Road Rage Advise required please

Cloudy_Wheat

Evening

What a day thought I would take advantage of the nice weather this morning and go for a short spin.....The outcome a punch on the chin and ruined handlebars and shoes.

So after advise here the driver didn't hit me with his car to cause the damage to the bike. The bike was thorn by him while i was using it as a barrier between him and me. The police have said that I would need to seek criminal damage to re coup the cost against the bike.

Has anyone ever done this before and won? Is it worth my time? Would I be better off going to one of those any claim places?
The damage caused my Oakley are broken also going to have to replace a set of bontreger rxl handlebars and tape.There is also a nasty mark on my chainset and rear mech.

gloomyandy

Are the police taking action against him? Any witnesses?

sungod

that's an awful thing to happen!

assume you've got all his details? and those of any witnesses?

get photos of all damage and injuries while fresh, include the date on the photos if possible

write down all facts as you recall them

if you don't have legal insurance cover, contact a specialist law firm, a few advertise in cycling weekly

Flexisurfer

That's a tricky one. I take it the offender was in some dealt with by the law, ie caution or charged? You could look down the line of the Criminal Injury Compensation Board, but I don't know if that covers property. If the offender hasn't been dealt with, ie, not enough evidence to prove guilt then I don't think you can go anywhere to be honest as I feel even the "blame claim" people might need a conviction to prove the offender was reckless in causing the damage. I might be wrong and will apologise if I am, have you tried the C.A.B?

Cloudy_Wheat

Yes the police are taking action and depending on his previous conviction he will either get a caution or go to court. Ive got some of the details but due to him attacking me the police wouldnt allow him to give me his insurance details they advised me to contact 101 and ask for force legal which I can only do on Monday.
Witnesses yes the police they did see him punching and me ducking and diving lol.
This occured outside a small police station.

philwint

So this guy assaulted you and caused criminal damage to your property....

...in front of a police station, with on duty police officers as witnesses!!!!

surely you must be able to claim for the damages & compensation for the assault (IANAL)

lotus49

Cloudy_Wheat wrote:

Yes the police are taking action and depending on his previous conviction he will either get a caution or go to court. Ive got some of the details but due to him attacking me the police wouldnt allow him to give me his insurance details they advised me to contact 101 and ask for force legal which I can only do on Monday.
Witnesses yes the police they did see him punching and me ducking and diving lol.
This occured outside a small police station.

I'd say that anyone who is crazy enough to attack someone in front of a police officer probably has prior convictions.

You would be better off speaking to a solicitor about this. This is a legal matter and there are a lot of factors to take into account, not least whether this loony has any money. You would almost certainly win in court if you have police officers who witnessed the assault but if he has no money, it would be a Pyrrhic victory.

Please let us know how this turns out. I hope you receive the compensation you deserve.

big_p

What did you do to upset him so much ?

smoggysteve

Cloudy_Wheat wrote:

Yes the police are taking action and depending on his previous conviction he will either get a caution or go to court. Ive got some of the details but due to him attacking me the police wouldnt allow him to give me his insurance details they advised me to contact 101 and ask for force legal which I can only do on Monday.
Witnesses yes the police they did see him punching and me ducking and diving lol.
This occured outside a small police station.

If the police witnessed him hit you, why was he not arrested on the spot for assault?

If you want compensation its going to have to be small claims court which with the police report you should have no problem winning, getting the money after that is another matter.

MountainMonster

If someone is dumb enough to hit you as you say in front of police officers, I highly doubt he is going to have much cash sitting around. That is if he even tries to pay up, many people just leave it and take sentences rather than paying. Such a terrible situation to be in!

timbo58

agree with MM, although that shouldn't put you off pressing charges and taking the matter to a SCC.
Even if it achieves no recompense for you it sends the right message when reported at the very least.

Outrageous the sheer arrogance of someone to attack anyone without any provocation.

I have to say I'd like to know what you feel you did to annoy him also (being a nosey sod) but sometimes IME (worked for 15 years plus till a few years back as a Railway guard and RP manager, so believe me I have seen 'unreasonable and OTT' behaviour!) people just snap and take it out on the most innocent of bystanders for the stupidest reasons.

It may well the OP will have to think really hard to even think of any 'reason' the looney attacked him.

I was run off the road into a hedge once as the 4x4 (spotlessly clean in my rural area =status symbol) didn't like me being in 'his way' on a cut through single track (very much so) B road en route to the M4, he did it deliberately and after waiting no more than 30 seconds behind me revving his engine loudly.

The turning where he would have been able to overtake safely was 200 yards up the road.
Pathetic.

I didn't get the number but even 6 years later I'd recognise his wheel cover again.

farrina

MountainMonster wrote:

I highly doubt he is going to have much cash sitting around.

In the first instance I would be investigating as to who owned the car ....

lawrences

There's road rage and then there's assault.

