Prestige bike makes

the playing mantis

what are considered the most elite, prestgious bike makes and why?

i assume the following; cervelo, bianchi, pinarello, colnago, storck, what else? and why are these supposedly prestigious?

StillGoing

I wouldn't say Bianchi were prestige? It also depends what you mean by prestige; is it price, construction, equipment levels or even rarity? Even a prestige manufacturer can put out a budget version of their brand but not all such as Cipollini although even their cheapest bike/frameset is probably budget in comparison with their top of the range stuff.

The other question is why does it matter? A Bianchi, Willier, Trek, Giant etc may not be prestige to some, but to the owner it represents a significant investment and as long as they enjoy riding it all is good. Owning a prestige bike doesn't make you a better rider; it's ability that does that no matter what you ride.

napoleond

Hong Fu

Bozman

Look, Baum and Ribble

DavidJB

I'm betting prestige == overpriced.

smidsy

pres·tige/presˈtēZH/Noun:
1.Respect and admiration felt for someone or something on the basis of their achievements or quality.
2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration.

So if the Bianchi does that for him then yes it is a prestige make.

rolf_f

smidsy wrote:

pres·tige/presˈtēZH/Noun:
1.Respect and admiration felt for someone or something on the basis of their achievements or quality.
2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration.

So if the Bianchi does that for him then yes it is a prestige make.

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. All very PC and cuddly but it just changes the meaning of the term into something it wasn't. You can use the same argument to call Ford a premium brand.

greasedscotsman

Hmm, prestige?

smidsy

Rolf F wrote:

smidsy wrote:

pres·tige/presˈtēZH/Noun:
1.Respect and admiration felt for someone or something on the basis of their achievements or quality.
2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration.

So if the Bianchi does that for him then yes it is a prestige make.

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. And YOUR problem with that is??

All very PC and cuddly but it just changes the meaning of the term into something it wasn't. No it does not, that is the dictionery definition.

You can use the same argument to call Ford a premium brand. The only debateably points are what the indvidual considers to be achievements and quality,

dsoutar

philthy3 wrote:

IThe other question is why does it matter? A Bianchi, Willier, Trek, Giant etc may not be prestige to some, but to the owner it represents a significant investment and as long as they enjoy riding it all is good. Owning a prestige bike doesn't make you a better rider; it's ability that does that no matter what you ride.

Mine is a thing of beauty, to be admired, and if it hasn't rained for a week with no chance of rain in the next week I might just take it out. Otherwise it's the old Trek I'm afraid

Corporate Camper

smidsy wrote:

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. And YOUR problem with that is??

My problem with that is it's simply not true. I grew up in a town that used to have an RAF base in and later an Army Barracks, some of the squaddies were complete ar$eholes; nothing but violent low-life thugs.

I've quite often heard people say things like "If he hadn't got in to the Army then he'd probably be in jail or dead by now"... that's probably because he's just a cock.

lakesluddite

smidsy wrote:

Rolf F wrote:

smidsy wrote:

pres·tige/presˈtēZH/Noun:
1.Respect and admiration felt for someone or something on the basis of their achievements or quality.
2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration.

So if the Bianchi does that for him then yes it is a prestige make.

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. And YOUR problem with that is??

All very PC and cuddly but it just changes the meaning of the term into something it wasn't. No it does not, that is the dictionery definition.

You can use the same argument to call Ford a premium brand. The only debateably points are what the indvidual considers to be achievements and quality,

"2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration. "

From my interpretation of that definition, it doesn't mean that if ONE individual defines something (or someone) as prestigious, then it is automatically so - surely it would have to be a consensus to achieve that status. I could say that I now own a brand new prestigious Primark jumper, but that would not make it so, it would merely highlight my delusion.

Re the Army issue, you become a hero by doing something heroic, not the instant you sign on the dotted line in your local recruitment office. It's not heresy or unpatriotic to point that out. Personally I think most of the front line staff in the NHS are heroic, I don't hold the same views about the NHS administration.

