If you had £4000 to spend on a car for a 20k mile commute...

coombsfh

What would you buy if you had £4000 to spend on a car to do 20000 miles in every year (or at least this year)?

Criteria:
-Diesel
-Reliable
-Must be entertaining (or at least not loathsome) to drive in twisty bits

I have a short list in mind but want to see if there are any elephants in the room I am missing before i reveal the shortlist. Any reviews or opinions on cars that fit the bill would be great.

Thanks in advance,

Fred.

arthur_scrimshaw

Ford Focus
Saab 9-3 (lots of cheap stuff out there at the moment)

shouldbeinbed

depends on size and carrying needs, I've loved various VW Golfs & a Passat estate

Rigga

E39 BMW 530 or 525 sport, your welcome

tim_wand

Golf MK4 GT tdi 150 then £200 on a Jabba sport re map.

BMW E39 5 series 530d sport (dont worry about the high mileage)

BMW E46 3 series 320 D es (just about) you might find a 330d at a push

Honda Accord 2.2 CDTI (Just aboout)

Ford Mondeo ST22O TDCI or just the 130 TDCI

Anonymous

ignore

Stevo_666

Ford Mondeo or Focus, depending on what size car you need.

OffTheBackAdam

I'd dump the diesel for starters.
A small, modern petrol engine, will work out cheaper to run & no hastles with particle filters.

jordan_217

Skoda Fabia vRS - 55 + mpg, reliable, £125 a year to tax and thanks to the PD engine its got a massive lump of torque. It goes from 50-70 quicker than most performance cars.

Only common rail diesels have DPF's and if you're on a long run to work then there's no need to worry. Its short journeys when the engine doesn't get up to temp that screw up a DPF.

I you're doing 20k miles a year then forget a petrol. Even a modern petrol such as VAG's TFSI works out more expensive to run.

Tony-J

diesel Skoda if you can get one. Taxi drivers are not wrong.

tlw1

As the word entertaining was put in there, an old BMW - rear wheel drive wins every time

rick_chasey

Spend it all on bicycle stuff and become a commuter hero.

CiB

jordan_217 wrote:

Only common rail diesels have DPF's and if you're on a long run to work then there's no need to worry. Its short journeys when the engine doesn't get up to temp that screw up a DPF.

Can't agree sorry. DPFs are designed to last for a number of burn cycles then they need replacing. Eventually you'll need to put a new one in if you keep it beyond the mileage that corresponds to the DPF hitting its end of life; you then face a large bill. Volvo / Ford DPFs have a design life of about 80-85000 miles.

Diesels are good to drive with the torque characteristics but the cost benefit has pretty much eroded away to negligible these days.

giant_man

jordan_217 wrote:

Skoda Fabia vRS - 55 + mpg, reliable, £125 a year to tax and thanks to the PD engine its got a massive lump of torque. It goes from 50-70 quicker than most performance cars.

Only common rail diesels have DPF's and if you're on a long run to work then there's no need to worry. Its short journeys when the engine doesn't get up to temp that screw up a DPF.

I you're doing 20k miles a year then forget a petrol. Even a modern petrol such as VAG's TFSI works out more expensive to run.

hmm you might want to rethink that one mate ...

mallorcajeff

man up and cycle

Diesel Golf I drafted a lorry in mine for 51 miles once and got 83mpg. Day to day 60mpg if you drive it carefully.

centimani

The Focus gets a few mentions...if you're disregarding diesels, i'd be interested to know anyone elses opinions (for the sake of OP) on petrol economy.
I have a 1.6 Focus, engine size not suitable for OPs needs of course, but its a nightmare to drive economically...and absolute nightmare. Nice car but underpowered IMO.
But the point is, when talking to others about this, apparently the Focus range as a whole is not known for its economy, regardless of (petrol) engine size.

McBain_v1

Drove a focus 1.6 petrol Zetec for 3 years and managed to get 40mpg, then a Focus Titanium 2.0 diesel for another 3 years and managed to get 52mpg out of it. Now got a Mondeo Titanium X Sport 2.0 diesel and can so far only get 48mpg out of it. There are more economic cars out there I am sure, but I love the vast interior space of the Mondeo.

I thought that those Fiat 500s were all the rage for economy commuting these days. Great if you don't ever envisage carrying anything bigger than a laptop, but rubbish for everything else I expect. No wonder Mrs McBain wants one!

Sesquepidilian

McBain_v1 wrote:

Drove a focus 1.6 petrol Zetec for 3 years and managed to get 40mpg, then a Focus Titanium 2.0 diesel for another 3 years and managed to get 52mpg out of it. Now got a Mondeo Titanium X Sport 2.0 diesel and can so far only get 48mpg out of it. There are more economic cars out there I am sure, but I love the vast interior space of the Mondeo.

