Road Rage + assault, cops do nothing.

bails87

Danlikesbikes wrote:

bails87 wrote:

Knowing how the Contour (which I suspect is the cam being used) distorts stuff up close I'd say the back of the van cut in and got very close to the bike, and that's what lead to the horn being used.

That is a good point, as after watching the footage the van looks wide & far enough in front however could be that the camera used has some sort of distorting effect.

I recon from the video that the van is maybe 2ft from the camera, which means he's no more than a foot away from the cyclist's right arm or his front wheel.

Sewinman

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

Greg66 Tri v2.0 wrote:

Helmet cam + AirZound = thar be trouble ahead.

Nuff said.

This. Use of said tools is evidence of someone looking for trouble.

ooermissus

Danlikesbikes wrote:

would suggest that the cyclist is a bit highly strung IMHO, first trying to undertake the van then shaking his head at a car that was trying to park & asking what they were doing.

I hadn't realized that everyone else was so mild mannered. I often cycle along chuntering about things getting in my way - cars, pedestrians, traffic lights. I, too, have been known to shake my head. :shock:

Do it in a car too, though I don't drive much. It's very different from when the red mist descends (not that often, but it has happened) - just a low-intensity commentary on the video game that is cycling along crowded urban streets.

For all you saintly types, does this habit mark me out as one of those uppity cyclists who is just waiting to get bashed by a van driver?

danlikesbikes

ooermissus wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

would suggest that the cyclist is a bit highly strung IMHO, first trying to undertake the van then shaking his head at a car that was trying to park & asking what they were doing.

I hadn't realized that everyone else was so mild mannered. I often cycle along chuntering about things getting in my way - cars, pedestrians, traffic lights. I, too, have been known to shake my head. :shock:

Do it in a car too, though I don't drive much. It's very different from when the red mist descends (not that often, but it has happened) - just a low-intensity commentary on the video game that is cycling along crowded urban streets.

For all you saintly types, does this habit mark me out as one of those uppity cyclists who is just waiting to get bashed by a van driver?

I guess it depends if you did exactly the same in his position with a van driver who clearly has anger issues towards cyclist & those actions added fuel to the fire then I would say that it could easily have been you getting punched.

Not that anyone, myself included, is saying that it is right (the drivers reaction) in any way I do feel the cyclists could have at best avoided all of this by not attempting the undertake, making the gestures he did and beeping his horn. Or at worse the van driver was going to get out and hit the cyclist if he had done a perfectly legal overtake as the van was pulled up to allow the car to park, if the van driver was simply out to hit a cyclists.

bails87

Sewinman wrote:

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

Greg66 Tri v2.0 wrote:

Helmet cam + AirZound = thar be trouble ahead.

Nuff said.

This. Use of said tools is evidence of someone looking for trouble.

In sure I could find someone who'd say the same thing about anyone who chooses to ride a bike on the road!

If the cyclist had ridden along shouting "come on then, get out of your car and let's have a fight" then you could justifiably say he was looking for trouble. But he beeped his horn at a close pass, just like almost any driver would have done. That was about it.

I thought the cyclist was shaking his head because the van had pulled out and got in the way of the parking focus?

DonDaddyD

There was no reason for the cyclist to shake his head at the woman trying to park her car (beyond the fact that she was a woman attempting to park a car). There wasn't, that I could see, a reason for him to take the position he did once he made the left turn and there wasn't a reason a for him to beep his horn at the motorist that had given ample room.

Now one of those things would, in my mind, equate to a benefit of the doubt type conclusion. All three of those things, the chain of events, leads me to a conclusion that the cyclist might be a tad highly strung.

bails87

As I've said, I think it was a very close pass, but the contour distorts passes like that.

Edit: it's as if people are suggesting that the driver had reviewed the cyclists YouTube channel and decided that the accumulated winding up of drivers deserved a reply all in one big lump. Or that being 'a tad highly strung' had anything to do with being the victim of an assault. Did the cyclist shout, swear or try to start a fight? No. Did he beep his horn when he was cut up by a bad overtake? Yes. That doesn't make the attack any less despicable.

danlikesbikes

jedster wrote:

Helmet cam + AirZound = thar be trouble ahead.

Yeah - I tend to agree.

Except this guy was not behaving nearly as badly as some cyclists who end up getting punched. He didnt give the driver a load of verbal, he didn't slap the van or kick a door mirror*. The cam and horn might suggest he is not the most level-headed but he did absolutely nothing to provoke anything like that level of response. I really dont think he deserves a "well you used an airzound, what do you expect" response.

*in case it's not obvious, I dont think people really deserve a punch for dishing out a bit of verbal or slapping a van but in the real wor;d you should be prepared for it. I don't think you really need to be prepared for a dooring / punching for beeing a horn, even if it is a bit of an obnoxious one..

Your right in that the level of violence was not called for in anyway.

However I think the point being made is one of attitude go watch the video & then check out the cyclists other 163 videos of which a fair amount are posted on a similar basis.

