Cavendish should go!
Comments
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TheBigBean wrote:Is there any talk of another British team?
mutterings a couple of weeks ago, nothing more, but if anything were to happen it would be far down the road0 -
phreak wrote:
If other teams take the responsibility to bring breaks back though, what's to stop him jumping on the back of a train and nipping them on the line?
If he did that, why would other teams take responsibility? So they can come 2nd?Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
But people were saying he lost sprints this year due to a lack of a train, so teams did appear to be bringing it back into a sprint, but he missed out to Greipel a few times anyway.0
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A number of things hindered Cav at the Tour this year; the lack of a sprint lead-out train was just one factor (and not a particularly huge one).
FWIW, my view is that HTC were better than Sky at keeping Cav out of trouble over the last 20km (he's hit the deck a LOT during the 2012 season), were better at leading him out (when Sky do it, they don't look particularly well-drilled or comfortable), but one of the biggest factors where HTC were instrumental in getting sprint wins was their willingness to chase down breaks. There were several stages in this year's Tour which were expected to be bunch sprints but were taken instead by someone from a breakaway - exactly as happened in the Olympics.
The Olympic road race was likely to finish like that, as one five-man team (four, once you discount the protected sprinter) cannot chase down a breakaway of greater numbers). But in the Tour, we saw again and again that Sky weren't even going to try - so long as nobody in the break was threatening in the GC stakes, Sky would sit back, and if others wanted to chase they could. Though often they thought "why both, if Cav's going to wheel-suck our train and take the stage win anyway?" Again and again over the last 3 years HTC were prepared to pull huge stints at the front chasing breaks, knowing that nobody else would, that they had the fastest finisher, and that there was little other chance of TdF glory for a team with no real GC contender.
As for Cav taking the fight to Sagan for green, it's absolutely clear to me that he can't hope to do so with Sky; but an HTC-era Cav, with the team's full support, would make for a much closer competition. Much like the tussles with Huschovd, Cav is slightly quicker in most bunch sprints, but will concede points when his rival joins a break or when the sprints are hard and uphill. Cav vs Sagan is a battle I'd dearly like to see in 2013; whether I get my wish will depend largely on which team both will be with.They use their cars as shopping baskets; they use their cars as overcoats.0 -
Boonen to lead-out Cav :shock:0
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Rick Chasey wrote:
Boonen would be a good lead out man though......0 -
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I've said it before, but all this really does beg the question as to why he signed for Sky in the first place.
Yes Rick, the buns, but he must have known it wasn't a great career move. I know it's an Olympic year, but surely he would have been leader of Team GB whether he was riding for Sky or not?"I have a lovely photo of a Camargue horse but will not post it now" (Frenchfighter - July 2013)0 -
More in depth comments from Wiggins here: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-cavendish-should-probably-leave-sky
Cav to OPQS then.0 -
Definately cav to quick step, I would have said the same even before wiggos comments. Half the ex htc are there and Brian holm. I think on the question why he signed I think brailsford wanted a back up stage winner to keep sponsor happy and the gc contenders came through earlier than he
Thought. Cav is now surplus and this only demonstrates to me how harshly businesslike brailsford is, pretty sure cav was promised support he never got. He did his part though this year but next lets hope he gets a team that gives him more of the support he deserves. I expect quite a few will be out at team sky this year.0 -
inkyfingers wrote:I've said it before, but all this really does beg the question as to why he signed for Sky in the first place.
Yes Rick, the buns, but he must have known it wasn't a great career move. I know it's an Olympic year, but surely he would have been leader of Team GB whether he was riding for Sky or not?
He might have backed himself a little too much, that he could do when he did in 2008 in the Tour.0 -
thamacdaddy wrote:definitely cav to quick step, I would have said the same even before wiggos comments. Half the ex htc are there and Brian holm. I think on the question why he signed I think brailsford wanted a back up stage winner to keep sponsor happy and the gc contenders came through earlier than he
Thought. Cav is now surplus and this only demonstrates to me how harshly businesslike brailsford is, pretty sure cav was promised support he never got. He did his part though this year but next lets hope he gets a team that gives him more of the support he deserves. I expect quite a few will be out at team sky this year.
