Fulcrum Racing Quattro vs Mavic Aksium S

rolf_f

Slowbike wrote:

If you want to go riding potholes then get a mountain bike - or at least a mountain bike wheel & tyre ...

And you were doing so well with some interesting considered comments and you spoil it all by finishing with a stupid, ill considered comment. :roll:

So I can't be bothered to respond to the rest of it save to say I don't really disagree with you - remember all I was doing was responding to a dense comment from Bar Shaker which basically implied - your wheels are really cheap therefore they are weak.

slowbike

ugo.santalucia wrote:

a rim being dented in a pothole doesn't say anything about the rim (but a lot about the rider... )

Are you being rude about Rolf F now? I'm sure there are rules about that ...

rolf_f

Slowbike wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

a rim being dented in a pothole doesn't say anything about the rim (but a lot about the rider... )

Are you being rude about Rolf F now? I'm sure there are rules about that ...

There shouldn't be.

Bending wheels in a pothole (the only time I've done it in 40,000 miles - let anyone who feels smug about not having ever bent a rim own up to at least a 6 figure, pothole free mileage before I'm impressed) does say something about me as a rider. That I ride every day on a variety of routes over badly maintained roads in all seasons and all weathers and amongst unpredictable traffic that one day forced me onto a bit of the road I never normally ride on and which for various reasons I'd not noticed was in such poor condition.

And Ugo is wrong of course - as he sometimes is (though entertainingly so). A rim dented in a pothole does say something about the rim. It cannot not say something about the rim. Unless a rim I made of cardboard and spoked with spaghetti proved as pothole resilient as the aforementioned Campag rims.

And I've never bent or broken a spoke in my life!

SHADOWMATE

So... marks out of 10 then for the Quatros from owners??

slowbike

My little bro has the quattros on his new bike as well as some (even) more expensive ones - he says they're great ...

just avoid pot holes ...

ugo.santalucia

Rolf F wrote:

And Ugo is wrong of course - as he sometimes is (though entertainingly so). A rim dented in a pothole does say something about the rim. It cannot not say something about the rim. Unless a rim I made of cardboard and spoked with spaghetti proved as pothole resilient as the aforementioned Campag rims.

And I've never bent or broken a spoke in my life!

I have no evidence that tougher rims dent less than lighter rims... potholes are not born equal and unless you can replicate the experiment, I'd say every accident is a one off... a big tyre at the right pressure will avoid most problems, it's the same thing in cars... you see damaged rims mostly with those low profile tyres

rolf_f

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Rolf F wrote:

And Ugo is wrong of course - as he sometimes is (though entertainingly so). A rim dented in a pothole does say something about the rim. It cannot not say something about the rim. Unless a rim I made of cardboard and spoked with spaghetti proved as pothole resilient as the aforementioned Campag rims.

And I've never bent or broken a spoke in my life!

I have no evidence that tougher rims dent less than lighter rims... potholes are not born equal and unless you can replicate the experiment, I'd say every accident is a one off... a big tyre at the right pressure will avoid most problems, it's the same thing in cars... you see damaged rims mostly with those low profile tyres

I may be nitpicking a bit but it must say something. Every accident is a one off indeed but it doesn't stop car manufacturers undertaking extensive crash testing. And if a tougher rim doesn't dent less than a lighter rim, I'd say it wasn't actually a tougher rim! Not that it occurred to me to try to test the theory by immediately riding my Neutrons into the same pothole!

Incidentally, my rims were fitted with 28mm tyres. Not the fattest but not the lowest profile either.

Gunnsie

Have a look on eBay/Gumtree/Freeads etc for some secondhand Mavic Krysium Elite...... I managed to get a set with Gatorskin Tyres and a 105 cassette for £235.

slowbike

Sorry - missed this bit ..

Rolf F wrote:

remember all I was doing was responding to a dense comment from Bar Shaker which basically implied - your wheels are really cheap therefore they are weak.

Ah - that's how it started ..

yer - price/strength isn't automatically linked ... it depends what the wheel & rim have been designed to do.

Then you've got to look at materials ..

My main hobby is sailing - a carbon tiller extension is far more expensive than the alloy one - and it will flex enormously ... then it'll break ... where as the alloy one will bend ... and stay bent ... then you can straighten it ... and in time it will fracture ...

Which one is tougher? It depends what you're trying to do with it - if you're frequently "bending" the extension then a carbon one may serve you better - up until the point that you bend it too far ... the alloy one will take more force to bend it, but once you bend it it will stay bent - it is possible to straighten it - sort of - but it's never quite the same. Fortunately you get a lot of leeway in how straight your extension needs to be! You don't get that with rims!

Of course, these are dissimilar materials being put to the same use - the rims we're talking about are all Alloy - but what mix? and on top of that, what is the structured design - including supports ...

orangepip

Rolf F wrote:

Bar Shaker wrote:

It could also be argued that something stronger than an £85 wheel may not have bent in the first place.

If that sort of money is a factor to you, then of course getting a cheap repair may be more important to you than having high performance equipment that you cannot afford to repair/replace.

The wheels being discussed above, such as Quattros etc, are very strong so should be very reliable, even if you ride down potholes and remain seated.

That could be argued but only by an idiot who is guessing.

These are 36 spoke touring wheels with Rigida Chrina rims and they went into a pothole 6 inches deep, me remaining seated, with a near vertical forward edge, at about 15mph. The wheels were so strong that they remained entirely true and round and I only realised the rims were bent (braking surface folded over, both sides of both rims) when I braked and felt the blocks rubbing on the deformation. I would bet a large sum of money that a pair of Quattros would have faired no better (and would probably have been unrideable afterwards).

You don't seem to know much about cycle wheels if you think that a cheapish wheel can't be built extremely strongly. Not necessarily the lightest wheel going but perfect for the purpose. I can afford more expensive wheels and do have them - but I actually know how little I'm actually getting for my money when I do spend more. It's not about knowing the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

PS - I would imagine that most people on here wouldn't wish to throw £120 away even if they can afford it. You are very fortunate if you regard £120 as not worth picking up.......

The thing about that kind of impact is that it is likely to damage other parts of a bike. From my own experience, crashing into a stationary transit van at 20+ mph left my front hope 32 spoke MTB wheel totally true. My suspension forks however not so much.

In that situation i might have preferred a less well built wheel that would've absorbed some of the impact...

Bar Shaker

Rolf F wrote:

Bar Shaker wrote:

It could also be argued that something stronger than an £85 wheel may not have bent in the first place.

That could be argued but only by an idiot who is guessing.

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You don't seem to know much about wheels

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... dense comment from Bar Shaker

Always personal insults from you, Rolf. Your points would be much better made without them. You would not speak to me like that to my face so why do it here?



I think it is a reasonable generalisation that for a similar level of performance, a £250 wheel will be stronger than an £85 wheel.

I also think that buying wheels on the basis of being able to repair them after crashing down potholes, is irrational. There will be some people who do ride down holes frequently and need to consider the cost of wheel repairs. Others will choose to ride with a bit more awareness, so avoiding wheel repair bills. Affordability has nothing to do with it, I put myself into this latter category as it simply makes my rides more enjoyable. Unless you are in the former category, the argument about repair costs (or the attractiveness of 36 spoke £85 wheels) isn't really valid to most other people.

It is actually my GF who rides on Quattros. She can sometimes be less careful than me, in the choice of her precise path. Her Quattros are still perfect despite a very good year of hard use. That, in my book, makes them a good buy and I stand by my recommendation of them.



Slowbike... another sailor here too. Cruising and Channel hopping rather than dingy racing, these days, though.