Interesting JTL Interview

DeadCalm

ThomThom wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

But that's why I think it's a shame he didn't go for a smaller team. As I said to begin with - he was always going to be playing second fiddle there. Not blaming Sky. Not blaming Jonathan, the money are probably good, but that's how his position is and he could have been much higher up in the hierarchy - neo or not - in plenty of others teams.

You could look at it another way though, as others have quite rightly said that Sky have a team of 2,3,4,5th placed riders who were purchased and trained up to be as good as many other teams number 1 rider, with the rest of the team they seem to have applied a training regime that would make them pretty high up the order in other teams too.

If in 2-3 years time he his still not being repaid by the team in some events as leader or co-leader he could easily go then to anther team.

Can you name me an example? A rider that revived his carreer or trained up by Sky to take that 'Sky-momentum' with him to his new team with same succes?

Sky haven't exactly been around a long time. The pool of ex-Sky riders is pretty small but how about Gerrans?

andyp

ThomThom wrote:

Can you name me an example? A rider that revived his carreer or trained up by Sky to take that 'Sky-momentum' with him to his new team with same succes?

Gerrans.

danlikesbikes

ThomThom wrote:

Flecha was neither trained up or revived at Sky.

So his current form was not created off the training he received at Sky whilst he was there?

Richmond Racer

ThomThom wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

But that's why I think it's a shame he didn't go for a smaller team. As I said to begin with - he was always going to be playing second fiddle there. Not blaming Sky. Not blaming Jonathan, the money are probably good, but that's how his position is and he could have been much higher up in the hierarchy - neo or not - in plenty of others teams.

You could look at it another way though, as others have quite rightly said that Sky have a team of 2,3,4,5th placed riders who were purchased and trained up to be as good as many other teams number 1 rider, with the rest of the team they seem to have applied a training regime that would make them pretty high up the order in other teams too.

If in 2-3 years time he his still not being repaid by the team in some events as leader or co-leader he could easily go then to anther team.

Can you name me an example? A rider that revived his carreer or trained up by Sky to take that 'Sky-momentum' with him to his new team with same succes?

Nordhaug should be such a person. Had a real breakout season last year in his 2nd/final year on contract with Sky, inlcuding his GP Montreal win. Rabo/Blanco lured him with loadsamoney with DaveB wouldnt match. Problem is he's been hit with injury and all sorts since moving over, meaning his having to miss the Ardennes which in theory should be his main goals of the season - so too soon to judge on the carrying-over-success front. As is the case with any rider who left end last year.

DeadCalm

Richmond Racer wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

But that's why I think it's a shame he didn't go for a smaller team. As I said to begin with - he was always going to be playing second fiddle there. Not blaming Sky. Not blaming Jonathan, the money are probably good, but that's how his position is and he could have been much higher up in the hierarchy - neo or not - in plenty of others teams.

You could look at it another way though, as others have quite rightly said that Sky have a team of 2,3,4,5th placed riders who were purchased and trained up to be as good as many other teams number 1 rider, with the rest of the team they seem to have applied a training regime that would make them pretty high up the order in other teams too.

If in 2-3 years time he his still not being repaid by the team in some events as leader or co-leader he could easily go then to anther team.

Can you name me an example? A rider that revived his carreer or trained up by Sky to take that 'Sky-momentum' with him to his new team with same succes?

Nordhaug should be such a person. Had a real breakout season last year in his 2nd/final year on contract with Sky, inlcuding his GP Montreal win. Rabo/Blanco lured him with loadsamoney with DaveB wouldnt match. Problem is he's been hit with injury and all sorts since moving over, so too soon to judge on the carrying-over-success front. As is the case with any rider who left end last year.

Was going to say Nordhaug but you're right he's done nothing since leaving Sky. Maybe Cummings is a better example?

