A big downside to being clipped in

StillGoing

To be fair I think there was only one poster who insulted the OP.

AdrianStuart

Anyone see Podolski's 1st goal for Arsenal yesterday?

Pross

jimmies wrote:

I really think that you guys have not got what I mean....etc. etc. I would rather have to deal with an driver who was angry because I tapped his car with my foot, than deal with broken bones or worse because I didn't. If you cannot understand that then fine.

So do you really think that some motorists will think nothing of deliberately running you off the road and causing injury? You might be hard and able to handle a confrontation with the driver if he stops and gets out but are you that hard that you can handle a confrontation with his 1.5 tonne steel box when the red mist comes down and he drives at you? OK, it's annoying and frightening when you have a close shave but if you survive it without being hit why do something that might encourage a second bite of the cherry? What exactly would it have achieved as I'm pretty sure it won't make a jot of difference to the driver's future behaviour. (Spent 20 years playing rugby in case that in any way gives my opinion more credence as it apparently makes me more of a man )

Mikey23

My goodness, what a depressing thread... Seems like some of the cyclists on here have a similar attitude in life to the motorists they are happy to berate. Accidents happen, incidents happen, mistakes happen. Poor behaviour happens. Retaliation in any form is not justified under any circumstances. If you go down that road you have lost your argument and deserve the consequences

monkeydan

jimmies wrote:

I joined this forum to learn and mostly it has been excellent....and I certainly do suggest that some of you take up rugby (I played for 20 years until a knee reconstruction stopped it 5 years ago).....not only will you see how much of a man you really are but you will also learn how to be more respectfull when dealing with others

Cheers for the laugh, you really brightened up my day!

junglist_matty

What you need is a bell

Pickled Pig

jimmies wrote:

I'm happy to leave this now...

At last!

jimmies

philthy3 wrote:

Just about every road cyclist has had more than their fair share of encounters with other road users, you certainly aren't unique in that respect. From my motorcycling days I know of riders who have claimed to have kicked the door skin in or kicked the mirror off of a car that has caused them to take avoiding action. Such riders are plebs and the same guys who would be crapping their pants on the track. The use of unnecessary physical contact with another vehicle is an offence of criminal damage, (wanton or reckless) and you will struggle to justify it when you have more appropriate and legal means to alert the other road user.

Just as in motorcycling, there people who are cyclists and people who use a bike but who you'd struggle to categorise as a cyclist. Don't confuse cyclists with urban scrotes on bikes who have no respect for the law or display any courtesy to anyone else.

As for rugby, try walking in to the middle of a pub fight when you're grossly outnumbered.

I agree completely with everything you say here.....I've never kicked a door in - or even damaged one!

jimmies

Pross wrote:

jimmies wrote:

I really think that you guys have not got what I mean....etc. etc. I would rather have to deal with an driver who was angry because I tapped his car with my foot, than deal with broken bones or worse because I didn't. If you cannot understand that then fine.

So do you really think that some motorists will think nothing of deliberately running you off the road and causing injury? You might be hard and able to handle a confrontation with the driver if he stops and gets out but are you that hard that you can handle a confrontation with his 1.5 tonne steel box when the red mist comes down and he drives at you? OK, it's annoying and frightening when you have a close shave but if you survive it without being hit why do something that might encourage a second bite of the cherry? What exactly would it have achieved as I'm pretty sure it won't make a jot of difference to the driver's future behaviour. (Spent 20 years playing rugby in case that in any way gives my opinion more credence as it apparently makes me more of a man )

My point is not about tapping the door to 'get them back'....it was about trying to let them know that I'm there and they are about to hit me. I also never said they did it deliberately. They didn't even see me

Adamgt

Wow, it's one extreme or the other with you lot isn't it.

I can see both sides but I think some people have taken the OP's comments a little too far. I ride a motorbike myself and have cycled on the road a lot in my life too. I don't ride my motorbike too much in traffic but I at least realise that if I'm about to be taken out by another vehicle, I' rather given them a tap and live than just let them run me over, so don't be so precious.

