Make YT Tues dh bike lighter...

DodgeT

If I wanted to get the tues a bit lighter (full spec here http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=12883153 ), what would be the way forward?

Already done the Ti spring. I'm guessing;
wheels
seatpost / saddle
handlebars

would like to drop a couple of pound, if it can be done without too much splashing of the cash...

I was half thinking of getting a 2.0 when they're back in stock, as they were a claimed 16.4kg (2kg lighter) and selling the one I have now obviuosly, but the new models released are 17.7, 17.3 & 16.6kg but for quite a bit more dosh as the weight comes down. So i'm thinking the better option now would be just to stick with what I have and throw a bit of cash at it and hopefully drop it a touch.

Any suggestions?

lawman

Wheels and tyres would be a good place to start, crc have a wheel sale on atm, so see what they have to offer. Tyres you could go for Schwable Hans Dampfs in the new SG casing, should drop a pound atleast in weight where you'll notice it most. SDG i-beam saddle and posts are stupidly light, you don't really sit on the saddle for DH so get the I-fly, its like 130g or something silly like that. Lighter cranks would be next, depending on what bars/stem you have, without going carbon on the bars you won't save much weight.

Torres

It'd be worth weighing what you already have and then looking around. I've found in the past that stock parts can actually be quite light and not worth changing.

peter413

As has already been suggested, get yourself an SDG I Fly and I Beam seatpost combo, I wouldn't run anything else on a DH bike. And swapping the LS1+ guide for an LG1+ would save you about 80g or something. By the looks of it you are going to have to save lots of little bits of weight instead of one big chunk of weight, the spec already looks pretty solid.

Little things like the cassette can make a difference, going for an Ultegra cassette instead of the PG1050 should save you about 40g. You can save even more by only running the cogs you need and this is free. Consider chopping your post down as this is also free but if you ever raise your saddle you may not be able to do this. If you have a QR seatclamp consider a bolted one, this can save a few grammes and only costs a few quid. If you are running a steel chainring swap it out for an alloy one. The rims aren't the heaviest out there but something like the Stans Flow EX will save you a decent chunk but will also cost a fair bit and it depends wether you would trust them for DH, I personally would but not everyone does. Plus if your current spokes are plain gauge switching to some double butted could save you about 50g per wheel. Check the tubes as well, if you have freeride or DH tubes and want to keep them I would suggest only using one in the back, use a normal one in the front. If you were really serious about it you could fit air shocks, some people don't believe in them for DH but there are meant to be some good options out there now. You aren't going to save much weight at all in the bars unless you buy some carbon ones or maybe if you get lucky and you can find some Kore OCD's or similar, lighter than most alloy bars, I really rate them personally but I haven't been able to find any recently.

I wouldn't hold out too much hope of being able to save a good few pounds unless you spend some serious money or compromise performance though, 40 pounds isn't exactly the heaviest for a DH bike, not the lightest either but it could easily be heavier. Look at the Syndicate v10's, full carbon, no expense spared and I seem to remember reading they weighed 34 pounds. Think about the amount of money you could spend getting it that little bit lighter which you might not even notice much and then think about the number of uplifts or race entries that could buy you.

rockmonkeysc

I wouldn't go for light tyres, too many pinch flats with anything other than a dual ply. I Beam saddle will save a little weight. A set of Mavic EX721's will save a bit of weight and are bombproof.
Descendant cranks are the lightest I would use, X0 carbons have been known to snap. Ti spring is the biggest weight saving.
Unless your bike is massively heavy I wouldn't worry about weight on a DH bike. Mine is 39lb & I have ridden a 45lb Glory and to be honest I didn't feel the extra weight was slowing me down much.

The Rookie

Road rear mechs can be a handy weight saving of about 50g, not sure about compatability on SRAM 10sp though.

Weigh the seatpost and saddle (easy to do) and see how they come out, that seatpost just looks heavy!

DodgeT

Some interesting stuff there, cheers guys.

Superstar still have the flows deal on for £200, weight of 1900g for the pair, am seriously tempted at this as it should save a bit. Is there anything else in this kind of price bracket which would be better?

Looking at some i-beams on ebay as we speak.. The current seatpost comes out at around 320g, so not light.

Already running descendant cranks.

Kenda nevegal's are stupid light at around 800gm each. They seem pretty good too on the outings i've done so far. Admittedly I switched to a pair of butchers for stiniog at a whopping 1.3kg each..

peter413

721's wouldn't save any weight. That Superstar/Flow deal is probably the best deal as long as you are confident in the rims and I would personally factor in the cost of a full re-tension of the spokes given Superstar's history of ropey builds sometimes, it's just a bonus if it isn't needed, thats just me though. You would save about 100g over the Supra D's with the original Flow's per wheel plus you would maybe save a bit in the hubs and spokes depending on what's on there at the moment.

I do second not going for lighter tyres unless you are going tubeless, you might be able to get away with it but you aren't going to get much lighter than 800g and still get the same performance.

