Belfast...
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If anyone gets a chance then check out 'The Nolan Show' on the BBC iplayer. I don't think i've ever watched a better example of car crash TV in my life. The religious bigots were out in force last night in a big way, cringeworthy in the extreme.
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LiamW wrote:If anyone gets a chance then check out 'The Nolan Show' on the BBC iplayer. I don't think i've ever watched a better example of car crash TV in my life. The religious bigots were out in force last night in a big way, cringeworthy in the extreme.
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Apart from Willie Ward , I dont think there was a single other nationalist in the crowd. A loyalist herd hijacked the show and those people do nothing but bring shame upon n.ireland with their bigoted antics.2012 Cannondale CAAD 8 1050 -
As an East Belfast resident last night's Nolan Show was painful, embarrassing viewing. The whole audience seemed to be from Pitt Park.
As others have said, the protests are not just about the fleg. The loyalists genuinely feel aggrieved about a lot of things. Most of these things are their own fault, but that doesn't seem to register with them.
What saddens me most is the level of bigotry in young people (from both sides) who have no memory of the Troubles. We've a long way to go.0 -
Ive a short way to go, to the airport :P This place will never change.0
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Last week on radio 5 live your say segment , the broadcast was co-hosted with nicky campbell and stephen nolan. Some female blow hard from east belfast was mouthing off and important dates in loyalist history were raised , nicky campbell said battle of the boyne and the female blow hard said yes......1916. Nicky Campbell paused and said surely you mean 1690 . She was so ignorant and stupid she confused the battle of the boyne with the republican easter rising, and didnt that just show the intelligence levels of the "peaceful :shock: " east belfast protesters who are laying belfast to ruin :roll:2012 Cannondale CAAD 8 1050
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sure one of them thought St Patrick was a protestant and that nationalists were stealing british saints.0
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The Nolan Show last night was embarrassing. The young guy representing that """political party""" Ulster Young Voice or whatever its called was just spouting off the usual crap. His big fail was when he told Sinn Fein and SDLP he was coming after their votes and so on, but the SDLP pointed out he wont be coming after their votes he will be taking the DUP/UUP votes and he couldn't get his head around it that Catholics wont vote for his party.
It was basically a mob in the audience with the constant shouting and the "Never" and "No Surrender" was like watching something from the 70/80's.0 -
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Gutter dwellers in being bigoted idiots non shocker.
It's a complete and utter embarrassment, but you will never educate these people. Their CPU is at 100% just reminding themselves to breath, eat and riot anything beyond that is impossible.0 -
Stupot101 wrote:As an East Belfast resident...the protests are not just about the fleg. The loyalists genuinely feel aggrieved about a lot of things. Most of these things are their own fault, but that doesn't seem to register with them. We've a long way to go.
This hits the nail on the head for me.
As a Lisburn resident, we've been mostly insulated from it, although when the national media covered the story of an 11 yr old arrested in a riot, that specific youngster was lifted here in the town. We could hear the fireworks being lobbed at the PSNI. The stupid thing is, Lisburn City Council voted to only fly the flag on designated days YEARS ago and no one even noticed! The 'loyalists' (I'm loath to use that term for people who have tried to murder police officers several times in the last month or so) are adamant that their "identity" is at stake, but see no irony whatsoever in protesting whilst masking their very identity behind balaclavas and Rangers scarfs! Indeed I've lost count at the amount of times I've seen the Union Flag paraded at road block both upside down AND back to front. Doesn't suggest they care that much about it to me. They also seem to forget that had they made more of an effort at the last elections to return Unionist candidates, this might never have happened. Voter apathy, not helped by the umpteen Unionist parties all having candidates standing for the same seat doesn't help win votes in the Council chamber such as that which led to the flag coming down. All these protests are doing is alienating the 'Loyalist' community from the very people (those on the UK Mainland) that they purport to want to be a continued part of. I suspect the relatively tongue in cheek comment earlier about towing the province into the Atlantic is not far off what a lot of people on the Mainland think ("not our problem, it's Ireland" was what one English friend said to me when I asked his thoughts!).
The simple fact is though that Protestants feel they are less able to celebrate their British-based culture whilst Roman Catholics are being greater freedom to celebrate their Irish-based roots. I'm not convinced that is actually as true as they would have us believe but I do think there is some merit in it. Bigotry and fear is in the main the reasons why no middle ground can, or possibly will ever, be found.0 -
well said mate. the problem with introducing equality between two sides is that one has to give and the other take. else it would have been equal to start with.
take the PSNI, under its former guise a mainly protestant organisation. Then there was an attempt to normalise it. New name, and a huge recruitment drive to get the catholic membership up towards 50/50. This has caused huge annoyance on the protestant side but was absolutely necessary to attempt to get a police force hated equally by both sides.
Another must have is a portrait of normalisation. Flags flying 365 days a year when they dont anywhere else is not normal, and as such they were right (imo) to go to designated days. Calls for flying the irish flag are equally as ridiculous as this is not normal either. The skin or normality is essential to mask the stench of sectarianism still (as demonstrated) rife on our streets. But maybe then people will start to forget about it and move towards normality, which lets face it, is what everyone wants (bar a small bunch of nutters)0 -
Completely agreed, the main fault lies with the DUP who stoked it all up, playing the mob riot card to get back their East Belfast seat. If Robinson had to live down Templemore Ave perhaps he would have though twice about lighting the torch paper.
