The official TrainerRoad thread

tim_wand

dw300 How does your 8 min test FTP compare to the one you got from the 20 min test.

I am going to re test tonight after refining my set up and finding another Power curve for my trainer (after recent upsets)

I m 43 next month, Ride club runs and occasional 10's and Sprint Tri's.

I think what you said about the 8 minute test not being anything like what the normal leisure/ recreational or training for fitness rider would ever replicate on the road, is very true. That's why I am wondering whether to try the 20 min test instead ( More like a 10 TT / I wish ). The only time I would do anything like the 8 is on a Hill Climb but then its repeated twice

Besides using this for Winter fitness, I am hoping at some Point I might be able to use it to pace a good 10TT using the figures I get for Cadence and HR on my Garmin. ( Obviously on a flat course in good weather)

napoleond

Have fun Tim. I freaking HATE testing heh heh.

Tonight I did my custom sweet spot session, in the 4th interval I was thinking about a race I was in where I came in top 10, replaying a bit in my mind and thinking where I should have attacked, I got a big shot of adrenaline and my HR skyrocketed! You can see it quite clearly on the graph.

http://www.trainingpeaks.com/av/NGOQC3L ... 6DAIUCPBPM

gaz047

TimWand-DW300 im with you on this, have previously teached physics and in my mind a fluid becomes less viscous (resistant at higher temperature).

Hi Tim, not been online for a bit moving house and still got no internet. fully with you and DW300 with fluids. Whatever the cause I always find the resistance increases 5-10 mins into session. If anyone can shed any light on what does cause this, would be interested to find out.
I read your now on a different profile, would like to know which one and where it is, as I'm on the one I suggested.
Hope test goes well and apologies if the one I said was incorrect..

DaveL

Did ISLAGIATT today and loved it, I felt after the first climb(strange being in the garage) that I wasn't going to complete it, but towards the end felt really good and thought I should of gone harder, but by god my legs are really feeling it now :-) I think I'm going to up the resistance on my rollers
http://app.strava.com/activities/95361711

tim_wand

Gaz . I m actually on the Profile you suggested, just with work and one thing and another I ve not got round to running a test with it yet!!! Just plugging it into devices and spinning up in trainers and jeans to check device were reading gave me at least another 100 Watts over the old profile.

Not tested tonight, Mrs W came back from work in a rage over some issue, so I ve had to do the whole sympathetic hear stuff, she don't respond well to MTFU.

Club run tomorrow morning but I wont be pulling up any stumps so, tomorrow night it is.

dw300

tim wand wrote:

dw300 How does your 8 min test FTP compare to the one you got from the 20 min test.

I am going to re test tonight after refining my set up and finding another Power curve for my trainer (after recent upsets)

I m 43 next month, Ride club runs and occasional 10's and Sprint Tri's.

I think what you said about the 8 minute test not being anything like what the normal leisure/ recreational or training for fitness rider would ever replicate on the road, is very true. That's why I am wondering whether to try the 20 min test instead ( More like a 10 TT / I wish ). The only time I would do anything like the 8 is on a Hill Climb but then its repeated twice

Besides using this for Winter fitness, I am hoping at some Point I might be able to use it to pace a good 10TT using the figures I get for Cadence and HR on my Garmin. ( Obviously on a flat course in good weather)

Well .. how'd it go?

Here are my 2 tests, both at 155lbs / 11st 1lb ..

http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/458789-8-Minute-Test - Improved FTP by 7% (243 > 260). First FTP test with a fan.

7 weeks later ..

http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/399080 - Improved FTP by 7.3%. Plenty of intervals between this test and the last, turning a bigger gear for longer than I used to be able to as a result.

I feel I have big legs for my bodyweight, and it's only a matter of learning how to use them, ie. using the strength for longer intervals. I've been thinking more about the Weight Training threads and people saying that everyone has the strength to pedal fast, it's only a matter of gaining the endurance.

So I've actually been bringing my cadence down during intervals to get used to producing more torque (down from 95-105 to 85-95). I kinda feel like all the talk of cadence and high RPM is making people train wrong. Yeh, it might make your legs last longer in competition. But to go faster you need to be pushing bigger gears in training.

tim_wand

Not tested yet dw300.

No excuses just poor time management. will hit it tomorrow.

I feel Cadence is my weak point. I never spin at more than 90 rpm and find it difficult to achieve 25mph + on turbo or road if I m not in at least something like 53 x 16 or higher.

All my club mates comment that I push too big a gear , even when climbing. But I m any where between 85 to 90kg (more often the later) , I don't tend to change pace, (hence why I could never race). But I can hold my own and tend to ride stronger than most after 2 hours plus.