DodgeT

Had SS built wheels before and pretty confident with the build. They also offer free re-tension service so thats fine. Think I may just get some, sure I could get rid of the others on ebay and get some cash back.

Just missed out on a carbon i beam post..

I had thought about getting a 2.0, as there's 600gm + saving in the frame alone, but by the time I buy it and sell mine, it'll prob cost me around £500. Maybe an option for future - I like messing with things

Might of mislead re the tyres, i'm certainly not going any lighter than the nevegals that are already fitted.

rockmonkeysc

peter413 wrote:

721's wouldn't save any weight. That Superstar/Flow deal is probably the best deal as long as you are confident in the rims and I would personally factor in the cost of a full re-tension of the spokes given Superstar's history of ropey builds sometimes, it's just a bonus if it isn't needed, thats just me though. You would save about 100g over the Supra D's with the original Flow's per wheel plus you would maybe save a bit in the hubs and spokes depending on what's on there at the moment.

I do second not going for lighter tyres unless you are going tubeless, you might be able to get away with it but you aren't going to get much lighter than 800g and still get the same performance.

Flows are too weak for DH. I have seen plenty of them trashed and know people who have fitted them and gone back to EX721's because of strength.
I have had three sets of wheels from Superstar and the build has been spot on.
If you really want to save weight then change the forks. Boxxers arent light and some 180mm single crowns have the same A-C length.

Proutster

Option 1.
Get a Summum and a cheap pair of fishing scales:



Option 2.
Less pies

Other than that, I have nothing constructive to add...


Interested in the SDG I-beam saddle bit though, will weigh mine this week and see what that is and how it compares to the SDG.

You still up for Racers Guild on Sunday if the Snopocalypse doesn't happen?

rockmonkeysc

A set of Rockshox Totems will save you 230g compared to Boxxers, they have the same a-c so wont affect the head angle and you will be able to do bar spins.

DodgeT

Proutster wrote:

Option 1.
Get a Summum and a cheap pair of fishing scales:

Option 2.
Less pies

Other than that, I have nothing constructive to add...


Interested in the SDG I-beam saddle bit though, will weigh mine this week and see what that is and how it compares to the SDG.

You still up for Racers Guild on Sunday if the Snopocalypse doesn't happen?

Hmm, good idea but I like the larger frame.. and I like pies, especially mince pies

Would of been as I really like the red course, but am off to the lakes for a long weekend on fri. Unless of course snow stops that..

DodgeT

Well, the spending has begun

Set of flows - there's mixed thoughts on DH use for these, but bearing in mind i'm a big pussay when it comes to nasty stuff, i'm sure these will be fine.
ESI chunky grips.
Carbon ibeam saddle and post.

Should lose around 600 - 700gm for those.

Would like some handlebars now, hopefully something around the 250gm mark, then i'll lose nearly another 100gm off the front end. Any suggestions, need to be 750mm + ?

dusk

raceface sixc

lawman

Havoc 35 carbon bars and stem, super lights d quality stuff, if you want to keep stems then either the sixc's or Enve DH bars

DCR00

maybe a daft question, but why is weight a concern for a DH bike ?

DodgeT

Gona go for the 31.8 carbon havocs, keeps stem options open.

@ DCR, I have severe upgraditus and just love messing with my bikes. Plus, i'm sick of pushing a 40lber up those darn hills

rockmonkeysc

It's really not much easier pushing up a 37lb DH bike. I swapped bikes with a mate for a couple runs and I was sruprised that the 4lb weight difference made bugger all difference when pushing up. I think it has more to do with the size and geometry of the bike.

DodgeT

Was a bit tongue in cheek really that comment, as I said, like messing / upgrading / changing things...

On the subject of handlebars, was just gona click buy on the havocs, then thought exotic!!!

http://www.carboncycles.cc/?s=0&t=2&c=94&p=1063& wonder if these are up to the job???? Bloody light at 157gm, considering the havocs are 235. Guessing it would be too fragile. At least the havoc is in dirt 100 as being a proper downhill bar.

peter413

Exotic themselves say XC, maybe AM, only for those bars, I certainly wouldn't trust them. There's a reason they're lighter than the Easton's, Enve's and Raceface's.

IIRC the Sixc's are slightly lighter than the Havoc's and are wider so would be even lighter once you cut them down however they might be slightly weaker than the Havoc's. What stem is on there just now? Some stems are incredibly heavy.

I wouldn't bother with 35mm bars yet for weight saving reasons, the bars might be lighter but the lightest 35mm stem I can find is a Kore one at about 170g and that seems to be quite hard to get in this country, the Havoc one weighs 190g. Unless you are talking about bolt on stems, then it makes more sense since the Havoc 35mm is only 110g but you still have the problem that you are stuck with 35mm bars although a few companies seem to be embracing it already.

DodgeT

Definately not going for the exotic ones, don't fancy the risk of eating the stem.

Sticking with the 31.8 as agreed, more options available. Don't know the weight of mine yet (will weigh at the weekend) but found a gravity light for a quite healthy 118gm, so could be a nice saving there.