I'm all for cyclists highlighting dangerous driving and feel that it would be a good way of proving innocence in the event of an accident. However I think that he has some anger issues himself & his actions may have either caused the red mist to envelop the van driver or certainly contributed to the situation escalating as it did.

greg66_tri_v2.0

bails87 wrote:

As I've said, I think it was a very close pass, but the contour distorts passes like that.

I've heard this about various head cameras. Perhaps this is the reason that the Police are a bit sniffy about relying on them as evidence (at least of evidence of particular facts, such as proximity).

Is there such a thing as an accurate head camera?

mybreakfastconsisted

It was a punishment pass, the thug driver caused the whole incident, he uses a ton of metal as a weapon, then got out of the car to get punchy, then lied to the cops and accused the cyclist of a serious offence. His wife's a lying sack of shit too, these odious people deserve the derision being heaped upon them. Mind you, we don't know the dynamics of the relationship, if that cretin punches people who use their horn to warn them I wonder what he does to his wife if his tea's cold?

rick_chasey

Driver has more issues than cyclist. Being held up for 5 secs, a shaking head and a little airzound shouldn't be sending him so mental to assault someone.

Airzone / head shaking < assault.


By miles. One is perfectly ok, if a little irritating and tw@tish (and who isn't a tw@t from time to time) one is absolutely reprehensible.

junglist_matty

notsoblue wrote:

Theres no excuse for the behaviour of the driver here, and trying to door someone is pretty terrible let alone actually assaulting someone on the street like that, but the attitude of the cyclist prior to being assaulted kinda stinks. He makes a big song and dance out of having been slowed down by someone just parallel parking their car, then after honking at a white van man who then tries to door him for it, he honks again.

This is the behaviour of someone who makes a point of being antagonistic on the road. Seems weird that he isn't prepared for that kind of assault. I wonder if he rides that way when he doesn't have camera?

Well said....

The van driver in the video seemed to give him plenty of room and didn't exactly cut in front of him, I'd be happy with someone passing me like that.

On many roads I ride, at least once a week I get idiots who seem to think a 200m straight down a narrow bumpy country road is a great place to test the acceleration of their sports car regardless that there's me half way down it going 20mph, they still fly past me at 80+mph with far less than a meter space between us; now that's scary stuff!

I'll have to take some footage just to prove it, not that I'm anal enough to actually ring the police... or worse still, buy a gayhorn for my bike!

junglist_matty

...

ooermissus

Grim that the driver and his wife ended up receiving death threats.

DonDaddyD

bails87 wrote:

As I've said, I think it was a very close pass, but the contour distorts passes like that.

Edit: it's as if people are suggesting that the driver had reviewed the cyclists YouTube channel and decided that the accumulated winding up of drivers deserved a reply all in one big lump. Or that being 'a tad highly strung' had anything to do with being the victim of an assault. Did the cyclist shout, swear or try to start a fight? No. Did he beep his horn when he was cut up by a bad overtake? Yes. That doesn't make the attack any less despicable.

Criticisms of the driver and the cyclists need not be mutally exclusive.

Critism of the cyclist's actions would still be valid had the driver not got out of the car and beat the shite out him. Just because he took a beating doesn't mean we can't comment on his actions negatively. No one is saying that his actions made the drivers reaction somewhat more plausible, it didn't.

jamesco

notsoblue wrote:

This is the behaviour of someone who makes a point of being antagonistic on the road. Seems weird that he isn't prepared for that kind of assault. I wonder if he rides that way when he doesn't have camera?

Indeed, and girls who wear short skirts should prepare to be groped.

If the van driver had tooted his horn and waved his arm back, would that be antagonistic enough to expect a beating from the cyclist? If we expect that kind of thing to happen, then the law needs to be enforced strictly enough that we don't expect or accept it any longer.

Dunno what the cyclist is like - he may or may not be a self-important road-warrior - but he certainly didn't deserve the assault.

mybreakfastconsisted

ooermissus wrote:

Grim that the driver and his wife ended up receiving death threats.

We only have their word for that, and we already know they're both liars.

bushu

I recently had a prat follow me home after i gave this wvm a verbal ticking for straddling the cycle lane to get out at a junction, he then took it upon himself to change direction and follow me a mile before i realised he wanted putting in his place.. I then proceeded to mock his pissy-arse attempt to scare a cyclist and offered to smash his skull into cycle lane if he wanted to be in it so badly.
I know he was hoping i was going to be some upitty cyclist he could bully!

greg66_tri_v2.0

I don't think anyone is saying the cyclist "deserved" the assault. The point is simpler: if you go looking for confrontation, don't be surprised if you find it. I once gave some verbal to a black cab driver when I was in the right (and he agreed - his point was that he'd said sorry). He jumped out (fat little turd that he was) with a baseball bat ready to give it his all. I scarpered. A useful lesson in the "lucky dip" of choosing a foe from the 1000s of drivers rolling around every day in London.

I'm still perplexed by the whole thing. So much so that I've just been watching the overtake frame by frame. A couple of things stand out. First, the cyclist is sitting well out into the road. Not obstructively so, but sufficiently far out that the car is forced a fair bit over the the right.

