Nicole Cooke retire - is there any hope for womens cycling?

DonDaddyD

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Having said that, Women are also people and I think its entirely plausible to admire a Women for her physical beauty while and seperately respecting her physical/intellectual prowess, which may or may not far outweigh my own.

This I see is the problem with most Women's sport and especially cycling. How are we expected to take Women's cycling seriously when jutaposed with highly sexualised imagery?

Yes the sexual imagery will attract men, male dominated investors and one might argue that it will help sell cycling at the fashion level. However who is the target market here? Cycling is a sport first and foremost - the hybrid and hipsters did not precede the road bike and the racers. And why should women sexualise themselves to increase popularity to their part of the sport?

All the objectification of Women in cycling achieves is to act as a barrier for women to engage with the sport at all levels with a measure of credibility.

tailwindhome

TailWindHome wrote:

In fact, an U16 girl, from the club I was with, won several of the races unopposed.

Your honour, I would like to take this opportunity to insert some commas in this sentence.

Green Brompton

DonDaddyD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Having said that, Women are also people

Thanks for pointing that out. :roll:

notsoblue

DonDaddyD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Having said that, Women are also people

DonDaddyD

notsoblue wrote:

Green Brompton wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Having said that, Women are also people

Thanks for pointing that out. :roll:

Double sigh....

Getting your bellend of the year submissions in early I see...

Yes, edit what I wrote to take it out of context to make your ignorant point.

:roll:

suzyb

DonDaddyD wrote:

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Only because you don't have to live with tits and a vagina.

DonDaddyD

suzyb wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Only because you don't have to live with tits and a vagina.

Really, fascinating, tell me more. What is it like living with tits and a vagina?

I've never considered it to be honest.

walkingbootweather

DonDaddyD wrote:

suzyb wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Only because you don't have to live with tits and a vagina.

Really, fascinating, tell me more. What is it like living with tits and a vagina?

I've never considered it to be honest.

Why not ask Mrs DDD what it's like living with tits? She has to live with about 3 of them.....

notsoblue

DonDaddyD wrote:

notsoblue wrote:

Green Brompton wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Having said that, Women are also people

Thanks for pointing that out. :roll:

Double sigh....

Getting your bellend of the year submissions in early I see...

Yes, edit what I wrote to take it out of context to make your ignorant point.

:roll:

Hilariously I didnt have to edit anything. I don't really think you're a bigoted sexist, I just think its very very funny how you go to great lengths to show that you're not and almost prove the opposite.

"I'm not racist, but..."

Kieran_Burns

suzyb wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Only because you don't have to live with tits and a vagina.

I thought every married man did?

(as per conversation with my ex- one time "At least you don't have to suffer with a bloody period every month!!!"


I replied "Yes I do!" )

DonDaddyD

notsoblue wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

notsoblue wrote:

Green Brompton wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Having said that, Women are also people

Thanks for pointing that out. :roll:

Double sigh....

Getting your bellend of the year submissions in early I see...

Yes, edit what I wrote to take it out of context to make your ignorant point.

:roll:

Hilariously I didnt have to edit anything. I don't really think you're a bigoted sexist, I just think its very very funny how you go to great lengths to show that you're not and almost prove the opposite.

"I'm not racist, but..."

Here is what you quoted:

notsoblue wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Having said that, Women are also people

And here is the full sentence:

DDD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

Having said that, Women are also people and I think its entirely plausible to admire a Women for her physical beauty while and seperately respecting her physical/intellectual prowess, which may or may not far outweigh my own.

You'll note the bit in bold which you left out. It completely changes the context of what I wrote - which was in response to the sexism aimed mostly at MsManc.

NSB, its too early in the year to start being a prick so give it a rest.

Green Brompton

DonDaddyD wrote:

notsoblue wrote:

Green Brompton wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

The sexism in this thread is astounding.

Having said that, Women are also people

Thanks for pointing that out. :roll:

Double sigh....

Getting your bellend of the year submissions in early I see...

Yes, edit what I wrote to take it out of context to make your ignorant point.

:roll:

I didn't care about the rest of what you wrote, I just thought it was a pretty ridiculous statement to write and wanted to point that out! Anyone can go back on the same thread, even the same page, and read your full non edited comment if they really like!

DonDaddyD

Read my post directly above yours.

I'll understand that pride and being a bellend will prevent you from apologising publicly. It's alright, I know you really would like to.

clarkey cat

DonDaddyD wrote:

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

until they have kids anyway.

DonDaddyD

clarkey cat wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Women are fit, tits are amazing and vagina's are frankly a nice place to be and hang out.

until they have kids anyway.

Subjective that.

In fact that reminds me, there was this female athlete in the Womens Olympic road race. She took a break to start a family and returned to the sport and still manages to meet the level needed to be an Olympic athlete. That's impressive, returning to a 9-5 job is hard enough for some women. More should have been done to promote that as it could quite possibly be an amazing story.

notsoblue

DonDaddyD wrote:

NSB, its too early in the year to start being a prick so give it a rest.

:roll: *Anyone* could have written that, and in context or out of context it would still be ridiculous. Classic DDD though

spen666

The posts of some people on this thread is the biggest impediment to women's cycling.

The puerile postss and the gratuitous sexism have no place in a serious debate on women's cycling

msmancunia

DonDaddyD wrote:

Read my post directly above yours.

I'll understand that pride and being a bellend will prevent you from apologising publicly. It's alright, I know you really would like to.

DDD - I don't think anyone on here's calling you a sexist. We all know far too much about the awe you hold for the wonderful woman who is Ms DDD and gave birth to DDD minor to accuse you of that.