Also - did you spell 'Dictionary' that way ironically?

napoleond

For me, a prestige brand is one that I covet. Personal but hey.
Not based on price so much, I'd love a custom Feather as much as I'd love a custom Baum or Crumpton.

jefflad

NapoleonD wrote:

For me, a prestige brand is one that I covet. Personal but hey.
Not based on price so much, I'd love a custom Feather as much as I'd love a custom Baum or Crumpton.

Like apple products? :roll:

smidsy

Corporate Camper wrote:

smidsy wrote:

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. And YOUR problem with that is??

My problem with that is it's simply not true. I grew up in a town that used to have an RAF base in and later an Army Barracks, some of the squaddies were complete ar$eholes; nothing but violent low-life thugs.

I've quite often heard people say things like "If he hadn't got in to the Army then he'd probably be in jail or dead by now"... that's probably because he's just a fool.

No one said a hero had to be sensible and nice. Anyone who puts themselves up to be shot at (and I mean literally not by posting on the interweb) has my respect.

Anyway the point is prestige has a definition and thats that.

rolf_f

smidsy wrote:

Corporate Camper wrote:

smidsy wrote:

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. And YOUR problem with that is??

My problem with that is it's simply not true. I grew up in a town that used to have an RAF base in and later an Army Barracks, some of the squaddies were complete ar$eholes; nothing but violent low-life thugs.

I've quite often heard people say things like "If he hadn't got in to the Army then he'd probably be in jail or dead by now"... that's probably because he's just a fool.

No one said a hero had to be sensible and nice. Anyone who puts themselves up to be shot at (and I mean literally not by posting on the interweb) has my respect.

Anyway the point is prestige has a definition and thats that.

Yes but the definition has to presume a certain perception. In the third world, the cheapest, nastiest Apollo BSO would be seen as a prestige item purely because it was brand new - but this point you have ackowledged yourself. We live in the first world so we have certain opinions on what constitutes a prestige brand - I think most people would regard Bianchi as a bit like Alfa; not exactly prestige but a bit classier than the average.

And as for my problem with calling everyone in the army a hero? Well, it's a bit of an insult to those who are actually, truly heroic isn't it to pretend that everyone in the army is surely? There is a big difference to riding along in a Landrover and getting blown up completely unawares by a roadside bomb than seeing an approaching vehicle, strongly suspecting it to be a suicide bomber and going out to stop it in the full knowledge that if you are right you are probably going to die.

I'm not saying that it isn't brave to do all of the above and i'm grateful it isn't me that has to do it - but I do say that if you call everyone a hero what term to you use for the person who really does go beyond the call of duty? All it does is devalue a perfectly functional term which then means you have to find another less satisfactory term to replace it.

I hope you can see what I'm getting at here and that you aren't tempted to make a 'you don't appreciate what our soldiers do' response because really I do.........

snoopsmydogg

not everyone in the army is a hero. my old neighbour was a radio operator who missed his last 3 postings due to an alleged bad back.

Odd thing was it didnt stop him going out on his kawasaki ninja almost every day, fitting security lights and fixing his roof while receiving full sick pay.

Joeblack

Rolf F wrote:

smidsy wrote:

pres·tige/presˈtēZH/Noun:
1.Respect and admiration felt for someone or something on the basis of their achievements or quality.
2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration.

So if the Bianchi does that for him then yes it is a prestige make.

That's like calling everyone who serves in the army a hero. All very PC and cuddly but it just changes the meaning of the term into something it wasn't. You can use the same argument to call Ford a premium brand.

You and your hatred of Ford is really starting to become worrying!!!

Do you work for a competitor?

napoleond

jefflad wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

For me, a prestige brand is one that I covet. Personal but hey.
Not based on price so much, I'd love a custom Feather as much as I'd love a custom Baum or Crumpton.

Like apple products? :roll:

Apple don't make bikes

Hoopdriver

smidsy wrote:

pres·tige/presˈtēZH/Noun:
1.Respect and admiration felt for someone or something on the basis of their achievements or quality.
2.Denoting something that arouses such respect or admiration.

So if the Bianchi does that for him then yes it is a prestige make.

