Etape - Medical Certificates

Duncanandthemachine

I've managed to score an entry in to the etape this year, so I've been training hard and getting excited...but i've just spoken to my GP about getting the medical certificate that I need for the event completed, apparently there is a standard charge of £150 for this, but the Dr I spoke to said he'd sort me out for £50...

All sounds a little suspicious really, has anyone any relevant experience that they can share?

Cheer,

Duncan

oxoneil

Ha ha, amazing. Read through my posts in the Etapes 2012 thread over in the Sportive/Audax section.

ddmrcp

Thats GP greed for you. Absolute f##king rip off for doing a very few things or possibly, nothing at all. There is no standard that is laid out, ie, what extent would you go to certify someone 'physically fit'. Similarly, theres no standard as to what amount they can fleece you......

Richard_D

:evil: Troll alert.
ddmrcp on what do you base any of your points.
GPs are not on the whole greedy otherwise they would go into private practise or become lawyers, politicians, Vets or Dentists.
A medical is not covered by the NHS hence the charge.
There is a standard charge as the Op stated. I do not know what it is but it is defined by their professional body. If you think that is a rip off try talking to a QC or a plumber for a couple of minutes.
The charge is not just for what they do but also for their professional opinion and other incidentals, insurance, consumables, letters, etc..
Your Car service or burglar alarm service costs more and often requires less expense in time and effort on the part of the supplier.

bartman100

Troll alert? Mine took about 5 mins of the Doctors time and was done for free - tbh, I'd have been fuming with a £150 charge which absolutely does smack of greed. Just by comparing to other professions who like to fleece joe public for providing very little, does not make it right.

t.m.h.n.e.t

Mine charged me £15 for an SSP form once. A lot when you consider that SSP is your only income for 4 months

Granted,it was my fault I was off work but still :shock:

ddmrcp

Troll or otherwise- there is very little regulation and agreement- you wont find a standard series of tests between any 5 GPs surgeries . Physical exam at the very least? ECG? Xray? heart (echo) scan? Blood tests several? Urine tests? Where do you draw the line?
Another scenario
You go to any hospital, ask any level of doctor to sign an insurance form as you or you significant other missed holiday from illness etc- it will be done entirely gratis.
Ask your GP to sign the very same document for free??? Tell me how you got on, Richard.

giropaul

This is the form you need, so there is some regulation and consistency. You'll either need someting like this OR a BC full racing licence (because every other country insists on a medical before issuing a licence and they think we do to), for any event in France - it's the law (as laid out in the document)

http://www.letapedutour.com/ET1/us/medi ... icate.html

Most doctors will charge, it isn't covered by NHS. The charge may vary according to their disposition towards you.

If your doctor wants £150 you can get one for £65 here

http://www.sportsmedicalcertificates.co.uk/en/

gasman_dave

£150 would be the charge to discourage you from asking. There is no set fee and it is usual that GPs see people for medicals at the end of a surgery (when they would rather be going home).

The point is well made about the hospital doctors - I have never charged for any insurance form in 9 years of ITU and Anaesthetics.

By the way, what is the charge for walking over the threshold of a lawyer (never mind barrister), chartered accountant, tax adviser or vet? These medicals are for non-NHS work and if done in an amateurish way, would the cyclist concerned sue the doctor if he became unwell? If you have a heart attack climbing the Col de Golibier, would you sue the doctor who did your medical for free?

There are a million and one reasons to ask your doctor for a medical. Join a gym, buy some new piece of fitness equipment, start running, I need someone to cut my hedge, I can't climb my stairs and need a new house. Be nice to your GP and he or she may not charge you. It is still a professional opinion.

ddmrcp

Dave- similar point- there needs to be an ideal balance between being thorough, over investigating (and treating) and utilising resources.
The bee in my bonnet is- the fees charged are at 'personal disposition' and like the website above, certificates can even be remotely issued..... wheres the standards?

usedtobefast

I'm having deja vous here, I went through exactly the same £150 charge nonsense before last year's Etape. On the advice of posters on these good forums I made an appointment with my registered GP took along my form and she signed and stamped it for no charge, after a quick chat and basic obs measurement. I might have got a bit lucky with her understanding what I needed, she knew what the Etape was all about as her brother had done something similar.

N.B. The important item for the the medical form is the official doctors stamp.

TheStone

I had this problem a few years back. 5mins max, wanted £90.

I wouldn't mind, but he'd even stated that I hadn't been there for 12 years, yet asking for a stamp on a form was too much for them.

