911
Comments
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Of course it's disrespectful.0
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There's no of course about it. If he was cracking jokes or something yes but he's just got an opinion which you disagree with - honestly held - he may be wrong but in what way is disagreeing with you disrespectful to the dead ?
it's a hard life if you don't weaken.0 -
Tom Butcher wrote:There's no of course about it. If he was cracking jokes or something yes but he's just got an opinion which you disagree with - honestly held - he may be wrong but in what way is disagreeing with you disrespectful to the dead ?
I agree.
Also with all respect to Hoopdriver - there is still doubt as how the which plane carried your friends ceased to be. The families of the dead - that is the families who lost bread winners - brothers - sisters - fathers - mothers - are still seeking the truth. They are still in a limbo not knowing whether the plane crashed or was shot down by the USAF - if no answers are forth coming and doubts arise as to how a love one died, to seek clarification isnt disrespectful or a matter of conspiracy; it's a matter of truth.
But that is for another thread, clearly.The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.0 -
Tom Butcher wrote:There's no of course about it. If he was cracking jokes or something yes but he's just got an opinion which you disagree with - honestly held - he may be wrong but in what way is disagreeing with you disrespectful to the dead ?
No, he doesn't just have an opinion. He started of by saying how naive we were and how right he was. That's not just 'an opinion'. That's imposing it towards us as facts when it's quite simply nothing like it. Someone in here affected more than me and you found it disrespectful - that's should be a hint.0 -
Sorry, there's not much doubt about that plane or the people who were in it. The sort of silly idle speculation being engaged in by a few posters is, I suppose, the luxury of those to whom the entire thing appeared like a movie or war game on TV, and who have no human stake in it.Cleat Eastwood wrote:Tom Butcher wrote:There's no of course about it. If he was cracking jokes or something yes but he's just got an opinion which you disagree with - honestly held - he may be wrong but in what way is disagreeing with you disrespectful to the dead ?
I agree.
Also with all respect to Hoopdriver - there is still doubt as how the which plane carried your friends ceased to be. The families of the dead - that is the families who lost bread winners - brothers - sisters - fathers - mothers - are still seeking the truth. They are still in a limbo not knowing whether the plane crashed or was shot down by the USAF - if no answers are forth coming and doubts arise as to how a love one died, to seek clarification isnt disrespectful or a matter of conspiracy; it's a matter of truth.
But that is for another thread, clearly.
The only plane about which I think there could realistically be a debate is the one that went into the field in Pennsylvania. The theory that it may have been shot down as a sort of pre-emptive defense seems a plausible one.0 -
That day I was in the RAF and away on a course. One of the guys on my course was from the American Airforce. I remember we were all sat around and the American was taken to one side for a word. When he came back we were still sat around, happy and joking (not knowing what had happened). He looked serious and shocked and said "guys I've got to go". We never saw him since. Then all flying was cancelled. It wasn't until I got back to the accommodation and put the tv on I realised what happened. I was horrified at what happened and at the loss of life. RIP.
As for the conspiracy theorist. My 13 years working for the RAF has taught me the govt or military can't plan a p*ss up in a brewery with a fist full of fivers. Nothing goes to plan. So there's no way it could have been your conspiracy. I found in the RAF even big events only got done by improvisation and responding "off the cuff" as things happen."The Prince of Wales is now the King of France" - Calton Kirby0 -
ThomThom wrote:Of course it's disrespectful.
On the contrary. I just prefer that the real criminals are bought to task, not that they will be, but being blind to the truth is not the answer and certainly not healthy. Many of the victims families distrust the official story of events, are they being 'disrespectful'? For crying out loud do you really believe that one of the hijackers passports fell out of his pocket, through all the ignited jet fuel, bypassed the debris inside the building and landed on the pavement below with barely a singe mark?0 -
Oh, f*** off.0
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LoL i feel your frustration, stay rational, not worth the dialogueThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....0 -
So True.bianchimoon wrote:
LoL i feel your frustration, stay rational, not worth the dialogueThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.0 -
Conspiracists and their all seeing all knowing aura. Go back to your xbox sonny.0
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haha
so someone asks this
"For crying out loud do you really believe that one of the hijackers passports fell out of his pocket, through all the ignited jet fuel, bypassed the debris inside the building and landed on the pavement below with barely a singe mark?"
and the response is this
"Oh, f*** off."
You gotta love the closed mind.