Richmond Racer

DeadCalm wrote:

Richmond Racer wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

But that's why I think it's a shame he didn't go for a smaller team. As I said to begin with - he was always going to be playing second fiddle there. Not blaming Sky. Not blaming Jonathan, the money are probably good, but that's how his position is and he could have been much higher up in the hierarchy - neo or not - in plenty of others teams.

You could look at it another way though, as others have quite rightly said that Sky have a team of 2,3,4,5th placed riders who were purchased and trained up to be as good as many other teams number 1 rider, with the rest of the team they seem to have applied a training regime that would make them pretty high up the order in other teams too.

If in 2-3 years time he his still not being repaid by the team in some events as leader or co-leader he could easily go then to anther team.

Can you name me an example? A rider that revived his carreer or trained up by Sky to take that 'Sky-momentum' with him to his new team with same succes?

Nordhaug should be such a person. Had a real breakout season last year in his 2nd/final year on contract with Sky, inlcuding his GP Montreal win. Rabo/Blanco lured him with loadsamoney with DaveB wouldnt match. Problem is he's been hit with injury and all sorts since moving over, so too soon to judge on the carrying-over-success front. As is the case with any rider who left end last year.

Was going to say Nordhaug but you're right he's done nothing since leaving Sky. Maybe Cummings is a better example?

Thom Thom, to be fair there's been less than 3 months of racing so far this season. To define someone's success on moving to another team within such strict time parameters, seems unreasonable to say the least

Abdoujaparov

frenchfighter wrote:

The best Henao photo out there ; )

You'd have thought gangster of his standing would have better muscle. They look weak.

thomthom

Gerrans had already great wins before he moved to Sky. Had his best win in MSR, yes, but he also had a mare in 2011 with poor results and injuries.

Good point with Team Sky not being that old. Perhaps too early to say that the young guns, who are doing greatly at Sky, won't do the same on their new teams. But there does seem to be a trend that the riders can't take the momentum to the new teams when moving from Sky. The best example is of course Rogers.

Richmond Racer

ThomThom wrote:

Gerrans had already great wins before he moved to Sky. Had his best win in MSR, yes, but he also had a mare in 2011 with poor results and injuries.

Good point with Team Sky not being that old. Perhaps too early to say that the young guns, who are doing greatly at Sky, won't do the same on their new teams. But there does seem to be a trend that the riders can't take the momentum to the new teams when moving from Sky. The best example is of course Rogers.

Again you're making that judgement based on, what, 2 races (CI, Pais Vasco)? Maybe better to give the benefit of a full season?

DeadCalm

Richmond Racer wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

Was going to say Nordhaug but you're right he's done nothing since leaving Sky. Maybe Cummings is a better example?

Thom Thom, to be fair there's been less than 3 months of racing so far this season. To define someone's success on moving to another team within such strict time parameters, seems unreasonable to say the least

In fairness to Thom Thom, it was me who said that. And yes, it sounds harsher than I meant which was that Nordhaug didn't really fit the criteria. I didn't mean it to be taken as he had somehow flopped since leaving Sky.

Richmond Racer

DeadCalm wrote:

Richmond Racer wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

Was going to say Nordhaug but you're right he's done nothing since leaving Sky. Maybe Cummings is a better example?

Thom Thom, to be fair there's been less than 3 months of racing so far this season. To define someone's success on moving to another team within such strict time parameters, seems unreasonable to say the least

In fairness to Thom Thom, it was me who said that. And yes, it sounds harsher than I meant which was that Nordhaug didn't really fit the criteria. I didn't mean it to be taken as he had somehow flopped since leaving Sky.

Oops, sorry Thom Thom

thomthom

Richmond Racer wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

Richmond Racer wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

But that's why I think it's a shame he didn't go for a smaller team. As I said to begin with - he was always going to be playing second fiddle there. Not blaming Sky. Not blaming Jonathan, the money are probably good, but that's how his position is and he could have been much higher up in the hierarchy - neo or not - in plenty of others teams.