But the way the sentence was constructed, could be read as a contradiction in terms. The sentence was just edited to point out how it could be read.

So how about a few mins of Bernard Righton, the politically correct stand up to put us all in a happy place, eh?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svLyyzBC_qI

Green Brompton

Ah yes, sorry, after you wrote the women are people part, you then followed it by the part that you think it's 'entirely plausible' to like both their looks and their achievements at the same time... hmm, really? Thank you. Rest assured us women kind will now feel so privileged that you find it OK, no, in fact you find it 'plausible' to like more than one thing about a woman...

I won't feel the lipstick I might decide to put on is in, any way, vain...

Green Brompton

Nope, I didn't find it sexist, just a bit ridiculous. I appreciate that you appreciate women.

pangolin

DonDaddyD wrote:

Read my post directly above yours.

I'll understand that pride and being a bellend will prevent you from apologising publicly. It's alright, I know you really would like to.

Your post was pretty ridiculous DDD. I thought it was just an odd joke, but now you're defending it like it wasn't and calling people names. Well played sir.

tailwindhome

Green Brompton wrote:

us women

Oh! A twist in the thread. I like it.

DonDaddyD

FFS.

The POINT I was making is that many on here seem to see a female athlete and only see 'tits bum and vjayjay'. So I spelled that out in the second line of my post ["Women are fit..."]. You'll note the Kelly Brook photo. There is nothing remotely 'cyclist' about the photo right down to the contrasting red dress against the hi-viz yellow everyone else seems to be wearing; the eye is drawn to the girl in the red dress.

Despite Man's seemingly default position to objectify women (demonstrated best by Mudcow's two posts and the poster who said he'd like to sniff Kelly Brooke's saddle), my point is that it is possible to like a woman for both her attractive qualities and her skill in her choosen profession and the two do not have to be mutually exclusive. Because those posts (and others) suggest that some men are incapable of doing both at the same time.

I see that - the inability to both admire attractive qualities and skill seperately but at the same time - as being a negative element which is holding back Women's sport in general. The notion being that spectators cannot take it seriously because the women are just too attractive. Liz Hatch - do you think she was thinking about looking hot in this photo or about stretching her leg?

MsManc, the sentence was constructed to be sexist in the first instance and then to bring home the point that despite Man's very base thoughts its OK and possible to both acknowledge our more carnal infatuation while acknowledging and respecting the skill and ability of the person. Half the problem with Women's sports (beach Volleyball for example) is that many men cannot seperately identify the sexual attraction Women possess from acknowledging and appreciating their abilities as a credible athlete.

But seeing as that was largely misunderstood or not articulated properly on my part I will gracefully bow out.

spen666

Rule no 1 for DDD -- when in a hole, stop digging

veronese68

DDD I think you may have been trying to make a similar point to my earlier post. What i was trying to say, rather clumsily, is that you'd think the physical attraction added to the spectacle of the sport would make it more popular than it is. Unfortunately to get this message across to the great unwashed you have to be really unsubtle.
The Kelly Brook image may not say cyclist to you or I. But it does to the general population by virtue of the fact that she's on a bicycle. The message that picture is probably trying to put across is that you don't have to be a lycra loony to ride a bike anyone can do it. They use attractive celebrities because that is what many of the great unwashed aspire to.

veronese68

DonDaddyD wrote:

Liz Hatch - do you think she was thinking about looking hot in this photo or about stretching her leg?

I don't know what she was thinking, but I'm pretty damned sure the bloke in the background wasn't thinking about holding his belly in.

gtvlusso

So, to summarize:

Heterosexual men like women
Very Heterosexual men really like women
Gay men like men
Gay women like women

All of which has sod all to do with bike racing.

Back on topic;

Women's racing really needs a sponsor and a respected leadership team to deliver a strategy and push the sport forward - I hope that Nicole does this job, she has my support.

The doping stuff is blurring and masking the whole issue and I suspect the UCI is hiding and not wanting to court any more controversy with the upcoming Lance interview - My suspicion being that he will push this all back on the UCI's lack of enforcement. So, I don't think the UCI will be doing anything soon about this issue - sadly.

DonDaddyD

Veronese68 wrote:

DDD I think you may have been trying to make a similar point to my earlier post. What i was trying to say, rather clumsily, is that you'd think the physical attraction added to the spectacle of the sport would make it more popular than it is. Unfortunately to get this message across to the great unwashed you have to be really unsubtle.
The Kelly Brook image may not say cyclist to you or I. But it does to the general population by virtue of the fact that she's on a bicycle. The message that picture is probably trying to put across is that you don't have to be a lycra loony to ride a bike anyone can do it. They use attractive celebrities because that is what many of the great unwashed aspire to.

I kind of get that and to some degree it works when we refer to cycling as a hobby or casual passtime.

When you use the same approach to promote a sport containing serious athletes (in this case professional racing) then the unsubtle message is often used to ridicule the athletes themselves and IMO it proves counter productive.

I'd much rather a society that acknowledges that yes the athletes are (front cover of FHM) attractive but also they are very good and very skilled at what they do. Right now its all about whether they are fit or not.

Womens athletics isn't as objectified as cycling, we acknowledge Jessica Ennis as a great athlete and you do not get the same level of sexualised imagery as you do in cycling. Yet the athletes are more scantly clad. Why is this? Because we acknowledge that even though they are women and are attractive they are also credible sportspeople.

rubertoe

I said it before.

Race organisers need to get involved. You can have all the sponsorship in the world but without the races (and I mean meaningful races) then you have nothing.

The womens calander is falling appart - FFS they couldnt even call the female version of the "tour" the "Tour" because A.S.O threw their toys out of the pram.

Team4Luke

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