There's been times when I've been a pedestrian and had people reversing and nearly knocking me over in a car park and I have tapped the boot of their car, does that give a bad name to pedestrians? I think some of you need to think about what the OP was trying to say rather than try to protect 'the name' of cyclists. You are vulnerable on the road, you could be killed. I think motorcyclists are more aware of this than cyclists because the consequences are usually more severe due to the speeds and weight of the bike.

And no, I have never kicked a car, whether on my bicycle or motorbike, but I'd have no problem doing so if it meant I was going to live. The rest of the time I would try to get their attention by other means.

jimmies

Adam I don't think you did yourself any favours....but Thankyou. That is exactly what I'm saying. I haven't felt at risk from dying....other than when on the motorway and a truck came into the fast lane and I was looking at going into a barrier - but even broken bones (which would have been the result of my cycling incident the other day) would be bad enough

drlodge

Keep your feet and hands where they should be so you can take evasive action (bars and pedals) and use your voice to warn the driver of your presence. Anything else is stupid and asking for trouble IMHO.

Adamgt

No worries jimmies. I just think people are missing the point. The comment about kicking a car is related to a point in time where it is a necessity and also a natural reaction. It seems to have been misinterpreted as people just going around kicking cars. If others think it's best to get run over and 'suck it up' rather than evading the situation, just so all the other cyclists on the road keep their reputation intact, then that's fine. I'll stay out of the hospital though.

Pross

Adamgt wrote:

Wow, it's one extreme or the other with you lot isn't it.

I can see both sides but I think some people have taken the OP's comments a little too far. I ride a motorbike myself and have cycled on the road a lot in my life too. I don't ride my motorbike too much in traffic but I at least realise that if I'm about to be taken out by another vehicle, I' rather given them a tap and live than just let them run me over, so don't be so precious.
There's been times when I've been a pedestrian and had people reversing and nearly knocking me over in a car park and I have tapped the boot of their car, does that give a bad name to pedestrians? I think some of you need to think about what the OP was trying to say rather than try to protect 'the name' of cyclists. You are vulnerable on the road, you could be killed. I think motorcyclists are more aware of this than cyclists because the consequences are usually more severe due to the speeds and weight of the bike.

And no, I have never kicked a car, whether on my bicycle or motorbike, but I'd have no problem doing so if it meant I was going to live. The rest of the time I would try to get their attention by other means.

But despite being unable to unclip his foot to kick at the car he didn't get run over did he? So what purpose would the kick have served? I can understand wanting to make the driver aware but you never know if they are a psycho who would ram you for touching their car so why take the risk? I've seen car drivers make deliberate swerves at cyclists just for being there so I dread to think what they would do if you actually made deliberate contact (no matter how soft) with their vehicle. Have a look at the footage of the Bristol bus driver who ran a cyclist over for holding on to his bus at a set of lights if you think this is being far-fetched.

Pross

jimmies wrote:

Pross wrote:

jimmies wrote:

I really think that you guys have not got what I mean....etc. etc. I would rather have to deal with an driver who was angry because I tapped his car with my foot, than deal with broken bones or worse because I didn't. If you cannot understand that then fine.

So do you really think that some motorists will think nothing of deliberately running you off the road and causing injury? You might be hard and able to handle a confrontation with the driver if he stops and gets out but are you that hard that you can handle a confrontation with his 1.5 tonne steel box when the red mist comes down and he drives at you? OK, it's annoying and frightening when you have a close shave but if you survive it without being hit why do something that might encourage a second bite of the cherry? What exactly would it have achieved as I'm pretty sure it won't make a jot of difference to the driver's future behaviour. (Spent 20 years playing rugby in case that in any way gives my opinion more credence as it apparently makes me more of a man )

My point is not about tapping the door to 'get them back'....it was about trying to let them know that I'm there and they are about to hit me. I also never said they did it deliberately. They didn't even see me

I realise exactly what you were saying but I'm pointing out that some people act irrationally when in the comfort of their car and if you touch it, even just to give a gentle "I'm here and you didn't see me" message they might go into full road rage mode and deliberately ram you. I'm sure I've read of motorcyclists having that done in similar circumstances. Unfortunately you will come to realise that you will be encountering idiots like that on the road every day but they don't like people pointing out their mistakes and act as if it is all your fault.