I think there were a number of factors to him joining Sky, and let's face is, at the teime it was in the interests of both Cav and Sky. The money - he got a massive pay rise to 2.5m, which now any new team that takes him has got to match. Sky the sponsor wanted him as marquee rider, and were willing to pay whatever it took. And I think Cav and his new management company saw Sky as a huge factor in further boosting Cav's image amongst the mainstream public, with Sky being an increasingly successful British team. Brailsford - yes, sure there was an element of Cav bringing in the wins, whatever, and thereby something of a security blanket. But I do think that the Olympics had a lot to do with it. GB would have had him as leader, sure, but the thing about this year was that Cav's training and race programme had to be far more specific and tailored than for last year's Worlds. He had to drop the weight, up the ante on the climbing, and even go for a GC target. Would any other team have allowed that? I doubt it.0 -
I would have thought armchair Wiggo is more of the problem. At next year's tour Froome and Cavendish is a much more compatible combination.0
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Except that next year's target for Sky isn't Yellow and Green, it's Pink then Yellow then Red. GC wins in all three Tours is a big task, and I cannot see how they could also contemplate serving a sprinter as part of the same programme. Cav to OPQS makes much more sense than Sky somehow aiming for a Tour double jersey.They use their cars as shopping baskets; they use their cars as overcoats.0
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Richmond Racer wrote:thamacdaddy wrote:definitely cav to quick step, I would have said the same even before wiggos comments. Half the ex htc are there and Brian holm. I think on the question why he signed I think brailsford wanted a back up stage winner to keep sponsor happy and the gc contenders came through earlier than he
Thought. Cav is now surplus and this only demonstrates to me how harshly businesslike brailsford is, pretty sure cav was promised support he never got. He did his part though this year but next lets hope he gets a team that gives him more of the support he deserves. I expect quite a few will be out at team sky this year.
I think there were a number of factors to him joining Sky, and let's face is, at the teime it was in the interests of both Cav and Sky. The money - he got a massive pay rise to 2.5m, which now any new team that takes him has got to match. Sky the sponsor wanted him as marquee rider, and were willing to pay whatever it took. And I think Cav and his new management company saw Sky as a huge factor in further boosting Cav's image amongst the mainstream public, with Sky being an increasingly successful British team. Brailsford - yes, sure there was an element of Cav bringing in the wins, whatever, and thereby something of a security blanket. But I do think that the Olympics had a lot to do with it. GB would have had him as leader, sure, but the thing about this year was that Cav's training and race programme had to be far more specific and tailored than for last year's Worlds. He had to drop the weight, up the ante on the climbing, and even go for a GC target. Would any other team have allowed that? I doubt it.
This makes a whole lot of sense - lots of reasons why both Cav and Sky would go for it this year, knowing it probably wouldnt work out in the long run. Also, won't Sky get some of their money back for Cav if another team has to buy out his contract? Taking that into account - everyone wins (well, sort of, except in the Olympic Road Race).0 -
TheBigBean wrote:I would have thought armchair Wiggo is more of the problem. At next year's tour Froome and Cavendish is a much more compatible combination.
Interesting Point! If Schleck and Contador are both back and firing then Froome could be made to look pretty ordinary next year. A few guaranteed stage wins could be useful!We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
Seen chat on twitter saying that Wiggins might go for the Giro next year and fride for Froome at the Tour, anybody got a link to a story about this?"I have a lovely photo of a Camargue horse but will not post it now" (Frenchfighter - July 2013)0
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inkyfingers wrote:Seen chat on twitter saying that Wiggins might go for the Giro next year and fride for Froome at the Tour, anybody got a link to a story about this?
Interesting. That would be a far better target for someone like Wiggins to go for next. He's not going to win the Tour 5 times, so how about winning the Tour, Giro and Vuelta. How many riders have done that?0 -
inkyfingers wrote:Seen chat on twitter saying that Wiggins might go for the Giro next year and fride for Froome at the Tour, anybody got a link to a story about this?
Sounds a bit premature when the route for either race has still to be announced. It might make sense if Froome were to win the Vuelta, then Sky putting their TdF eggs in the Froome basket wouldn't be such a high risk strategy. Otherwise Wiggo to the Giro sounds a little like a vanity project on his part.'This week I 'ave been mostly been climbing like Basso - Shirley Basso.'0 -
greasedscotsman wrote:inkyfingers wrote:Seen chat on twitter saying that Wiggins might go for the Giro next year and fride for Froome at the Tour, anybody got a link to a story about this?
Interesting. That would be a far better target for someone like Wiggins to go for next. He's not going to win the Tour 5 times, so how about winning the Tour, Giro and Vuelta. How many riders have done that?