I Suppose its just horses for courses but I personally find turning a big gear easier to maintain speed than increasing R.P.M . I m hoping to use TR to help me develop a better pedalling style and increase cadence.

Think I am going to ask the Mrs for a combined Birthday and Xmas present for a bike fit with Adrian Timmis.

napoleond

That would be a cracking gift!

I was a masher, I have been using tr to increase my cadence just so I am more 'flexible' in terms of riding style if nothing else. Especially as I will be racing in the track next year.

cerv50

Personally I very rarely use the big chainring, only when descending and on flat fast roads. The rest of the time I spend it spinning at around 100rpm in the small ring. I feel that soon after Christmas when leg strength has improved then I might start training to gain some extra torque

napoleond

In my sweet spot session last night I do alternate intervals of high or low cadence.

nathancom

NapoleonD wrote:

In my sweet spot session last night I do alternate intervals of high or low cadence.

What is the highest cadence you should look to work in? Anything above 110 and I find it much harder to control my form.

napoleond

Difficult to say! I'd try and include fast spins in your warm up, spin as fast as you can without bouncing and try and increase the cadence at which you start to lose form gradually.
I tend to do my sweet spots at 95-100 which I hate, at 85-90 it's soooo much more comfortable for me.

dw300

nathancom wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

In my sweet spot session last night I do alternate intervals of high or low cadence.

What is the highest cadence you should look to work in? Anything above 110 and I find it much harder to control my form.

You probably shouldn't go that high unless you can't push a bigger gear. There's little need to go into the 110-120 range unless you're doing a flat out interval, and pushing another gear would just make your legs blow. If you're spinning that fast and you get out of control because there isn't enough resistance, then it's time to change gear. But when there's plenty of resistance it's much more controllable.

Think about spinning 34-25 at 120rpm. There's no resistance there, and you're putting out maybe 150W tops (total guess). But if you're spinning 120rpm in 50-14 and putting out 350W+ the tension in the drivetrain stops your legs from getting out of control.

napoleond

Yeah, if you check out my warm up I'm doing high 300s when I do my spins. This was the warm up my coach have me when I was coached. It works a treat!

stoobydale

Is TR compatible with Golden Cheetah? Just tried to load up some turbo sessions on the same bike that I did a road ride on but no TSS is coming up with the TR stuff. I am using Power2Max with Edge 500 and Garmin HR strap.

richa

Presume you mean for post ride analysis.

Should be no issues. (And no real need for a Garmin)

Where are you getting files from? Downloading .tcx from TR? Or downloading .fit file from Garmin 500? Both should work.

stoobydale

Thanks for the reply. Yes, I am downloading the .tcx file from TR. The session I did today included the TSS but the last 5 didn't for some reason. I have deleted them from GC and re downloaded them from TR but again no TSS.

bigpikle

upload them from the Garmin file and not the TR file - that will work fine. Al my TR workouts also go into GC but I always use the Garmin file (make sure the GPS is turned off on the Garmin before these workouts so you dont get silly elevation data etc).

stoobydale

I am not able to do that as I only use the Garmin head unit when I do an outside ride. I just use a laptop in the garage when I use TR with the Garmin dongle.

markp80

I see the 2014 Tour of Sufferlandria is up on the Sufferfest website, takes place in January.
I presume we'll all be doing that again on TrainerRoad!

MarkP

clivewalker

Hi, been looking through this thread the last day or so, I just thought I'd say hello to all the Trainer Road users on here. I signed up last week for Trainer Road, http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/477608 This is my 8 minute test which I completed with a bad cold. I've completed about 4 workouts since, really enjoying it. I'm 44 and hoping to knock 2 minutes off my TT time next year and surprise a few people.

I'm using an oldish Elite Mag trainer, I'm going to borrow a Power Tap off a mate later this week and check against that as I don't think the power data for this Turbo in Trainer Road is very accurate?

tim_wand

clivewalker wrote:

Hi, been looking through this thread the last day or so, I just thought I'd say hello to all the Trainer Road users on here. I signed up last week for Trainer Road, http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/477608 This is my 8 minute test which I completed with a bad cold. I've completed about 4 workouts since, really enjoying it. I'm 44 and hoping to knock 2 minutes off my TT time next year and surprise a few people.

I'm using an oldish Elite Mag trainer, I'm going to borrow a Power Tap off a mate later this week and check against that as I don't think the power data for this Turbo in Trainer Road is very accurate?

Welcome Clive. If you don't object I am going to follow your results as we are similar age and have similar aims (improve 10 tt time). I ve had issues finding the "best power curve" for my trainer (Cyclops jet fluid 2) got some very disappointing results with the Polar map so I m now using the Beta, is there a Beta for your trainer?