Until those silent pro-union people who don't vote or who make do with voting DUP/UUP actually get organised and articulate a pro-union alternative more in keeping with mainland British values, rather than the Ulster-Protestant-Nationalist 'version' defined by DUP/UUP then NI will remained polarised, a big section of pro-union people remain unrepresented, and the uneducated working class unionists will continue to be led unflinchingly by the nose into attacking police, into hate crime acts, criminal records, and wrecking their already disadvantaged areas.
The only politician from the union side of the tracks who has broken ranks and told it like it is is Basil Mccrea, he articulates what many pro-union people feel, he needs a bigger platform. I thought Alliance's position was entirely reasonable.0 -
did Basil get booted out? Or get away with just a slap in the chops from Nesbitt? Was unreal that he got chastised for speaking sense.0
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At the risk of inciting some strong feelings...
Firstly, I was at a 'mixed' (now thats a strange thing to actually have to mention it) wedding in Dromara. It was a great event, great atmosphere - probably the best wedding I have been to, thats the ironic contradiction. I was talking with a guy who was from Larne. He said "...the problem is that you have a handful of people intent on nothing but hatred and violence on both sides".
Secondly at the risk of sounding naieve, I would like to ask why. Why did they let out all of those prisoners as part of the 'peace process' ? I had a relative who worked for Scotland Yard. He was high up in Narcotics. He followed the link between narcotics and funding of sectarian groups. He described some of the atrocities that they committed from knee capping to tyre necklasses (and a lot worse). Why release that unrepentant crue back into society ? For the sake of a peace process but seemingly no consideration for the long term effects of the repatriation of hatred. I doubt it would be possible to say that they have no effect on the current troubles.
Unemployment, boredom and blame must be high on the list of catalysts, its universally common in these situations.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
pinarello001 wrote:At the risk of inciting some strong feelings...
Firstly, I was at a 'mixed' (now thats a strange thing to actually have to mention it) wedding in Dromara. It was a great event, great atmosphere - probably the best wedding I have been to, thats the ironic contradiction. I was talking with a guy who was from Larne. He said "...the problem is that you have a handful of people intent on nothing but hatred and violence on both sides".
Secondly at the risk of sounding naieve, I would like to ask why. Why did they let out all of those prisoners as part of the 'peace process' ? I had a relative who worked for Scotland Yard. He was high up in Narcotics. He followed the link between narcotics and funding of sectarian groups. He described some of the atrocities that they committed from knee capping to tyre necklasses (and a lot worse). Why release that unrepentant crue back into society ? For the sake of a peace process but seemingly no consideration for the long term effects of the repatriation of hatred. I doubt it would be possible to say that they have no effect on the current troubles.
Unemployment, boredom and blame must be high on the list of catalysts, its universally common in these situations.
They were released because their support was needed for a 'ceasefire' and the resultant support for the Good Friday Agreement. Without that support there could well be sectarian murders on the same scale as pre 1994. Sadly in both Loyalist and Nationalist areas these people had/have a lot of support.0 -
I feel sorry for the staff at the Belfast Tourist Board....tough gig.I don't mean to brag, I don't mean to boast, but I'm intercontinental when I eat French toast...0
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well if you consider what the landscape was like in the early 90s. The IRA was at war with Britain and the UVF/UFF/UDA etc etc were at war with the IRA (well not so much the IRA but the nationalist population). In order to bring things to a conclusion they both needed to stop. In order to do that an amnesty had to be given to anyone convicted of being in these organisations, hence the prisoner release.
Personally I find it distasteful that this should have happened but it did facilitate the ceasefire and decommissioning of (most) weapons and thus brought an end to the armed conflict. Of course loyalists still racketeer and sell drugs etc, and the hardline IRA men went on to form the CIRA/RIRA whatever they call themselves but the goal was achieved, no more organised conflict, and peace on the streets.
Price worth paying? yes imo. Do we have to like it? nope. but we will get over it and move on. Soon most of those guys will be pensioners.0 -
Agree with all that.0
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Im more worried about the new breed of young folks who have no memory of the troubles and are filled with such hatred for the "other side". Probably moreso than people who grew up in the troubles.
Its astonishing how strong these people feel, the main source (a FB page I posted above) has now been removed by court order lol it was so bad!0 -
I know what you mean. A lot of kids referring to 'us' and 'we' and 'them' in the very past tense (ie before they were even born!) that makes you wonder about their upbringing and that which they will one day be able to give of their own offspring. Vicious circle?
It wasn't that long ago that Mitchel McLaughlin (dunno the Gaelic spelling!) was apparantly jokingly referred to within Sinn Fein as "the war dodger" because he was the only elected member never to have actively served in the Provisional IRA. I suspect there are a good number of 'war dodgers' amongst the SF membership now which can only be a good thing (opposite of the above vicious circle?).
It does frighten me though when I see some of our elected representatives and how they were basically criminals and thugs with barely a brain cell between them not so long ago. I then look at masked protestors rioting in East Belfast and wonder if that's one or more of our future politicians. Depressing.
I don't think the current tensions and the fact we are in the financial predicament we are at present are any coincidence (if that's any form of hope to look forward to!).0 -
While republicans were in jail the vast majority done university degrees in politics and history. On the loyalist side they done weights.....
That sums up the 2 sides perfectly. Hence the reason why grass roots loyalism have no real representation in local politics.0 -
Went on the open top bus tour round Belfast viewing the murials as Hilda Ogden would say, on the Falls and Shankhill roads.The tour guide was giving a running commentary and while telling us about a mural commemorating The Battle of The Boyne an American tourist on the bus asks rather loudly "Oh really,who won that war?".To which a local replied "It's not over yet!"0
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LMFAO classic!!!! Im using that.
Irony being 9/10 protestors wouldnt know what the battle of the boyne was about.0