Adamgt

Pross wrote:

But despite being unable to unclip his foot to kick at the car he didn't get run over did he? So what purpose would the kick have served?

You're missing the point again Pross. He didn't kick and he doesn't go around kicking cars every time one comes near him.

Pross wrote:

I can understand wanting to make the driver aware but you never know if they are a psycho who would ram you for touching their car so why take the risk?

Again, I'd rather not be lying on the ground injured firstly. If he's a psycho then its a risk I'll take as long as I'm still walking. Why would I be thinking 'what if this guys is angry if I touch his car?' if I'm about to be knocked off my bike?

StillGoing

Then use the bloody horn! A pedestrian has a voice usually to shout a warning. A motorcyclist and a cyclist has ample time to see events unfolding in front of them to be able to take avoiding action or use their voice or horn to warn the other driver. There is absolutely no excuse to be "tapping" doors with your foot. You've got brakes to stop and a voice to shout for anything in front of you and if it's from behind you won't know about it until it's happened. And read the thread, I was a motorcyclist for decades and I'd like to see you try kicking another rider when they scrape fairings with you going round a turn during a race. Crashing going down Craner Curves at 130mph plus has the potential to kill you anytime, but kicking a fellow competitor because he's too close would be stupid for both.

Pross

Adamgt wrote:

Pross wrote:

But despite being unable to unclip his foot to kick at the car he didn't get run over did he? So what purpose would the kick have served?

You're missing the point again Pross. He didn't kick and he doesn't go around kicking cars every time one comes near him.

Pross wrote:

I can understand wanting to make the driver aware but you never know if they are a psycho who would ram you for touching their car so why take the risk?

Again, I'd rather not be lying on the ground injured firstly. If he's a psycho then its a risk I'll take as long as I'm still walking. Why would I be thinking 'what if this guys is angry if I touch his car?' if I'm about to be knocked off my bike?

Oh well do it your way. In 23 years of cycling I've never felt the need to use my foot in warning, when cars get to close I'm normally to busy trying to stay upright to risk moving a leg. Despite this I've only ever been knocked off once by a car and in that instance it was someone turning right across my path so not much could be done. Maybe I'm just lucky!

I still don't see how I've missed the point though, the OP wanted to 'kick' at the car but couldn't do it in time due to being clipped in (by his own admission).

Adamgt

I've never had the need to kick out a foot either, but I could see his point.

top_bhoy

philthy3 wrote:

Then use the bloody horn! A pedestrian has a voice usually to shout a warning. A motorcyclist and a cyclist has ample time to see events unfolding in front of them to be able to take avoiding action or use their voice or horn to warn the other driver. There is absolutely no excuse to be "tapping" doors with your foot. You've got brakes to stop and a voice to shout for anything in front of you and if it's from behind you won't know about it until it's happened. And read the thread, I was a motorcyclist for decades and I'd like to see you try kicking another rider when they scrape fairings with you going round a turn during a race. Crashing going down Craner Curves at 130mph plus has the potential to kill you anytime, but kicking a fellow competitor because he's too close would be stupid for both.

I admit to finding the horn pretty useless. Given most situations, it only serves to attract the drivers attention after the near miss/hit has occurred. Which sort of goes back to my original point, kicking car doors takes a concious effort and time which does not help your immediate personal safety to stay upright. That is the priority at all times which shouldn't be distracted though by all means have a short outburst afterwards.

AdrianStuart

Why kick when you can punch? :shock:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXaHBc_AGE4&feature=youtube_gdata_player

apreading

I cant imagine a situation where I would be worried about being hit and not want all my limbs on the bike to have maximum control when taking avoiding action. Taking a foot off to swing it at a car will diminish your control at a crucial time and startling the driver might actually have the opposite effect as its anybody's guess whether he will take his foot off the gas, brake or twitch the steering in either direction. Personally I think my instincts would be to do what I can to avoid accident rather than panic a driver in the hope that they will.