I would class road rage as someone shouting at you beeping and revving the engine. Not punching you in the face.

markos1963

Solicitor is your best bet rather than a load of backroom lawyers on an internet forum but, if you want my advise then what about the small claims court? Your claim for repairs/replacement on your bike would probably come in under the threshold and as already said you have some cast iron witnesses. Only problem remains as to wether or not the offender has any money.

sungod

if the scumbag owns the car and it's got any value, once the solicitors have finished with him the bailifs can seize it and flog it :-)

gezebo

So someone threw your bike, then punched you and all this when outside a police station, in front of a copper? I think you need to start from the beginning. It sounds very interesting!

Monty Dog

I was in a similar position a few years ago - my witness was an off-duty policeman riding past on a bike as the perp hit me! He finally admitted guilty (after 10 months) for assault and was fined £700 - it was a drawn-out process as he tried to claim it was self-defence - he was a fat-b@stard that waddled 20 yards from his car and I'm less than 10 stone. I wasn't able to claim for damages though because of the way the charges was constructed. The size of the fine was indicative of 'previous'

cheaterkiller

Why didnt you use reasonable force? i.e kick the 2@ in the nuts and leg it.

diy

There are 3 parts to this.

1) Criminal prosecution for the offences - here your role is to assist the police to ensure justice is done and he doesn't lamp the next person he comes in to conflict with. This is not where you get compensation. Though you might ask the police about any restorative justice program that they might consider (basically his sentence is to make good the crime).

http://www.restorativejustice.org.uk/

2) You may be able to get criminal injuries compensation for any injury you have incurred. It is unlikely that you will get much though. Your ability to claim is linked to the criminal prosecution that the police/CPS and ultimately courts will decide. You can find out more about making a claim here:

https://www.gov.uk/claim-compensation-criminal-injury

3) Sue for your damages (civil county court) - This is really the only way you will get compensation for the damage caused to you and your property. The police will not help you with this, but your best option is to act now. All the time he has a criminal prosecution pending at a magistrates court, he has an incentive to "make good". Obviously the easy part is getting the district judge to award you compensation. The hard part is getting him to pay. You need to assess if he is the sort that would be bothered about having a CCJ and if he has the means to pay for the damages. This claim is independant of the police criminal investigation and plod wont help you with it. In fact IME they often give quite bad advice in this area. @Monty Dog post a bit more (how long ago, value of damage, how caused, and a bit about the type of person) and I can give you a little help as to if you can still make a claim.

it will unfortunately involve contact with mr angry to attempt to settle the claim for damages. if you think he has the money to pay you may ask a law firm to act for you just to keep your distance, but you wont be able to claim costs if he settles.

you can start your claim here:
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome

thegreatdivide

We demand the full story - it sounds like a cracker!

On the subject of cops, cars and bikes - on my Saturday ride I was following a single car up a street with a long row of cars parked on the other side of the road, so we had right of way and the oncoming traffic had to wait. As soon as the car I was following cleared the row the first oncoming car pulled right out in front of me causing me to veer towards the pavement at high speed. The driver laughed - I gave him the finger - and I think the Police van behind him pulled him over

Bustacapp

OK so this maniac threw your bike, but what happened to your shoes? Did he take them off and throw them in a pond?

daddy0

I had a similar thing happen to me at the end of last year. Guy got out of his van and pushed me over which broke a couple of things on my bike and caused me some superficial injuries. I had two witnesses. Police took a report. A couple of months later I got a letter saying that the police couldn't/wouldn't do anything about it.

Best of luck!

diy

If you can be a*sed and they have the money to pay or the need to avoid a CCJ

1. Letter before action claiming damages.
2. small claim court claim + court costs.

You need the statements from plod, who may charge for them. You'll need to prove to the judge that on the balance of probability their action/inaction negligently caused the damage.

depends what the damages are a worth, couple of £100, I would not bother - over a grand I would think about it.

danlikesbikes

diy wrote:

If you can be a*sed and they have the money to pay or the need to avoid a CCJ

1. Letter before action claiming damages.
2. small claim court claim + court costs.

You need the statements from plod, who may charge for them. You'll need to prove to the judge that on the balance of probability their action/inaction negligently caused the damage.

depends what the damages are a worth, couple of £100, I would not bother - over a grand I would think about it.

Quite a sensible option, I agree that its never a good thing to be attacked in anyway, however for compensation of a smaller amount often the small claims court is the most successful/cost economic way of dealing this.

Pituophis

So basically, it sounds to me like if someone wants to assault you and damage your bike, you can't really expect much help from the police, or the courts to enforce their compo award even if you do win? :shock:
Crime may not pay, but it seems it doesn't cost anything either :evil:
I guess if not much happens to them, not much will happen to you either should you express a dislike for said attitude.

diy

nope.

Its like this:

1) plod are interested in criminal cases and have to prove a person committed an offence beyond reasonable doubt. There are all sorts of defences to criminal cases and the CPS (who only get the facts from plod and often not a particularly switched on plod) have to assess their chances of a conviction and balance that with the cost of bringing a case.