You could look at it another way though, as others have quite rightly said that Sky have a team of 2,3,4,5th placed riders who were purchased and trained up to be as good as many other teams number 1 rider, with the rest of the team they seem to have applied a training regime that would make them pretty high up the order in other teams too.

If in 2-3 years time he his still not being repaid by the team in some events as leader or co-leader he could easily go then to anther team.

Can you name me an example? A rider that revived his carreer or trained up by Sky to take that 'Sky-momentum' with him to his new team with same succes?

Nordhaug should be such a person. Had a real breakout season last year in his 2nd/final year on contract with Sky, inlcuding his GP Montreal win. Rabo/Blanco lured him with loadsamoney with DaveB wouldnt match. Problem is he's been hit with injury and all sorts since moving over, so too soon to judge on the carrying-over-success front. As is the case with any rider who left end last year.

Was going to say Nordhaug but you're right he's done nothing since leaving Sky. Maybe Cummings is a better example?

Thom Thom, to be fair there's been less than 3 months of racing so far this season. To define someone's success on moving to another team within such strict time parameters, seems unreasonable to say the least

Point taken. I do think that this time around often shows what to expect from the riders, though.

DeadCalm

ThomThom wrote:

Gerrans had already great wins before he moved to Sky. Had his best win in MSR, yes, but he also had a mare in 2011 with poor results and injuries.

Good point with Team Sky not being that old. Perhaps too early to say that the young guns, who are doing greatly at Sky, won't do the same on their new teams. But there does seem to be a trend that the riders can't take the momentum to the new teams when moving from Sky. The best example is of course Rogers.

What riders apart from Nordhaug and Rogers have left Sky following a good season? I'm not sure that two riders can constitute a 'trend'.

andyp

Cavendish.

Although by his standards, just 6 GT stage wins was a poor return.

Richmond Racer

Thom Thom, you'd be the most demanding team manager in the history of the sport

thomthom

Richmond Racer wrote:

Thom Thom, you'd be the most demanding team manager in the history of the sport

I know where I'd start my career. Lotto-Belisol.

The roubaix team selection this year is still considered the biggest disgrace in the history of this sport!

RichN95.

ThomThom wrote:

Richmond Racer wrote:

Thom Thom, you'd be the most demanding team manager in the history of the sport

I know where I'd start my career. Lotto-Belisol.

The roubaix team selection this year is still considered the biggest disgrace in the history of this sport!

"still"? It was only five days ago.

thomthom

A lot of disgraceful stuff has occurred since last sunday. :-p

danlikesbikes

RichN95 wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

Richmond Racer wrote:

Thom Thom, you'd be the most demanding team manager in the history of the sport

I know where I'd start my career. Lotto-Belisol.

The roubaix team selection this year is still considered the biggest disgrace in the history of this sport!

"still"? It was only five days ago.

Well by using the word 'still' has just proved that he would be the most demanding team manager, like the style of it really shows spirit which perhaps some team mangers could do with

Richmond Racer

Danlikesbikes wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

ThomThom wrote:

Richmond Racer wrote:

Thom Thom, you'd be the most demanding team manager in the history of the sport

I know where I'd start my career. Lotto-Belisol.

The roubaix team selection this year is still considered the biggest disgrace in the history of this sport!

"still"? It was only five days ago.

Well by using the word 'still' has just proved that he would be the most demanding team manager, like the style of it really shows spirit.

Lars Ytting Bak would be the default leader of the entire race program, natch

And no rider would ever be allowed to climb into the car mid-race. You finish or you make your own way to team hotel

thomthom

Exactly.

danlikesbikes

Lars Ytting Bak would be the default leader of the entire race program, natch

And no rider would ever be allowed to climb into the car mid-race. You finish or you make your own way to team hotel[/quote]

TBH can't see anything wrong with that seems a bit old school but look at the way some DS's shout at riders from cars & seems to work for them

argyllflyer

In terms of Amstel, Sky are riding for Henao today according to EBH.