cleaning your rim

iclestu

Its obviously me.

From day 1 the boardman's brakes sqeaked. I cleaned the rims as best as i could. I carefully 'toed in' the pads. I even bought new pads and STILL the sqeak. Eventually i gave up and accepted it. Ho hum, worse things in life.

Now, the Dawes is about 1 month or 400 miles old and id just started forgetting about how my brakes were always noisy and now its joined in. These pesky kids have obviously been arranging a little conspiracy behind my back in the bikeshed. Knew that boardman would be a bad influence. He's obviously jelous of the new arrival.

(Either that or my rim needs cleaned? Right?)

Just curious. How often do we clean our rims? What products do we use to ensure the rubber slips nicely without sqeaks? Anyone got a method that doesnt need much rubbing?

SimonAH

I use a soapy rag...... sorry, nothing more exotic than that.

iPete

I have this little brush that came with the full set..

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/muc-off-detailing-brush/

mattcroad

I thought this was going to be a great thread, but it turns out it's about cleaning

jejv

Maybe NL or SS would care to comment, but I wouldn't worry so long as the brakes are effective, the rims are clean, and the pads don't have grit in them. If you've got judder, that's different.

Soapy rag, yes.

I don't do toe-in, just put the pads in the right place, put the brakes on, and tighten the nuts, taking care that the pads don't move in the process (it helps to have three hands).

jejv

mattcroad wrote:

I thought this was going to be a great thread, but it turns out it's about cleaning

But how do you clean your rim ?

Is it squeakey ?

cyclingprop

jejv wrote:

mattcroad wrote:

I thought this was going to be a great thread, but it turns out it's about cleaning

But how do you clean your rim ?

Is it squeakey ?

Squeaky clean?

jejv

cyclingprop wrote:

Squeaky clean?

No.

Does his rim make a squeakey noise ?
Clean or not ?

Gizmo_

jejv wrote:

Soapy rag, yes.

I don't do toe-in, just put the pads in the right place, put the brakes on, and tighten the nuts, taking care that the pads don't move in the process (it helps to have three hands).

Soapy rag followed by a wipe of vinegar.

Pads toed in by putting a folded piece of paper behind the tail-end.

Kieran_Burns

I spray chain cleaner on mine.






Stings a bit, mind....

rubertoe

muc off works a treat...


...followed by the lube of your choice.

SimonAH

Well I have to say I'm disappointed. Ten posts in and not one smutty allusion to rimming your cleaner.

mattcroad

Gizmo_ wrote:

jejv wrote:

Soapy rag, yes.

I don't do toe-in, just put the pads in the right place, put the brakes on, and tighten the nuts, taking care that the pads don't move in the process (it helps to have three hands).

Soapy rag followed by a wipe of vinegar.

Pads toed in by putting a folded piece of paper behind the tail-end.

That sounds sore, I find moisturiser works better than vinegar, not so much on the bike though. Soapy cloth works well on all parts though.

..and i'd definetely not toe paper into the tail-end :shock:

jejv

mattcroad wrote:

..and i'd definetely not toe paper into the tail-end :shock:

You not tried that ?

TheEnglishman

I was so hoping this was advice on carefully wiping around your Chalfont's.

Anyway, have you tried different brakes? Differing compounds squeak less or more!

mattcroad

jejv wrote:

mattcroad wrote:

..and i'd definetely not toe paper into the tail-end :shock:

You not tried that ?

Nope, my nuts are nice and tight and my brakes don't squeak.

DonDaddyD

Wet wipe.

First.Aspect

No insult intended, but are you sure you aren't toeing the brakes out by mistake?

If not.... Scotchbrite should give you a clean rim. Sand the pads. Wear them in by braking gently for a while.

jejv

First Aspect wrote:

Sand the pads.

I think this is a very bad idea. Abrasive grains from the sandpaper are going to get stuck in the pads.

A clean file, if you must. Probably best to just pick out any grit/swarf with a sharp knife.

EKE_38BPM

To stop squeeky brakes, apply GT85 liberally to your pads and rim.

Please don't do this, you will probably die a horrible death under the wheels of a bus!

First.Aspect

If your eyesight is so bad you can't see grit or sand on your brake pads, you need to give up cycling entirely. And if you insist on using pads made of Parmesan, use a file or rasp instead.
Cycling outdoors is a VERY bad idea - your rims can get dirty and road dirt can get in your brake pads.

Have I made my point yet?

jejv

jejv wrote:

First Aspect wrote:

Sand the pads.

I think this is a very bad idea. Abrasive grains from the sandpaper are going to get stuck in the pads.

A clean file, if you must. Probably best to just pick out any grit/swarf with a sharp knife.

First Aspect wrote:

If your eyesight is so bad you can't see grit or sand on your brake pads, you need to give up cycling entirely. And if you insist on using pads made of Parmesan, use a file or rasp instead.
Cycling outdoors is a VERY bad idea - your rims can get dirty and road dirt can get in your brake pads.