Secondly, as the car comes past, the driver is looking sideways, right at the cyclist (and there's a passenger in the car, which I hadn't clocked previously). So that got me thinking: why? It might be simply because the driver felt the rider was riding too far over the right and willfully making the pass difficult, or attempting a block. Or it may be because the "what are you doing" comment when the car is trying to park, earlier in the vid, wasn't directed at the parking car, but was instead directed at the driver. It is possible that there was some unfortunate jostling for "who goes first" between the cyclist and the van driver that the camera didn't catch.

Anyhoo. Conclusion remains: 100% avoidable. Live and learn (fortunately for the cyclist).

danlikesbikes

mybreakfastconsisted wrote:

ooermissus wrote:

Grim that the driver and his wife ended up receiving death threats.

We only have their word for that, and we already know they're both liars.

But we do know that some people who have commented on the Youtube video have been emailing the wrong company. The cyclist himself & the wrong company have both posted comments & looking at some of the comments on the video it would not surprise me if the content of any emails were 'colourful' at a minimum.

From the wrong company;
Norman Wright 16 hours ago
I would like to state that my company "The Weird & Wonderful" theweirdandwonderful . com is IN NO WAY related, affiliated or connected to the man in the video. I currently hire one professional marketing manager who does NOT look like that, does not drive a white van and does not live in the area. I am also NOT that man, I drive a blue mini and I am based in Lancashire, not Birmingham. PLEASE STOP THREATENING ME ON EMAILS! IT IS POINTLESS I do not know who this man is!

From the cyclist;
PilotInCommand100 5 hours ago
All viewer The Werid and wonderful is not the company in this video.Stop sending emails and messages to this company!!! This is unfair on the company owner which has already shown there view by commenting. The company is the weird n wonderful. Stop guys while your ahead

mybreakfastconsisted

The latest is the media have got involved (the clip's had over 100k views) and there's a possibility the punchy little man will go on a bike ride with the cyclist. That's a fair conclusion, bit of closure, good pr for cyclists, they all end up singing "We Are The World".

ooermissus

The cyclist comes across as a decent bloke in the comments he's made online - a bit "I know my rights", but quite reasonable all things considered.

DonDaddyD

I've been saying that the cyclist was pretty far over to the right for a while...

The driver was a bellend, the cyclist could have acted differently. I'm not sure there is anything more to say. Sometimes I have my moments of madness, sometimes I breath and keep it cool. I've never gotten out of the car though, what if the person has the clarity of mind to run me over...

danlikesbikes

mybreakfastconsisted wrote:

The latest is the media have got involved (the clip's had over 100k views) and there's a possibility the punchy little man will go on a bike ride with the cyclist. That's a fair conclusion, bit of closure, good pr for cyclists, they all end up singing "We Are The World".

Well if that does happen it would be good for the cycling & motoring worlds and building some bridges. Plus think the cyclist would be quite happy with the outcome.

notsoblue

mybreakfastconsisted wrote:

That's a fair conclusion, bit of closure, good pr for cyclists, they all end up singing "We Are The World".

I'm really not sure about that. I wouldn't like my friends and family to think I have that attitude when I'm on the bike. The rider didn't deserve what happened to him, but his footage certainly does not do anything to further the image of cyclists as being like "normal" people who just want to get from A to B with no hassle. He comes off as rather self righteous and petty.

mybreakfastconsisted

The more drivers realise that attacking cyclists can have serious consequences the better.

notsoblue

jamesco wrote:

notsoblue wrote:

This is the behaviour of someone who makes a point of being antagonistic on the road. Seems weird that he isn't prepared for that kind of assault. I wonder if he rides that way when he doesn't have camera?

Indeed, and girls who wear short skirts should prepare to be groped.

If the van driver had tooted his horn and waved his arm back, would that be antagonistic enough to expect a beating from the cyclist? If we expect that kind of thing to happen, then the law needs to be enforced strictly enough that we don't expect or accept it any longer.

Dunno what the cyclist is like - he may or may not be a self-important road-warrior - but he certainly didn't deserve the assault.

I agree with you, I was just thinking out loud. I don't think anyone deserves this. But I know from personal experience that if you react when someone does a close overtake like this theres a small chance of them trying to assault you. I'm not proud of it, but I often let drivers know when they've driven dangerously around me. Most of the time its accidental, but sometimes its intentional. And in cases where its intentional I won't be particularly courteous when I let them know what I think of what they did. It would be stupidly naive of me to assume that yelling at someone or (if I had one) honking an airzound, couldn't potentially result in them pulling over for a confrontation.

I was just surprised that this guy thinks he can ride around on a bike with an airzound, honking at people, and he won't get this kind of reaction. If he felt so strongly about what the driver did, he should have spoken up for himself when he got out of his van.

notsoblue

mybreakfastconsisted wrote:

The more drivers realise that attacking cyclists can have serious consequences the better.

I've not been following the case very closely, but doesn't this just show that if you attack a cyclist the police won't do anything about it?

greg66_tri_v2.0

This driver isn't going to suffer "serious consequences" though.

mybreakfastconsisted

I would think it was pretty serious if I was caught attracting massively negative publicity for a company run by my wife.