The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.0 -
As opposed to the mind so brainless and empty the wind blows straight through it?Cleat Eastwood wrote:haha
so someone asks this
"For crying out loud do you really believe that one of the hijackers passports fell out of his pocket, through all the ignited jet fuel, bypassed the debris inside the building and landed on the pavement below with barely a singe mark?"
and the response is this
"Oh, f*** off."
You gotta love the closed mind.0 -
Indeed - the wind of change. Try it. The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.0 -
When the old brainbox is as empty as the consoiracy theorists and those of their eggers-on anything can be the wind of change...Cleat Eastwood wrote:Indeed - the wind of change. Try it.0 -
Hoopdriver wrote:
When the old brainbox is as empty as the consoiracy theorists and those of their eggers-on anything can be the wind of change...Cleat Eastwood wrote:Indeed - the wind of change. Try it.
Indeed - and not much in life can be as closed and unresponsive as the mind of some one on a normally well considered website saying things like
"What is there to see when you fly? The view from 37,000 feet is invariably the same – a variegated suite of greens and browns if you happen to be over land, or a shimmering blue surface if you are flying over water. You could be anywhere. The clouds generally look alike, more or less, the differences being only the weather of the day, nothing location-specific. And inside the plane, what do you have? A neutral beige interior – vanilla or French vanilla depending on whether you are flying Boeing or Airbus – and whatever low-budget tripe it is that happens to be playing on the TV screen on seatback in front of you. The road to and from Alaska looks just like the road to Rome, Rio, Zanzibar or Erie, Pennsylvania. The only difference is the amount of time you are obliged to sit in an uncomfortable seat. The boredom and sense of degradation are the same wherever you go."
I'm happy being open minded - its quite jolly. but vive la difference and all that - as the great AT once said "A book read by a thousand different people is a thousand different books." The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.0 -
I am delighted to see you read my blog and that you apparently like it. I am sorry to see you quote a paragraph of the post out of context. As you may recall the thrust of the essay in the several hundred words that follow the paragraph you quoted was to look around, see with new eyes; it was an admonition to myself as much as anything.Cleat Eastwood wrote:Hoopdriver wrote:
When the old brainbox is as empty as the consoiracy theorists and those of their eggers-on anything can be the wind of change...Cleat Eastwood wrote:Indeed - the wind of change. Try it.
Indeed - and not much in life can be as closed and unresponsive as the mind of some one on a normally well considered website saying things like
"What is there to see when you fly? The view from 37,000 feet is invariably the same – a variegated suite of greens and browns if you happen to be over land, or a shimmering blue surface if you are flying over water. You could be anywhere. The clouds generally look alike, more or less, the differences being only the weather of the day, nothing location-specific. And inside the plane, what do you have? A neutral beige interior – vanilla or French vanilla depending on whether you are flying Boeing or Airbus – and whatever low-budget tripe it is that happens to be playing on the TV screen on seatback in front of you. The road to and from Alaska looks just like the road to Rome, Rio, Zanzibar or Erie, Pennsylvania. The only difference is the amount of time you are obliged to sit in an uncomfortable seat. The boredom and sense of degradation are the same wherever you go."
I'm happy being open minded - its quite jolly. but vive la difference and all that - as the great AT once said "A book read by a thousand different people is a thousand different books."
There is a big difference between looking around and seeing the world with what the Zen masters call Beginner's eyes and an uncritical acceptance of every crackpot conspiracy theory that comes along. All ideas are not created equal. Discernment is required.0 -
doublem_1 wrote:ThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.
And that adds what exactly?
Not much. Sadly the same can be said about your posts. This was an interesting thread with interesting stories until your amusing youtube research turned it to the worse - including me as I even started to swear. I've had my last say in this thread with this friendly man.
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I agree. It was a well conceived and interesting post and, like you, I enjoyed reading the recollections of a day that changed the world. It is a pity it was hijacked by somebody who thinks the X Files were a documentary.ThomThom wrote:doublem_1 wrote:ThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.
And that adds what exactly?
Not much. Sadly the same can be said about your posts. This was an interesting thread with interesting stories until your amusing youtube research turned it to the worse - including me as I even started to swear. I've had my last say in this thread.0 -
ThomThom wrote:doublem_1 wrote:ThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.
And that adds what exactly?
Not much. Sadly the same can be said about your posts. This was an interesting thread with interesting stories until your amusing youtube research turned it to the worse - including me as I even started to swear. I've had my last say in this thread with this friendly man.