Have I made my point yet?

No.

Abrasive embedding is what usually happens when you try to abrade one thing with another thing that does not have much lower hardness. Rim pads are a lot softer than glass or emery/corundum. Hence my comment.

If you've been looking at your pads before & after with a - say - 500X optical microscope, fair enough.

In that case I'd be grateful and interested to see any images that you may have recorded.

Aluminium rims are also a lot softer than abrasives stuck to a piece of paper, so maybe not a good idea to rub them down them either, for the same reasons.

Then we have the problem that rim pads are going to have microscopic bits of aluminium oxide in them. How do we get that out ?
I don't know.

I'd guess a nylon pan scourer might be a good place to start.

I'm not clear what the objective of sanding pads would be. Rim pads don't need a rough surface to be effective. If they've somehow (how?) worn out of flat, then a sharp wood plane might be a good way to re-cut a flat surface.

I suspect - but don't know - that we would be better off if manufacturers stopped machining rims, and shot peened them instead.

Edit: quote original posts.

First.Aspect

The shaving the pads idea is to reduce grip for a while, Sherlock, not increase it. Brake squeal is the pad juddering, not sliding. You must be getting confused with the carbon brakes on your Lamborghini, buddy.

The only picture evidence I'm going to show you is a close up of my arse, so you can kiss the screen.

jejv

First Aspect wrote:

The shaving the pads idea is to reduce grip for a while, Sherlock, not increase it. Brake squeal is the pad juddering, not sliding. You must be getting confused with the carbon brakes on your Lamborghini, buddy.

The only picture evidence I'm going to show you is a close up of my ars*, so you can kiss the screen.

Your suggestion was:

First Aspect wrote:

No insult intended, but are you sure you aren't toeing the brakes out by mistake?

If not.... Scotchbrite should give you a clean rim. Sand the pads. Wear them in by braking gently for a while.

What concerns me - with my limited understanding of what is happening - is that you are suggesting that folk introduce hard abrasive material to a meeting of materials where most folk would want to minimise wear, and that your advice, if taken, would increase wear of a safety-critical component.

Perhaps you would be so kind as to share with us your detailed rationale for "Sand the pads" ?

What abrasive do you use ? What is the grit size ?

First Aspect wrote:

Brake squeal is the pad juddering, not sliding.

The OP was talking about

iclestu wrote:

From day 1 the boardman's brakes sqeaked.

Which sounds to me like at least a few 100 Hz, while..

First Aspect wrote:

Brake squeal is the pad juddering, not sliding. You must be getting confused with the carbon brakes on your Lamborghini, buddy.

..juddering I think is what folk might call a sub-audible vibration, which may destabilise the bicycle.

Please, Mr First Aspect, enlighten us.

First.Aspect

I can't be bothered.

iclestu

really only one way to settle this debate rationally:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLCnnG5gQ74

First.Aspect

It's not a debate. I'm clearly a moron. Sound is always sub audible.

This thread should be on the workshop forum anyway. The solution is panniers. Or mudguards.

SimonAH

It's carry over theory from sanding the pads on motorcycle disc brakes if they become contaminated / glazed and therefore squeal. Doesn't apply to rim brake pads, but I can understand where the concept comes from.

First.Aspect

No it really isn't. Brake squeal is causes by vibrations of the pad on the rim. If the grip on the rim is uneven it induces squeal as the pad passes over. If the brakes have started to squeal the pads may wear so as to make it more likely. Road and canti brakes are very wobbly if you think about it, stuck out on the end of a bolt like that.

Cleaning the rim might do the trick. Toeing the brake in might do the trick. Both might not do the trick.

However toeing the brake in is unnecessary in general and is guaranteed to give uneven wear in the end. Another option is to clean the rim and roughen the pads slightly. The inherently also tends to bevel the edges and so reduce contact angles. In a short time the pad will again wear so as to conform to striations in the rim. In the short term, sudden "bite" of the brakes (which could start squealing) is less likely.

If you are a literalist and go at your pads with an industrial sander, this may not work. I'm also not suggesting it as a routine step of cleaning your bike.

My understanding of discs, at least on cars, and I can't imagine that motorcycles or bike for that matter are different in principle, is that squeal is more likely to be caused by scraping of trapped debris, residue or dust - the brakes work by friction between two non resilient surfaces after all, unlike road brakes.

First.Aspect

I just tough of an analogy - the ribs which build up across gravel roads driven on by trucks. That's somewhat like the interaction between a rim and a squealing fecker of a brake pad.

jejv

Thankyou for that. Really. I'll get back to you in a bit.
By having this kind of discussion, we can maybe learn a little bit. I might, anyway.

More importantly:

What is the best way to rim your cleaner ?

Without using abrasives, obv.