It's a joke. Are GPs anymore than a ridiculously overpaid barrier to the drugs?

How can they be compared to other professions, we've already paid for them.

Richard_D

TheStone wrote:

I had this problem a few years back. 5mins max, wanted £90.

I wouldn't mind, but he'd even stated that I hadn't been there for 12 years, yet asking for a stamp on a form was too much for them.

It's a joke. Are GPs anymore than a ridiculously overpaid barrier to the drugs?

How can they be compared to other professions, we've already paid for them.

Before you say they are ridiculously overpaid on what are you basing this. The propaganda put out by the last two governments or your direct knowledge as a tax inspector or accountant. I have seen the books and I therefore know what sort of figure they get paid and what there outgoings are. They are not poorly paid but they are not over paid either
And as gasman said you have not already paid for medicals.Do you know the amount a GP has to pay per month for medical insurance to cover potential litigation?
For all the people that are slagging off GPs try walking in there shoes for a week and see if you still think they are overpaid

maglianera

I am a GP.
First thing is- this is a non-NHS service and is therefore not paid for in advance by taxes. GPs are at liberty to refuse to do this.
Second- medical idemnity to cover for possible litigation costs me over 500 pounds a month. If you were to have a heart attack after being confirmed fit to do this then you might want to sue. In which case I need this insurance. Thirdly- there are different levels as to what this would involve. Someone mentioned that their GP just signed and stamped the form. In other cases what may be needed is a full review of past medical history and medications, full physical examination, investigations which may include ECG, bloods etc. If an echo is needed thats gonna be a whole new cost.
Then finally a professional opinion is needed. And the GP must be willing to stand by this opinion. I've gone through years of training to be able to give that opinion- why shouldn't I charge for it. Gps are not on the whole money grabbing and certainly not overpaid. Please tell me of any profession from manual workers to high court judges that do anything for free. Why should GPs be different. If you don't like it book into a private sports clinic and see how much they charge cos I know it'll be a hell of a lot more than 150 pounds.
Personally I think 150 pounds is too much if you're a young. fit healthy person and I have done these for free in the past as a favour to other cyclists but not because I think they shouldn't be charged for.

schweiz

The sums being requested by GPs and website above are ridiculous.

Here in Switzerland, there is no equivalent NHS so every time I go to the doctor I pay. Once I've had more than CHF 2000 of treatment (this level is my choice and reduces my health insurance premiums significantly) then the costs are covered.

I went to my doctor before the Marmotte in 2009. I'd had high blood pressure for a few months due to some work related stress but as an otherwise healthy, non smoker, moderate drinker who takes regular excercise and was not overweight, he had no problems signing my form.

The cost for this....CHF 40 which at the time was a little over 20 quid!

This in a country where wages are high. A shelf stacker in Co-Op earns at leats £30,000 a year so a doctor's receptionist/medical secretary or a practice nurse will be on at least £45,000 a year. My doctor has two and an apprentice! So if he can run a surgery with those overheads and still only charge 20 odd quid for 10 minutes of his time then £65 (and that based on a self assessment website!) and £150 just seem like pure greed.

alternatively...http://www.staples.co.uk/office-supplie ... 1-set?r=rh

dd1

I did the same as "usedtobefast" above.
Made an appointment with the doctor without telling them what I was coming for and took the certificate with me.
Explained it was a charity bike ride in France and needed the form sigining.
Didn't do any health checks, just signed the from and wished me good luck !!

TheStone

dd1 wrote:

I did the same as "usedtobefast" above.
Made an appointment with the doctor without telling them what I was coming for and took the certificate with me.
Explained it was a charity bike ride in France and needed the form sigining.
Didn't do any health checks, just signed the from and wished me good luck !!

That's how it should be.
£150 to press a button on bp machine, then say yes or no is ridiculous.

rick_chasey

TheStone wrote:

£150 to press a button on bp machine, then say yes or no is ridiculous.

No-one's making you pay for it.

willy b

Mine charged £20 for last years medical examination, which consisted of a few questions of what the even will be, do I have any heart conditions? and taking of my blood pressure.

My mates Doc refused to sign the form, so he "made" one. We both completed fine.

TheStone

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheStone wrote:

£150 to press a button on bp machine, then say yes or no is ridiculous.

No-one's making you pay for it.

