304m
Start Elevation 0m
Finish Elevation 1952m
Cost of participation
Participation fee : €18
Transfer after the event to Start point : €12
Lunch in Troodos : €12


Late registration at the start in Limassol on Saturday between 6 and 6.30am for a 6.35 start.

barrybridges

RichP77 wrote:

Hi, not sure when you arrive in Cyprus but this could be of interest/use?

http://www.cyclingcy.com/index.php?opti ... 01&lang=ru

Hi Rich,

Sadly I don't get out there until 21st, so I'm going to miss this one, but I'm there until 2nd July (then flying back that night and out to the Alps the next day).

I wondered if I could pick your brain actually?

I don't want to fly my bike out to Cyprus with easyjet (or anyone for that matter) as I've got a really tight turnaround getting back to the England and out to France - and if my bike's delayed from Cyprus it'll miss my flight to France.

I've looked into hiring a bike and wondered if you had any recommendations?

My in-laws (who live out there) have managed to potentially procure me a bike via a chap called 'Allan' up in Kouklia (which is close to where they live), but a) he doesn't have the right size bike for the first week I'm there, b) he wants me to hire the wrong size bike for 2 days, bring it back so I'm without a bike for three days, then hire the right size bike thereafter, and c) he wants to charge 20 euros a day for it.

I've found another chap up in Kalavasos who can hire me the right size bike for the whole trip for 15 euros, but Kalavasos is a bit of a schlepp from Kouklia and I'd need to go and collect it/drop it back.

Do you know anyone else I could hire a bike from?

richp77

Have pm'd you