Recovery & Training

Remarkable

Hey all,

I have been cycling nearly two years and I'm looking to progress a bit. I have got just one problem. Recovery. I weigh about 8.5 stone, 20 yrs old and am 5'8 in height. I find it really difficult to recover after training even with recovery drinks.
For example, If i was to do a 2 hour steady endurance ride today (easy Z2), tomorrow my legs would feel quite dead and hurt. I don't think its a fitness issue as I can ride 27 minute 10tt's on my road bike and on the club runs I can ride just as well as the strong guys in the club. I just can't seem to train as often as everyone else. I would love to be able to do both weekend group rides like most of the other guys but I physically can't! I ride at a high cadence and I don't seem to have nearly as much muscle on my legs as the other guys who I race against. Its just so annoying!
Any advice on how to recover better or improve this?

turnerjohn

It could be a million things. You weight next to nothing so maybe a bit of lean muscle weight could help. Recovery issues could be down to other things in your life; how much do you sleep ? whats your work like ? are you active through the day ? whats your diet like ? do you have kids ? etc. For me its sleep (no where near enough) active job and stress which bugger up recovery...the body can only do a certain amount. TBH you shouldn't feel that tired out of a 2hr easy ride. Have you been to see the Doc for blood tests ? could be low in Iron ?
I'd check your diet first; sounds like you need more protein for meals and make sure you fuel properly when you ride so your glysogen stores don't run to low (another reason your feel poo the next day), make sure your as stress free as poss, get some quality sleep, and rest when your body tells you and get a checkup.
Other then that its down the pro trainer route...without assessment its hard to say. !

Alex_Simmons/RST

Or you may simply not train sufficiently, or in a manner to progressively improve your fitness and your ability to train as much as others. Being a little fatigued from training is normal.

Pithy Power Proverb: "The more you train, the more you can train." - A Coggan

cyco2

It's quite likely you have a small energy reserve. Your body weight would suggest a small liver as well so you would always have to supplement your energy over long periods.Try before you start the ride drinking some energy drink and keep supping it all the way through the ride. High energy foods are okay as well but you will need to find out their conversion rates in to usable energy. It is a trial and error situation I have found because I have had the same problem. I never need 'recovery' food or drink now other than fluid because I don't carrying enough.

jgsi

Remarkable wrote:

and I don't seem to have nearly as much muscle on my legs as the other guys who I race against. ?

Is that anything to worry about? I don't think it is, is my view.
Or consume bucket load of bulk mass powder and live inside a smith machine?

Sevenplusthree

Stop being a girl.. Do you think Jens Voigt gets up one morning, 2 weeks into the Tour, having just been in a 200km break the previous day and says i can't ride today, its not physically possible i'm in too much pain.

Fatigue in the legs is normal, any serious cyclist has this feeling most of the time. Just go out and take the first 20-30mins easy and they should feel better. If you take too much recovery you'll never improve past a certain point, you need the training load of consecutive days on the bike.

Zoomer37

Perhaps increase your daily protein intake and start actually riding more. These days my recovery time come's after many consecutive days of riding I dont really feel the need to take much down time through heavy/sore legs. Also If you can afford it having regular messages will work wonders.

Tom Dean

Sevenplusthree wrote:

Stop being a girl

Not like you eh Sevenplusthree? You are much more masculine. Lovely first post.

Remarkable

Thanks for the replies! They have all been really helpful. I'm not being a girl nor am I Jens unfortunetly... but I do try my best! I'm a student so my daily activities aren't very physical. My usual training would consist of:

Saturday: Pritty hard group ride. 3 hrs + (Legs are really sore the next day!) + also includes stop for coffee!! :roll:
Monday: 2 hrs steady endurance.
Tuesday: 1hr 1.5 hr or so steady endurance. (Legs can feel tired as pointed out earlier)
Thursday: Club race usually about an hour.

or if I haven't recovered properly after Saturday I would usually take monday off and do a hard 2 hr ride on tuesday.
Any suggestions alex?