So you are going into the dictionary business are you, setting up shop across the street from the OED and offering your own definitions? Last time I memorized the OED it seemed to me they gave as the first definition of 'Prestige' as: an illusion, a conjuring trick; a deception, an imposture.

The second was influence, reputation or popular esteem derived from character, achievements or association.

the playing mantis

it doesnt matter, jeez, its just a general question dont read so much into it!, im not buying a bike on the back of it!

was just curious.

rolf_f

Joeblack wrote:

You and your hatred of Ford is really starting to become worrying!!!

Do you work for a competitor?

Now where have I implied any hatred for Ford?*

*though arguably you may be able to accuse me of having a worrying fixation about Ford!

Joeblack

Rolf F wrote:

Joeblack wrote:

You and your hatred of Ford is really starting to become worrying!!!

Do you work for a competitor?

Now where have I implied any hatred for Ford?*

*though arguably you may be able to accuse me of having a worrying fixation about Ford!

Agreed hatred is probably a bit strong and fixation would be more appropriate

verylonglegs

A prestigious brand could probably influence it's customers thinking with it's new designs/products where as non-prestigious ones have to follow customers and popular demand...how about that?

silverpigeon

NapoleonD wrote:

jefflad wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

For me, a prestige brand is one that I covet. Personal but hey.
Not based on price so much, I'd love a custom Feather as much as I'd love a custom Baum or Crumpton.

Like apple products? :roll:

Apple don't make bikes

He means one of these

southdownswolf

To me a prestige brand signifies a quality that is beyond the normal. Many brands such as Trek, Cannondale etc might achieve quality on their high end bikes, but the rest of the range is probably a similar level to any mass produced bike from the far east.

smidsy wrote:

No one said a hero had to be sensible and nice. Anyone who puts themselves up to be shot at (and I mean literally not by posting on the interweb) has my respect.

So do you condone gang violence?

southdownswolf

silverpigeon wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

jefflad wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

For me, a prestige brand is one that I covet. Personal but hey.
Not based on price so much, I'd love a custom Feather as much as I'd love a custom Baum or Crumpton.

Like apple products? :roll:

Apple don't make bikes

He means one of these

surely he means this?

tim_wand

For me Palmares and racing history comes into it a great deal.

A friend of mine owns a specialist vintage and prestige car dealership. He classes vintage as Pre War and makes most money on Prestige cars which have a racing pedigree.

Using this anology into the bike world you would be looking at Peugeot and Bianchi. so other than a Bianchi Oltre I suppose it doesnt hold up.

The problem is now days that very few manufacturers produce in their country of origin so you get the generic Hong Fu chinnarello framesets.

The only Colnago I would consider owning is the C59 and Master as these are still built in Cambiago.

I also consider handbuilt frames such as Mercian more prestigious than say " Handbuilt by robots" BMC Impecs.

Ultimately though I think Nap's definition is about the closest to my way of thinking.

"A bike I would Covet"

desweller

I suppose a prestige badge would have to involve some exclusivity, so Storck, Parlee etc. would be in there, whereas your Specializeds and Treks wouldn't (despite making some very high-end stuff) as they make mass-market bikes too. I'm not sure if racing pedigree has anything to do with it; how prestigious is an Audi in the car world?

'Prestige' doesn't equal 'desirable' for me though, so my criterion differ from NapD and Tim Wand; my most desirable frame would probably be one that I'd made and painted myself.

siamon

But I covet a Carrera Fury?

Whilst I am convinced of their awesomeness, I'm not sure the Fury qualifies as a prestige bicycle.

Surely it is simply, exclusive, expensive and having a mystical aura.

Like Parlee, Crumpton et al and much as I hate to admit it, Colnago.

rolf_f

DesWeller wrote:

I suppose a prestige badge would have to involve some exclusivity, so Storck, Parlee etc. would be in there, whereas your Specializeds and Treks wouldn't (despite making some very high-end stuff) as they make mass-market bikes too.

I think this counts for a lot. Many manufacturers do sell at the lower end of the market which ultimately taints the image as a prestige manufacturer. So to me Time, Look, Colnago, Parlee etc will always have more cachet over companies like Bianchi and Pinarello that have relatively cheap entry level models.