For the last one I went down to mediCentre and paid about £60. Although they did do a lot more checks.
But, my point from early: I am being made pay for it through my taxes.

rick_chasey

TheStone wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheStone wrote:

£150 to press a button on bp machine, then say yes or no is ridiculous.

No-one's making you pay for it.

For the last one I went down to mediCentre and paid about £60. Although they did do a lot more checks.
But, my point from early: I am being made pay for it through my taxes.

As the doc above posted, you're obviously not paying for it through your taxes.

TheStone

Rick Chasey wrote:

As the doc above posted, you're obviously not paying for it through your taxes.

Would be interested to see how/where the split is made?

Does the GP pay rent to the NHS for the use of the building and bp machine for those 5 mins?
... or is the whole thing kind of privatised anyway? and they don't get to charge the NHS for those 5 mins?

verylonglegs

I can see both sides to this, I can understand how to some it smacks of a plumber eyeing up his client and deciding how much he can afford to pay before deciding on a figure but I also think it's a little odd how you can happily spend many thousands of pounds on a leisure activity for kit and pursuing it abroad but then scrimp at paying for something that may save you serious problems. It all depends what you get for the cost of that signature I suppose.

TheStone

verylonglegs wrote:

I can see both sides to this, I can understand how to some it smacks of a plumber eyeing up his client and deciding how much he can afford to pay before deciding on a figure but I also think it's a little odd how you can happily spend many thousands of pounds on a leisure activity for kit and pursuing it abroad but then scrimp at paying for something that may save you serious problems. It all depends what you get for the cost of that signature I suppose.

For me it's not the actual cost, but the fact I'm clearly being ripped off for something I'm fairly sure I've already paid for.

I know people who head down to the GP every week even though there's feck all wrong with them. I turn up for 5 mins every 12 years and get charged.

And charged an amount more than a private clinic, despite to some (and I'm guessing large) extent, everything is already paid for by the NHS.

rick_chasey

TheStone wrote:

For me it's not the actual cost, but the fact I'm clearly being ripped off for something I'm fairly sure I've already paid for.

Again, you haven't.

Read the doc's post.

TheStone

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheStone wrote:

For me it's not the actual cost, but the fact I'm clearly being ripped off for something I'm fairly sure I've already paid for.

Again, you haven't.

Read the doc's post.

As I posted above: How do they split the cost of the building, reception etc away from what the NHS has already paid?

(and by NHS, I mean me)

Tom Butcher

Of course it's greed - years ago mine wanted £50 for one which was to do a work placement in the NHS ffs - they earn an average of over 100k a year - far more than the equivalent in other EU nations. Even most hospital doctors agree GPs are massively overpaid.

Vesterberg

loving the haughty responses from the GP's

Gps are not on the whole money grabbing and certainly not overpaid.

ROFL!!!!

and...

I've gone through years of training to be able to give that opinion- why shouldn't I charge for it.

double and thripple ROFL!!!!!!!!

It's a 'Licence to Rinse'. Don't give me that 'what if I get sued' crap.

Richard_D

There are obviously some people who have had bad experiences with their GPs.
I am not a GP but related to one.
I initially wrote a long post relating to my first hand experience but I realised that some people would claim what I have seen is the exception rather than the rule and what they think they seen is the rule rather than the exception.
I will make one short comment which will answer some of the questions. That BP machine, ECG machine and receptionist where not paid for and supplied by the NHS. They were bought and paid for out of what the GP 'earns'.

Tom Butcher

Offset against tax no doubt.

maglianera

If a GP surgery is in a government owned health centre, then the GP pays the government rent. If they own it themselves they pay a mortgage. The GP gets a sum of money on a yearly basis out of which all staffing costs, equipment costs and consumables are paid. Anything left over is then split amongst the GPs. GPs are essentially running a small business.
What one the above posters fails to realise is that taxes pay for NHS services. A private medical certificate is not an NHS service. Sorry about that but that's the way it is.
If your doctor is a cyclist or someone who enjoys sport they're likely to do it for free if its uncomplicated. But they are not obliged. At the end of the day it's the doctors name signed on the form and if something happens some peop[le may feel that the doctor that signed the form could be at fault. So there's 2 issues- first is the time involved for the consultation and filling of the form, second is that the doctor is taking a calculated risk signing the form.
I'm pretty sick of people having a go at GPs for what they earn. The salary can be good but so what. Its hard work. Who wouldn't want to be rewarded for their work? From a lot of the posts on here about what bikes people ride, there are a lot of people earning good salaries and more power to them.