I thought that those Fiat 500s were all the rage for economy commuting these days. Great if you don't ever envisage carrying anything bigger than a laptop, but rubbish for everything else I expect. No wonder Mrs McBain wants one!

I get mild claustraphobia in new shape Mondeos. Pillars too thick. windows too small - same with most cars made within the past 8 years or so. Also just about any modern diesel will have a tendencey to lunch itself. DMFs, Turbos, I(ntercoolers, fuel systems, EGRs. They all seem to fail distressingly early.
If I hd £4k knocking about I'd buy a £1500 whatever and spend the rest on fun things like cycles.

McBain_v1

Fortunately my company leases the cars so don't really care if and when the engine disintegrates because a brand new one is always around the corner. Funny, I always thought that diesels were supposed to be more durable because they are made of steel. Is it really the case that all of the add-ons result in them being bolloxed just as easily as their petrol companions?

jordan_217

giant man wrote:

jordan_217 wrote:

Skoda Fabia vRS - 55 + mpg, reliable, £125 a year to tax and thanks to the PD engine its got a massive lump of torque. It goes from 50-70 quicker than most performance cars.

Only common rail diesels have DPF's and if you're on a long run to work then there's no need to worry. Its short journeys when the engine doesn't get up to temp that screw up a DPF.

I you're doing 20k miles a year then forget a petrol. Even a modern petrol such as VAG's TFSI works out more expensive to run.

hmm you might want to rethink that one mate ...

Why? You've driven one then? They are quick in gear, fact. More torque than a Boxster and all but the fastest Imprezas, not far of an E46 M3 too. The stats dont really illustrate the massive lump of power these things have between 1500-2000 rpm.

I don't need to rethink anything. Thanks

rake

McBain_v1 wrote:

Fortunately my company leases the cars so don't really care if and when the engine disintegrates because a brand new one is always around the corner. Funny, I always thought that diesels were supposed to be more durable because they are made of steel. Is it really the case that all of the add-ons result in them being bolloxed just as easily as their petrol companions?

the main guts are more durable although they are building them lighter these days, its the expensive add-ons that get cacked up in soot/wear out. partly from being green and the rest from refinement there seems no benefit to having most diesels now. they've tried to have their cake and eat it with economy and performance.

CiB

The other thing with diesels is the dual mass flywheel, which is also prone to failure well before the car reaches the end of its otherwise useful life.

Witha budget of 4000 it strikes me that OP is letting himself in for a heap of potential trouble by buying a well used diesel that someone is probably desperate to shift to an unsuspecting buyer.

Whatever you decide to buy, you'd do well to do a bit of research before parting with any cash.

rake

that said i found a peugeot 407 20l diesel turbo for a family member at 30kmiles £2995. its now upto 123k in four years and only needed a new ignition lock.just passed mot again ok. its not failed one yet. older diesel though, probably no dmf. i did search very hard for it and probably wouldnt buy a modern diesel. if someones been a bit enthusiastic with their starts (most are)it can play havoc with the dmf and theres no way of knowing que new clutch and flywheel assembly plus many hours labour.

ohara227

For £4000 try and get a tidy Peugeot 306 D-Turbo, I used one and clocked up about 80,000 on it in around 3 years which added to the 40,000 already on it. With about 120,000 on the clock I sold it 4 years ago and seen it happy as larry flying along an A road near me a few days ago. They are good on fuel and good engines, might find an oil leak but for £4000 you will have move than enough to buy one, fix any oil leak (usually just gasket), tax, insure and buy fuel for while!

Plus the back seats fold down and lift out, which is ideal for carrying stuff - like a bike :-)

Happy hunting!

brettjmcc

McBain_v1 wrote:

Drove a focus 1.6 petrol Zetec for 3 years and managed to get 40mpg, then a Focus Titanium 2.0 diesel for another 3 years and managed to get 52mpg out of it. Now got a Mondeo Titanium X Sport 2.0 diesel and can so far only get 48mpg out of it. There are more economic cars out there I am sure, but I love the vast interior space of the Mondeo.

I thought that those Fiat 500s were all the rage for economy commuting these days. Great if you don't ever envisage carrying anything bigger than a laptop, but rubbish for everything else I expect. No wonder Mrs McBain wants one!

McBain - firstly, I have to say I work for Ford... but not in their engineering department.

I notice it too, its a combination of a a few things together... weight increase and also the EURO emissions cycle. Your old Focus engine will have probably been to the older emissions standard.