I was reading lately that cyclists who have skinny long muscles recover quicker than those who have bulky muscles but obviously it is not the case.
Its odd because because people who are about the same level as me can do Saturdays and Sundays with the club at the same intensity or even race on the Sunday. :?

Edit: I take a protein recovery drink after training also, I have lots of meat in my diet and usually have a pasta or something before Saturdays group ride or a race.

amaferanga

Remarkable wrote:

Thanks for the replies! They have all been really helpful. I'm not being a girl nor am I Jens unfortunetly... but I do try my best! I'm a student so my daily activities aren't very physical. My usual training would consist of:

Saturday: Pritty hard group ride. 3 hrs + (Legs are really sore the next day!) + also includes stop for coffee!! :roll:
Monday: 2 hrs steady endurance.
Tuesday: 1hr 1.5 hr or so steady endurance. (Legs can feel tired as pointed out earlier)
Thursday: Club race usually about an hour.

or if I haven't recovered properly after Saturday I would usually take monday off and do a hard 2 hr ride on tuesday.
Any suggestions alex?

I was reading lately that cyclists who have skinny long muscles recover quicker than those who have bulky muscles but obviously it is not the case.
Its odd because because people who are about the same level as me can do Saturdays and Sundays with the club at the same intensity or even race on the Sunday. :?

Edit: I take a protein recovery drink after training also, I have lots of meat in my diet and usually have a pasta or something before Saturdays group ride or a race.

How many hours a week are your buddies doing? Your typical week looks like 3 hours endurance pace, a 3 hour group ride and a 1 hour TT - that's not much training.

Remarkable

amaferanga wrote:

How many hours a week are your buddies doing? Your typical week looks like 3 hours endurance pace, a 3 hour group ride and a 1 hour TT - that's not much training.

Actually when I look at it now some are probably doing more..I was thinking that maybe my body is burning glucose or sugar rather than fat and maybe I should try and train to burn fat better..perhaps training rides under 80 % of maximum heart rate? ...but I guess I don't really have that much to burn anyway...hmmm :?

Alex_Simmons/RST

Remarkable wrote:

amaferanga wrote:

How many hours a week are your buddies doing? Your typical week looks like 3 hours endurance pace, a 3 hour group ride and a 1 hour TT - that's not much training.

Actually when I look at it now some are probably doing more..I was thinking that maybe my body is burning glucose or sugar rather than fat and maybe I should try and train to burn fat better..perhaps training rides under 80 % of maximum heart rate? ...but I guess I don't really have that much to burn anyway...hmmm :?

Best way to "burn fat better" (well really to be able to rely more on fats as a fuel and spare glycogen stores/make them last longer) is to improve your power output at threshold (time trial power).

Alex_Simmons/RST

Sevenplusthree wrote:

Stop being a girl..

No idea who you are but I suspect several of the "girls" I know/coach could probably leave you crying in the dust as they ride away from you.

RoadMeridaBen

amaferanga wrote:

Remarkable wrote:

Thanks for the replies! They have all been really helpful. I'm not being a girl nor am I Jens unfortunetly... but I do try my best! I'm a student so my daily activities aren't very physical. My usual training would consist of:

Saturday: Pritty hard group ride. 3 hrs + (Legs are really sore the next day!) + also includes stop for coffee!! :roll:
Monday: 2 hrs steady endurance.
Tuesday: 1hr 1.5 hr or so steady endurance. (Legs can feel tired as pointed out earlier)
Thursday: Club race usually about an hour.

or if I haven't recovered properly after Saturday I would usually take monday off and do a hard 2 hr ride on tuesday.
Any suggestions alex?

I was reading lately that cyclists who have skinny long muscles recover quicker than those who have bulky muscles but obviously it is not the case.
Its odd because because people who are about the same level as me can do Saturdays and Sundays with the club at the same intensity or even race on the Sunday. :?