Flows just arrived, but Doh, there 135mm axle not 150. The options just said 12mm thru axle, so being silly I assumed that all 12mm thru's were 150mm, obviously not.
So question to myself is now, do I return for refund and look elsewhere, or do I buy a 150mm tank hub and relace the back wheel?

peter413

Personally I would just send them back and get a pair of Hope Hoops with the newer Flow EX rims for about £260 from The Bike Outlet or you might be able to find them cheaper elsewhere, just remember to make sure it's the 150mm option. Don't worry, you're not the first to make that mistake and you won't be the last Front and Rear.

Saves the hassle of unlacing and relacing the current wheel plus you might need new spokes and the Flow EX's are stronger and wider with only a 20g weight penalty IIRC. Plus the Hoops are good value as well since they come with both the 20mm and QR adaptors for the front and 2 spare spokes. If you aren't going to use the QR adaptor you can always sell it and make a little more money back.

DCR00

Id spend the money upgrading the dampers in the forks personally, especially the rebound damper

The R2C2 damper would give you more comp adjustment and a dual flow rebound damper (this made a massive difference to how my fork performed), or you could look at something custom from J-Tech

Totally onboard with the upgrade-itis, but IMO this sort of upgrade would have a far larger impact on how the bike performed versus new wheels that are a couple of hundred grams lighter

rockmonkeysc

DCR00 wrote:

Id spend the money upgrading the dampers in the forks personally, especially the rebound damper

The R2C2 damper would give you more comp adjustment and a dual flow rebound damper (this made a massive difference to how my fork performed), or you could look at something custom from J-Tech

Totally onboard with the upgrade-itis, but IMO this sort of upgrade would have a far larger impact on how the bike performed versus new wheels that are a couple of hundred grams lighter

That makes a lot of sense. I have the R2C2 Boxxer and it is extremely well controlled. Also a CCDB shock does very good things for your rear end

DodgeT

Good points re shocks, that may come later, but for now they do what I want them to.

Out of interest, I, ve been weighing wheels... completely stripped mine down for a true comparison.

Flows with switch hubs
Front, 20mm = 901gm
Rear 12 x 135 = 1041gm
1941 for the pair

Alex supra d on division hubs
Front, 20mm = 1018gm
Rear 12 x 150 = 1199gm
2217 for the pair

Hmm

Northwind

First investment, a decent set of scales. You can't weightweenie til you know what weights you have already. Weight tends to be tucked away in sneaky places like cassettes, etc.

I'd replace the tyres on general principles, DH Nevegals are pish. (I love the trail versions mind). Now here you've got options, I've been getting on well with the SX carcass Butchers which are basically a ply-and-a-half, but not quite as sticky as the standard Butcher DH. Schwalbe are doing cool things with carcasses too. Not everyone needs a dualply these days.

Most important really, don't fret too much about weight, it's a DH bike- go for performance, fit and strength. Fork internals maybe, personally i'd be doing the brakes.

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Flows are too weak for DH.

They've won 2 world cups I used mine for the endurance dh race the last 2 years, they ended up a bit dingy to be fair but they're more than strong enough for dh. If I manage to kill them I'll switch to Exs but they're doing grand so far.

DodgeT

Using some mettler toledo lab scales, calibrated too, so no worries there. As said, I'm not overstressed re weight of the bike, just doing it for a bit of fun really, to see what can be saved for not obscene amounts of cash.
Theyre the folding nevegals, actually quite like them tbh.
Just bought a set of new slx brakes for the enduro. What would you recommend for the tues?
Interesting points on the flows. From what ive read about them ive got no concerns, just needs to represent a worthwhile saving.

lawman

A few guys at uni use xt's on DH bikes, I had to downsize te rear rotor on my hardtail as the 180mm I had on was just too powerful for xc, so you should have no worries with xts and 200mm rotors. The hans dampf in the super gravity casing would be my bet for tyres, under a kilo each and they were used on the WC circuit by a fair few, think Danny hart even ran one on the rear for fort william, and tracks don't get much rougher than that!

DodgeT

Lets talk wheels again for a minute... The SS flow's I have are going back for refund, so, 2 best options I can see are;

pro 2 with ex721's, 2.095kg, so 120 ish gm saving
pro 2 with flow ex, 1.89kg, so 320 ish gm saving

both the same price.... Have to say am tempted at the flows.

rockmonkeysc

Northwind wrote:

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Flows are too weak for DH.

They've won 2 world cups I used mine for the endurance dh race the last 2 years, they ended up a bit dingy to be fair but they're more than strong enough for dh. If I manage to kill them I'll switch to Exs but they're doing grand so far.

World cup racers get their wheels re-tensioned for each run and their rims aren't standard off the shelf parts. Speak to any racer who pays for his own parts and they will tell you to get EX721's. They aren't as light as flows but they are bombproof and low maintenance. Mine lasted two seasons of DH racing (I'm 15.5 stone so I do break wheels) with no dents and maybe three or four re-tensions at most.