Years ago I ran a ST TDCi Mondeo (the 155PS 2.2 engine), the older shape one and got 42-41mpg average. My last Mondeo that I ran I handed back with 9000 miles on the clock with a 41 average. I personally am pretty impressed based ont he fact it now has 200PS the newer car is probably 200Kg heavier and it also complies to the latest emissions standards.

I currently run a 1.6 diesel Focus estate, but will be picking up one of our new 1.0l EcoBoost 3pot petrol engines. It's 100Kg lighter than the diesel, delivers more torque (same power) than the 1.6 you talk about above. My colleague has one already and she is recording 48mpg average in less than 1000 miles covere so far.

As to the OP, at 20K with a car at 4000, youmay be looking at slightly older engine tech, so it will literally just be warming up every day. Make sure you don't go too underpowered, otherwise you will nail it everywhere and not reap the benefits. I'd take a look at parts and service costs/ease of getting parts. If it's not for family use, I would suggest a smaller lighter car with a reasonable engine with it - Something Polo/Fiesta size with a 1.6 Petrol or diesel engine.

Brett

Swansea_Dave

Arthur Scrimshaw wrote:

Ford Focus
Saab 9-3 (lots of cheap stuff out there at the moment)

Focus isn't my cup of tea. Had quite a few as hire cars - the interior is particularly cheap and tacky. Hilarious when compared with e.g. a VW.

My Saab 9-3 diesel has 235,000 miles on the clock after 11 years and its still enjoyable to drive. Dead reliable and 45-48 mpg every tank. Its the old GM 2.2 tractor engine so it'll rattle your teeth out when its cold, though (I guess its 'character', cough cough).

ddraver

Can't believe no one has suggested a Cervelo R3, preferably with Di2 or SRAM hydraulic Red yet...?

davis

For 4k surely it's just buy any old lump of car, and run it into the ground? Keep the rest of the money for something that isn't going to be spending 95% of its time making you miserable on the motorway.

I'd go older due to DMFs and DPFs; they're basically made to fail.
The only thing I'd be tempted to go for other than a cheap lump is an even older BMW in decent condition, keep it tidy and serviced, and run it up to starship mileage. I used to like them when I still found driving fun.

brettjmcc

Swansea_Dave wrote:

Focus isn't my cup of tea. Had quite a few as hire cars - the interior is particularly cheap and tacky. Hilarious when compared with e.g. a VW.

Tried the new one yet? I'd agree with the old one...

nwallace

McBain_v1 wrote:

Fortunately my company leases the cars so don't really care if and when the engine disintegrates because a brand new one is always around the corner. Funny, I always thought that diesels were supposed to be more durable because they are made of steel. Is it really the case that all of the add-ons result in them being bolloxed just as easily as their petrol companions?

"Diesel overrun" is a major one for Turboed engines.
If your Turbo oil seals fail, the oil gets into the turbine that should be compressing air, this then gets into the combustion chamber, as the combustion chamber is very hot, the oil combusts just like diesel... You now have a tubo pumping oil into the combustion chamber, where it combusts, puts out exhaust gasses and turns the turbine even faster.
Switching the engine off will do nothing, as the turbine is still pumping oil in, standing on the brakes will either give you a few milli-seconds to escape if you do it early enough or cause the brakes to lunch themselves.
Your only escape route is to shove the thing into a ditch and get out as fast as possible.


For 4k get yourself something cheap and run it into the ground.

I've just put my 1999 Corolla past 130k, it's still going (so it will fail drastically tomorrow) still isnt' eating oil and if I really really try (and this is difficult due to it being the 6 speed model with the short gears and screams at you to thrash it) I can get 40mpg out of it.
Great fun to drive, probably the best "modern" car I've driven, power steering is just right, power output is good, handlnig is good.

I bought it off my brother for 1.25k a couple of years back (It's the 1.6 G6 so quite rare as well) think you can get a 1.3 from around 800.

Swansea_Dave

brettjmcc wrote:

Swansea_Dave wrote:

Focus isn't my cup of tea. Had quite a few as hire cars - the interior is particularly cheap and tacky. Hilarious when compared with e.g. a VW.

Tried the new one yet? I'd agree with the old one...

I guess the new type is the one that came out in 2011l? If so, I have had a couple of rentals. Some decent toys in the last one I had - satnav in dash and bluetooth, etc. But, oddly, only a 5 speed box (in a petrol version) and no cruise control.

And, back to the 20K mile, commute - as well as the Saab we have a Fiat Stilo 1.2 16v with over 130,000 miles on the clock. I think thats around 110,000 miles more than they were ever designed to do........