What supplements ?

Headhuunter

Simon E wrote:

trickydisco wrote:

Check out what shane perkins takes

That may be entirely appropriate for the world keirin champ during intense training when he requires 5,000 calories per day, but that doesn't mean all that stuff is required for yer average MAMIL or someone trying to crack 25mins for a club '10'.

Ditto comments by the forum's own champion. What Colin needs when training is not the same is what I need for commuting and my lightweight training sessions.

Most of those supplements are geared around muscle growth - amino acids, creatine to allow longer bursts of energy etc, very keyed up to extreme bursts of energy type of training rather than longer, endurance type exercise.

I take 100mg of co enzyme Q10, glucosamin and chondriotin, calcium, garlic oil and omega 3/fish oil. After the gym I have a protein shake with L glutamine and on long endurance rides I mix my own energy drink makde up of maltodextrin, BCAA and cholin bitartate....

Pokerface

I purposely didn't state what I take - and I (think) I said that what supplements you take depend on the type of riding you do and what your goals are. I take lots of stuff to (legally) aid performance and help me recover faster as I need to be fresh as possible on a daily basis. I take other things just around major competitions. We ('elite' cyclists) all do.

However - for your average weekend warrior - a healthy diet probably is all you need. A basinal mutt-vit probably is a good place to start. Then be selective depending on what needs work (weight loss, recovery, endurance increases, strength, etc).

And what Perkins takes is actually very relevant to the discussion. His supplements are not all just for building speed or for track cyclists. 8)

simon_e

Headhuunter wrote:

I take 100mg of co enzyme Q10, glucosamin and chondriotin, calcium, garlic oil and omega 3/fish oil. After the gym I have a protein shake with L glutamine and on long endurance rides I mix my own energy drink makde up of maltodextrin, BCAA and cholin bitartate....

Have you been advised by a trained nutritionist to take these things? I read that the benefits of Co-enzyme Q10, Glucosamine and Chondriotin were questionable (more), as research that showed they only worked was limited to people with specific ailments or conditions.

If you feel you do not get adequate calcium from your diet surely the answer is to eat more calcium-rich or fortified foods.

Pokerface wrote:

for your average weekend warrior - a healthy diet probably is all you need. A basinal mutt-vit probably is a good place to start. Then be selective depending on what needs work (weight loss, recovery, endurance increases, strength, etc).

And what Perkins takes is actually very relevant to the discussion.

Isn't a multivitamin likely to be a scattergun approach? How do you know which needs supplementation? Prof Ratcliffe, an expert advisor to the Food Standards Agency, appears to think it's a waste of money:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healt ... onist.html
I've heard that many are crap - there are varying sources and of varying quality. This chap is a nutrition specialist at Sheffield Hallam Uni. Scroll down to where it says "Do not waste your money on these supplements":
http://nutrition4performance.blogspot.c ... unity.html
The Cochrane review was pretty damning:
"We found no evidence to support antioxidant supplements for primary or secondary prevention. Vitamin A, beta-carotene, and vitamin E may increase mortality."
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... 6/abstract
http://www.nhs.uk/news/2008/04April/Pag ... nefit.aspx

Shane Perkins' intake may be relevant, but only if you (or your coach or nutritionist) know enough about them to use them appropriately. Taking stuff as insurance or because someone else does it is wasting money. I reckon most of us would benefit more from better sleep, better food and spending less time on the internet.

Headhuunter

Simon E wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

I take 100mg of co enzyme Q10, glucosamin and chondriotin, calcium, garlic oil and omega 3/fish oil. After the gym I have a protein shake with L glutamine and on long endurance rides I mix my own energy drink makde up of maltodextrin, BCAA and cholin bitartate....

Have you been advised by a trained nutritionist to take these things? I read that the benefits of Co-enzyme Q10, Glucosamine and Chondriotin were questionable (more), as research that showed they only worked was limited to people with specific ailments or conditions.

If you feel you do not get adequate calcium from your diet surely the answer is to eat more calcium-rich or fortified foods.

Pokerface wrote:

for your average weekend warrior - a healthy diet probably is all you need. A basinal mutt-vit probably is a good place to start. Then be selective depending on what needs work (weight loss, recovery, endurance increases, strength, etc).

And what Perkins takes is actually very relevant to the discussion.

Isn't a multivitamin likely to be a scattergun approach? How do you know which needs supplementation? Prof Ratcliffe, an expert advisor to the Food Standards Agency, appears to think it's a waste of money:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healt ... onist.html
I've heard that many are crap - there are varying sources and of varying quality. This chap is a nutrition specialist at Sheffield Hallam Uni. Scroll down to where it says "Do not waste your money on these supplements":
http://nutrition4performance.blogspot.c ... unity.html
The Cochrane review was pretty damning:
"We found no evidence to support antioxidant supplements for primary or secondary prevention. Vitamin A, beta-carotene, and vitamin E may increase mortality."
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... 6/abstract
http://www.nhs.uk/news/2008/04April/Pag ... nefit.aspx

Shane Perkins' intake may be relevant, but only if you (or your coach or nutritionist) know enough about them to use them appropriately. Taking stuff as insurance or because someone else does it is wasting money. I reckon most of us would benefit more from better sleep, better food and spending less time on the internet.

Yeah you're probably right about these things. I take CoQ10 because my blood pressure comes out a bit high and its supposed to help the heart, although it's mostly beneficial to people who take statins apparently as statins severely deplete CoQ10 levels. I don't take it for the supposed instant energy benefits. As you say, glucosamine and chondroitin have been proven in several studies to be ineffective. My right knee gets painful sometimes and the doc reckoned it was wear to the cartilage so I thought I would try it. I think once the current lot I have runs out I probably won't bother again and see if my knee feels any worse. Quite a few people I know have said they notice a definite benefit when they take it but that could be a placebo effect... The calcium I take now and then, my other half is vegetarian and I don't eat much meat so thought I would benefit. Also a calcium rich diet is supposed to help with HBP...

Pokerface

Simon E wrote:

Shane Perkins' intake may be relevant, but only if you (or your coach or nutritionist) know enough about them to use them appropriately. Taking stuff as insurance or because someone else does it is wasting money. I reckon most of us would benefit more from better sleep, better food and spending less time on the internet.

I read the links you provided, but they seem to be one person's opinions and lacking in proof? They also seem to back up some of what I said. A healthy well-balanced diet seems to be the best approach. But the only thing I can see wrong with taking a multi-vit is that it "may" put you over the top on certain vitamins you get naturally (like vit A?).

As I figured - you'll find as many articles and studies FOR taking supplements as you will AGAINST taking them!

Velonutter

Cleat Eastwood wrote:

being a veggie I take iron and zinc - can notice a real difference if I stop. My bro isnt a veggie and took some and didnt notice a change. For me they do supplement my diet, but if you eat well, I guess theres no need.

Yep I'm vegetarian as well and I don't really like vegetables!!!! lol

At 52 I take Glocosamine (Vegetarian Version), Vitamin B12 for my neuropathy in my feet, Vit C 1000mg, Iron Tabs, and through the Winter Vitamin D which helped me get over the SAD syndrome.

All cheaply available with some good deals from http://www.simplysupplements.co.uk

The biggest single difference from these supplements was the glucosamine, what a difference. 8)