Edit: I take a protein recovery drink after training also, I have lots of meat in my diet and usually have a pasta or something before Saturdays group ride or a race.

How many hours a week are your buddies doing? Your typical week looks like 3 hours endurance pace, a 3 hour group ride and a 1 hour TT - that's not much training.

More than im doing at the moment :P

cyco2

Remarkable wrote:

Actually when I look at it now some are probably doing more..I was thinking that maybe my body is burning glucose or sugar rather than fat and maybe I should try and train to burn fat better..perhaps training rides under 80 % of maximum heart rate? ...but I guess I don't really have that much to burn anyway...hmmm :?

Right.. you have 'discovered' that you are burning glucose and you now need to burn fat..from an 8st 5lb 5'8" frame. What kind of bunk are you spouting?

You need to read some of the comments here a little bit more carefully and trust them because they are from riders of great experience.

Training.
I have just recently ridden with stripling teenagers who blew me off at 30mph and I can only think you don't get it.

pianoman

If I tried to hang on to someone at 30mph I thinki I'd be throwing up after about a mile or so! Which is exactly why you MUST aim for that - we do it every week for our through and off before the cafe. The human body is inherently a very lazy thing and if you're not prepared to run it into the ground you'll never improve, whether on core strength or higher cadence. Hence why I've been doing intervals without actually changing up a gear - my ability to push gears is good but not even breaking 25mph in gears like 50x12 is nothing short of rubbish. So guess who's been out of breath at the end of recent rides

I also like to reverse typical pacing by going out hard and then trying not to let the speed drop in the last few miles. By that time all you can think about is turning the pedals. I've been doing it recently when out running too. It improves one's ability to survive when fatigued and can turn anyone from a wimp to a warrior when done regularly. Then, when you can combine that new-found ability to survive WITH a good pacing strategy, you'll be winning those sprints on your club races and knocking minutes off your 10 mile TT's in no time

inseine

I don't want to put you off but I've suffered from the inability to recover as well as my clubmates for 35 years! I was a similar build to you when I was your age. On the other hand I have ridden at least as well as those club mates over the years. If i've learnt one thing it is that you just have to listen to your own body and no one can say that a plan that works for them will work for you. Also, it is the recovery that makes you stronger, not the training so don't get into a vicious cycle of over doing it.
I normally ride 7 hours a week but I have just finished about 5 weeks of 9 hours, this is really the limit for me (I'm now telling you want i do after saying ignore all advice!). I train Tuesday, Thursday, saturday and Sunday. I find that it's the recovery period that's important more so than the intencity of the effort, so i'd rather extend the mid week efforts than add in the Wednesday for example even if they were all steady. When I train, I try to really train except Saturday were I find I can do a tempo session (say 1.45 at 80%) as long as i never go into the red.
I'm 49 next week and race as a 2nd cat.

Remarkable

inseine wrote:

I don't want to put you off but I've suffered from the inability to recover as well as my clubmates for 35 years! I was a similar build to you when I was your age. On the other hand I have ridden at least as well as those club mates over the years. If i've learnt one thing it is that you just have to listen to your own body and no one can say that a plan that works for them will work for you. Also, it is the recovery that makes you stronger, not the training so don't get into a vicious cycle of over doing it.
I normally ride 7 hours a week but I have just finished about 5 weeks of 9 hours, this is really the limit for me (I'm now telling you want i do after saying ignore all advice!). I train Tuesday, Thursday, saturday and Sunday. I find that it's the recovery period that's important more so than the intencity of the effort, so i'd rather extend the mid week efforts than add in the Wednesday for example even if they were all steady. When I train, I try to really train except Saturday were I find I can do a tempo session (say 1.45 at 80%) as long as i never go into the red.
I'm 49 next week and race as a 2nd cat.

2nd Cat! Thats awesome! Maybe there is hope for me yet. Its nice to know that I'm not the only one with this problem. Its a pity though because I would love to have a go on some stage races in the future.