That's not "Wiggo" is it?Tail end Charlie
The above post may contain traces of sarcasm or/and bullsh*t.0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:doublem_1 wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Most conspiracy theories work on the basis on finding tiny tiny cracks in the story, usually uknowns rather than any evidence to the contrary, and blowing them out of proportion, ignoring the vast wealth of evidence pointing to what actually happened.
Not tiny cracks at all. Wide open gaps. Why did the FBI admit they there wasn't any evidence to point towards bin laden when asked why 9/11 wasn't mentioned on his most wanted profile? Was the 'evidance' ever explained? Because I sure don't remember hearing about it.
He was the head of the organisation that took credit (if you can call it that) for the attacks?
Pretty sure he said as much in those videotapes he used to send out.
It's not even like he hadn't got precedent for trying to blow up the world trade centres before 2001 either.
Like I said, tiny crack, blown out of proportion, flies in the face of the obvious.
Did I jog your memory?.... Your silence is a little conspicuous :P.0 -
simple questions asked but never answered - only those of a closed mind would not have even the smallest of doubts - as was mentioned above - and i just googled this to see if it was true -why no mention of the largest terrorist attack on US soil on bin ladens fbi wanted profile
"Usama Bin Laden is wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. These attacks killed over 200 people. In addition, Bin Laden is a suspect in other terrorist attacks throughout the world."
Oh look it is true - well waddya make of that then.The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.0 -
Hoopdriver wrote:
I agree. It was a well conceived and interesting post and, like you, I enjoyed reading the recollections of a day that changed the world. It is a pity it was hijacked by somebody who thinks the X Files were a documentary.ThomThom wrote:doublem_1 wrote:ThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.
And that adds what exactly?
Not much. Sadly the same can be said about your posts. This was an interesting thread with interesting stories until your amusing youtube research turned it to the worse - including me as I even started to swear. I've had my last say in this thread.
I've never watched x-files...
I call for this thread to be closed.0 -
Hijack it, then demand the thread be closed, eh?doublem_1 wrote:Hoopdriver wrote:
I agree. It was a well conceived and interesting post and, like you, I enjoyed reading the recollections of a day that changed the world. It is a pity it was hijacked by somebody who thinks the X Files were a documentary.ThomThom wrote:doublem_1 wrote:ThomThom wrote:Oh, f*** off.
And that adds what exactly?
Not much. Sadly the same can be said about your posts. This was an interesting thread with interesting stories until your amusing youtube research turned it to the worse - including me as I even started to swear. I've had my last say in this thread.
I've never watched x-files...
I call for this thread to be closed.0 -
Cleat Eastwood wrote:simple questions asked but never answered - only those of a closed mind would not have even the smallest of doubts - as was mentioned above - and i just googled this to see if it was true -why no mention of the largest terrorist attack on US soil on bin ladens fbi wanted profile
"Usama Bin Laden is wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. These attacks killed over 200 people. In addition, Bin Laden is a suspect in other terrorist attacks throughout the world."
Oh look it is true - well waddya make of that then.
I'm not sure it's closed minded to read what someone says, consider it and then dismiss it as rubbish. There must be at least an element of credibility to someone's alternative theory before you could be said to be closed minded by dismissing it out of hand. And, frankly, the idea that the death of 3000 of their own people was deliberately orchestrated by the US Government with so far only some minor inconsistencies to contradict the official version of events DOES seem like rubbish. I don't feel duty bound to "research" that in much depth to reach that conclusion, mainly because the basic premise is so lacking in credbility to start with.
By way of a contrast, both the Spanish and Italian secret services carried out terrorist attacks on their own people in the 1970s/80s as a way of provoking sufficient public outrage to justify harsher measures in their fight against Basque/Left wing terror groups (ETA and Brigade Rosso). Same premise, same motivation and both efforts were eventually uncovered with ensuing public scandals etc.
I very very strongly doubt that trying to do something on the size and scale of 9/11 could be orchestrated and then successfully covered up by any government in the world regardless of the level of resources/Illuminati involvement/Elvis's blessing/whatever available to them. I just dont. As a result, people who DO think that come across (to me) as embarassingly credulous and lacking in judgement. Because their theories are SUCH OBVIOUS NONSENSE. Not because I'm being closed minded and I'm pretty sure the same applies to the guy you're quoting.0 -
[quote="doublem_1
I've never watched x-files...
I call for this thread to be closed.[/quote]
What a cheek. Post a load of drivel on someone else's thread and call for it to be locked when people disagree with you.0 -
nice post rodgers73, 24 hr bike rides are good for the mind!--0