Be interesting to see what the variance is between the power tap and the test you' ve done.

I am going to retest this week (works just crazy at the moment) but initial thoughts are that the Beta curve will be at least 80 watts higher than the Polar above 20 mph.

I ve adopted the attitude now that Virtual Power is exactly that, and as long as it gives me consistent figures that I can work with, I m not really that concerned what they are. The key is to keep the set up consistent . i.e Tyre pressure and resistance on the Turbo.

napoleond

clivewalker wrote:

Hi, been looking throughout, welcome. this thread the last day or so, I just thought I'd say hello to all the Trainer Road users on here. I signed up last week for Trainer Road, http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/477608 This is my 8 minute test which I completed with a bad cold. I've completed about 4 workouts since, really enjoying it. I'm 44 and hoping to knock 2 minutes off my TT time next year and surprise a few people.

I'm using an oldish Elite Mag trainer, I'm going to borrow a Power Tap off a mate later this week and check against that as I don't think the power data for this Turbo in Trainer Road is very accurate?

Hi mate, welcome!

I'd do a retest when over your cold tbh.

clivewalker

tim wand wrote:

Welcome Clive. If you don't object I am going to follow your results as we are similar age and have similar aims (improve 10 tt time). I ve had issues finding the "best power curve" for my trainer (Cyclops jet fluid 2) got some very disappointing results with the Polar map so I m now using the Beta, is there a Beta for your trainer? Be interesting to see what the variance is between the power tap and the test you' ve done.

Hi Tim, yeah that's fine, hopefully I'll make some progress; I've never bothered with any structured training before. There is a Beta for my Turbo, but it will be interesting to find out how close they are to correct.

tim wand wrote:

I am going to retest this week (works just crazy at the moment) but initial thoughts are that the Beta curve will be at least 80 watts higher than the Polar above 20 mph.

I ve adopted the attitude now that Virtual Power is exactly that, and as long as it gives me consistent figures that I can work with, I m not really that concerned what they are. The key is to keep the set up consistent . i.e Tyre pressure and resistance on the Turbo.

I agree, but it would be nice to know it the virtual power figures are within a stones throw of reality. I read the 'Obree Way' and it was interesting to find that Graham Obree did all his aerobic improvement rides on a Turbo. He recommends one all out 20 / 30 min Turbo effort each week, it HAD to be a Mag trainer with the fan and flywheel removed (if fitted), he says that on any other type of trainer would not be consistent enough to measure very small aerobic fitness improvements, the resistance was set to maximum and the adjustment cable disabled or removed. He used a bike computer set to KMH so he could gauge small speed increases during the ride and would try and ride a bit further each ride in the time. I can see how this would work but its very mentally challenging.

I gave it a go, I couldn't push in the big ring at a ridable cadence at the highest resistance on my Turbo, without going anaerobic. That was the last time I used my Turbo which was at the end of 2012. Oh well, its dusted off now and I'll see how I get on with the Trainer Road workouts.

NapoleonD wrote:

Hi mate, welcome!

I'd do a retest when over your cold tbh.

Hello, how are you doing? I'm going to do another test next week when I've hopefully completely shook off this cold.

THampshire

This was a good excuse for me to set up the cadence sensor on my garmin - been sitting in a box for about 6 months now. First results are in and pretty pleased I'm around the 200 mark especially as I don't weigh anything

Have never sweated so much in my life - needed to open some windows in the kitchen (in a flat so the only place for it)

http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/ride ... inute-Test

Thursday starts the base training plan

DaveL

THampshire wrote:

This was a good excuse for me to set up the cadence sensor on my garmin - been sitting in a box for about 6 months now. First results are in and pretty pleased I'm around the 200 mark especially as I don't weigh anything

Have never sweated so much in my life - needed to open some windows in the kitchen (in a flat so the only place for it)

http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/ride ... inute-Test

Thursday starts the base training plan

It's no good putting a ride up if it's private

Dave

THampshire

Whoops, didn't even know you could set up your profile as private!

napoleond

I did seated starts in big gear today. Went beastmode in the last interval as a good choon came on. Nice to see 4 figure ave wattage for 10secs again.

dw300

NapoleonD wrote:

I did seated starts in big gear today. Went beastmode in the last interval as a good choon came on. Nice to see 4 figure ave wattage for 10secs again.

Link, or it didnt happen!

napoleond

Make that 12s

http://www.trainingpeaks.com/av/X7NI5KK ... GG4SGJDYQY


http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/ride ... ee-Ride-45

Hopefully be 1500w by next April.