So sky agree Froome's a better 3 weeker?0 -
LangerDan wrote:inkyfingers wrote:Seen chat on twitter saying that Wiggins might go for the Giro next year and fride for Froome at the Tour, anybody got a link to a story about this?
Sounds a bit premature when the route for either race has still to be announced. It might make sense if Froome were to win the Vuelta, then Sky putting their TdF eggs in the Froome basket wouldn't be such a high risk strategy. Otherwise Wiggo to the Giro sounds a little like a vanity project on his part.
It's Twitter speculation arising from purely from the presser Wiggo gave yday after his Ride With Brad sportive. He described the Giro as 'beautiful and historical', or some such, which was enough to send Twitter into the usual frenzy that this means he's going to lead it instead of the Tour. There is no way that anything's decided about next year.0 -
Richmond Racer wrote:It's Twitter speculation arising from purely from the presser Wiggo gave yday after his Ride With Brad sportive. He described the Giro as 'beautiful and historical', or some such, which was enough to send Twitter into the usual frenzy that this means he's going to lead it instead of the Tour. There is no way that anything's decided about next year.
I bet the decision is already there - Brailsford has a 5 year plan that gets renewed every year and I bet Brad has input to it, as does Froome. Brad also hinted that balancing the demands of the tour with a family is tough so that fits as well
Brad wearing Pink, Froome Yellow and Porte Red ??"I get paid to make other people suffer on my wheel, how good is that"
--Jens Voight0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:So sky agree Froome's a better 3 weeker?
Froome is 5 years younger than Wiggins, has more years in him so I would say yes!
And Wiggins still talks about the Tour as a project. I think he's more interested in doing something different than just turning up at the Tour each year and seeing if he wins or not. Give him a project of winning all three GTs.0 -
Wouldn't it be funny if Sky won no GTs next year. I wouldn't be upset.
Go Cav. A sprinter of that calibre, even a sit-in one, needs a team dedicated to him.Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Wouldn't it be funny if Sky won no GTs next year. I wouldn't be upset.
Go Cav. A sprinter of that calibre, even a sit-in one, needs a team dedicated to him.
To be honest I think thats the more likely scenario. I can't see Sky winning any, let alone all 3. The Tour will be a whole different ball game next year if the rumoured course lives up to the hype and with a fully fit A. Schleck and Contador, Froome et al will be struggling to even get a look in.0 -
LeicesterLad wrote:frenchfighter wrote:Wouldn't it be funny if Sky won no GTs next year. I wouldn't be upset.
Go Cav. A sprinter of that calibre, even a sit-in one, needs a team dedicated to him.
To be honest I think thats the more likely scenario. I can't see Sky winning any, let alone all 3. The Tour will be a whole different ball game next year if the rumoured course lives up to the hype and with a fully fit A. Schleck and Contador, Froome et al will be struggling to even get a look in.
So between Little Schleck and Contador, they're going to clean up all 3 Tours next year? I see.
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Richmond Racer wrote:LeicesterLad wrote:frenchfighter wrote:Wouldn't it be funny if Sky won no GTs next year. I wouldn't be upset.
Go Cav. A sprinter of that calibre, even a sit-in one, needs a team dedicated to him.
To be honest I think thats the more likely scenario. I can't see Sky winning any, let alone all 3. The Tour will be a whole different ball game next year if the rumoured course lives up to the hype and with a fully fit A. Schleck and Contador, Froome et al will be struggling to even get a look in.
So between Little Schleck and Contador, they're going to clean up all 3 Tours next year? I see.
No, I was refering to the Tour. If Wiggins and Froome can't beat the likes of Cobo on the steap climbs of the Vuelta (and no amount of if's and but's will change Froome's second place) then I don't see them bettering that result. Especially not this year, Froome will get a spanking and that will be that. As for Wiggins as the Giro, it's possible he could win, possible - but I just can't see it, Leaky did what Sky did in the tour in this years Giro and were still pipped to the post by better climbers.0 -
The Cyclist of Catan wrote:Except that next year's target for Sky isn't Yellow and Green, it's Pink then Yellow then Red. GC wins in all three Tours is a big task, and I cannot see how they could also contemplate serving a sprinter as part of the same programme. Cav to OPQS makes much more sense than Sky somehow aiming for a Tour double jersey.
Which begs the question whether their squad next year will focus primarily on GC riders and forgo the classics a bit.0