See their challenge here:
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/a_to_c/criminal_damage/
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offe ... he_person/

2) You are responsible for your property and if anyone damages it, its up to you to bring a claim for the replacement/repair.

No action or inaction under 1 prevents 2 and vice versa

Mikey23

I was punched off my bike a few weeks ago, no witnesses. Had a phone call from the police to say he had denied it and no action will be taken ...

Guanajuato

I suspect there's a large chunk of the story missing here. Some motorists are complete prats, but that's beyond anything normal. If the police witnessed it, then they'd be jumping at the chance to get a positive conviction as from your description its clearly assault. Unless there's something you're not telling us.

Cloudy_Wheat

diy wrote:

There are 3 parts to this.

1) Criminal prosecution for the offences - here your role is to assist the police to ensure justice is done and he doesn't lamp the next person he comes in to conflict with. This is not where you get compensation. Though you might ask the police about any restorative justice program that they might consider (basically his sentence is to make good the crime).

http://www.restorativejustice.org.uk/

2) You may be able to get criminal injuries compensation for any injury you have incurred. It is unlikely that you will get much though. Your ability to claim is linked to the criminal prosecution that the police/CPS and ultimately courts will decide. You can find out more about making a claim here:

https://www.gov.uk/claim-compensation-criminal-injury

3) Sue for your damages (civil county court) - This is really the only way you will get compensation for the damage caused to you and your property. The police will not help you with this, but your best option is to act now. All the time he has a criminal prosecution pending at a magistrates court, he has an incentive to "make good". Obviously the easy part is getting the district judge to award you compensation. The hard part is getting him to pay. You need to assess if he is the sort that would be bothered about having a CCJ and if he has the means to pay for the damages. This claim is independant of the police criminal investigation and plod wont help you with it. In fact IME they often give quite bad advice in this area. @Monty Dog post a bit more (how long ago, value of damage, how caused, and a bit about the type of person) and I can give you a little help as to if you can still make a claim.

it will unfortunately involve contact with mr angry to attempt to settle the claim for damages. if you think he has the money to pay you may ask a law firm to act for you just to keep your distance, but you wont be able to claim costs if he settles.

you can start your claim here:
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome

Many Thanks for this its been a great help.

Cloudy_Wheat

Here we go with the story well most of it.

Guy overtakes me almost knocks me off my bike. I raised my hand. He stops in the road blocking traffic starts telling me I shouldn’t be on the road but on the cycle path and the old line you don’t have tax he then tells me that next time he will drive me over. I called him an f@cking idiot and there is no point in having this conversation because he is idiot I carry on riding. He then overtakes me again in the same way at this point I thought I best let it be. The driver then slams on the brakes and blocks the road again I overtake him on the right and pull right into the police station and ring the doorbell. The driver follows me then tells me he is going to hit me and I tell him to stop being an idiot because this isn’t about violence but the fact he almost killed me. Driver goes on to say that he had to do that because there were oncoming cars and he couldn’t overtake. I point out to him that he was on solid lines and he could have waited. At this point I figure the station is closed because it’s a really small station and nobody is there so I hope back on my bike and begin to leave because there is no point in talking to the driver about it. As I’m leaving he runs after me and pulls me from my bike with fists flying I pulled him to the ground and held him do telling him to calm down. He calmed down then gets back up and starts punching again I pull him back down to the ground and then two police come out from the station and stop the madman and he is arrested. After my statement the policemen tells me he heard and has seen the driver attack me from the police station kitchen.

danlikesbikes

Cloudy_Wheat wrote:

Here we go with the story well most of it.

Guy overtakes me almost knocks me off my bike. I raised my hand. He stops in the road blocking traffic starts telling me I shouldn’t be on the road but on the cycle path and the old line you don’t have tax he then tells me that next time he will drive me over. I called him an f@cking idiot and there is no point in having this conversation because he is idiot I carry on riding. He then overtakes me again in the same way at this point I thought I best let it be. The driver then slams on the brakes and blocks the road again I overtake him on the right and pull right into the police station and ring the doorbell. The driver follows me then tells me he is going to hit me and I tell him to stop being an idiot because this isn’t about violence but the fact he almost killed me. Driver goes on to say that he had to do that because there were oncoming cars and he couldn’t overtake. I point out to him that he was on solid lines and he could have waited. At this point I figure the station is closed because it’s a really small station and nobody is there so I hope back on my bike and begin to leave because there is no point in talking to the driver about it. As I’m leaving he runs after me and pulls me from my bike with fists flying I pulled him to the ground and held him do telling him to calm down. He calmed down then gets back up and starts punching again I pull him back down to the ground and then two police come out from the station and stop the madman and he is arrested. After my statement the policemen tells me he heard and has seen the driver attack me from the police station kitchen.

WOW mate you are very luck then as the other chaps sounds like a right nutter.

Glad your OK