Hilly or undulating?

OwenB

What do you guys class as a hilly ride?
I've seen some threads recently where people have claimed speed averages on what some call flat and some call hilly and obviously there's some inbetween.

Where does the difference come? Is there a general rule of elevation gained/lost per mile that classes a ride as hilly?

I just want to know so when I'm talking to others they don't sneer when I'm talking about flogging my backside on a ride which they class as pancake flat.

Pross

As a rule of thumb I start thinking of a road as hilly when I do more than 1000' of climbing per 10 miles but it does depend a bit as I can do a ride with a single proper climb that won't hit that figure whilst other rides are up and down all day without any really significant hills.

It will obviously depend to some extent on where you live though.

Bobbinogs

Yepp, agree with Pross although I work in metres

An average w/e ride for me is about 100k each so <1,000m of climbing is a treat (so saved for sunny Sundays), ~1,500 is undulating and >2,000 is hilly (and best endured through gritted teeth on miserable Saturdays).

Pross

Bobbinogs wrote:

Yepp, agree with Pross although I work in metres

Pah, bloody youngsters!

MartinB2444

It's a good question! I've found my average speed doesn't just depend on the amount of climbing but the length of climb. I can maintain a higher average over undulating ground, powering over hills than I can when there are long sustained climbs. The great majority of my riding is in the Peak District and 1000' per 10miles is about the average, with frequent 600'+climbs. I'd certainly class it as very hilly.

Martin

schweiz

If it's a ride with at least two alpine passes with more than 10 km of continuous climbing at no less than 6% then it's hilly otherwise it's undulating.

If it's a ride round a lake but the daily climb is less than 10 m/km (i.e if I do less than 500 m climb on a 50 km ride) it's flat.

markos1963

Anything with a speedhump around here is hilly.

morstar

Pross wrote:

As a rule of thumb I start thinking of a road as hilly when I do more than 1000' of climbing per 10 miles.

Exactly this.^

I suppose 500' to 1000' is undulating and less than that is either flat, or flat with a couple of lumps. Both get classified as flat.

thescouselander

My view, if the gradient is less than 10% then you're not on a hill.

ShutUpLegs

Pross wrote:

As a rule of thumb I start thinking of a road as hilly when I do more than 1000' of climbing per 10 miles but it does depend a bit as I can do a ride with a single proper climb that won't hit that figure whilst other rides are up and down all day without any really significant hills.

It will obviously depend to some extent on where you live though.

^
Rule of thumb except those living in Norwich
1000ft per 10 miles

Bordersroadie

I guess it depends on where you live. 100ft per mile is a hilly ride round here. Longer rides with flatter sections tend to be around 60-80.

briantrumpet

Bordersroadie wrote:

I guess it depends on where you live. 100ft per mile is a hilly ride round here. Longer rides with flatter sections tend to be around 60-80.

Ditto for Devon. (Sorry if that sounds like an election slogan.)

petemadoc

thescouselander wrote:

My view, if the gradient is less than 10% then you're not on a hill.

This only has an average of 4.8

http://app.strava.com/segments/841455

But it is definitely a hill!

thescouselander

PeteMadoc wrote:

thescouselander wrote:

My view, if the gradient is less than 10% then you're not on a hill.

This only has an average of 4.8

http://app.strava.com/segments/841455

But it is definitely a hill!

It's a bit of an incline, I'll give you that.

thegibdog

A hilly ride = a ride with hills in it. According to the 1,000ft per 10 miles rule this ride isn't hilly:

http://app.strava.com/activities/1796613

Seemed pretty hilly to me!

Bobbinogs

thegibdog wrote:

A hilly ride = a ride with hills in it. According to the 1,000ft per 10 miles rule this ride isn't hilly:

http://app.strava.com/activities/1796613

Seemed pretty hilly to me!

Perhaps you could rename it "100 miles of undulations"??

petemadoc

This is clearly subjective so here's my personal definitions

Flat = flat, no hills no ups or downs just flat where the wind is the only thing that matters

Undulating = flat but with some small ups and downs and the odd little hill. You can power up all the "hills" or small humps without any great loss of speed

Hilly = up, down, up down, flat for a little bit until you get to the next up. Average speed drops significantly.

Torque effort ride = find the biggest steepest hill you can and repeat multiple times.

thegibdog

Bobbinogs wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

A hilly ride = a ride with hills in it. According to the 1,000ft per 10 miles rule this ride isn't hilly:

http://app.strava.com/activities/1796613

Seemed pretty hilly to me!

Perhaps you could rename it "100 miles of undulations"??

I know, I must be breaking the trades description act!

I have looked at the rides I've logged since getting my Garmin in August and none of them class as Hilly, including those in the Peak District. In fact I could drive to the bottom of Long Hill, get my bike out and do hill reps on last years National Hill Climb course and still not have completed a Hilly Ride.

Anonymous

170 miles of 18,000ft of vertical climbing is what I have in store for July this year. That only JUST hits on the hilly-o-meter

Muffintop

If it knackers you and you don't go very fast it's hilly (which also counts in my book if it's flat and extremely windy).

I was also going to write 'Undulating is what your mum is' but that makes no sense, and is a bit weird. I'm sure she's a lovely woman.

smidsy

I'm quite sure the 1000ft in 10 miles thing is the accepted definition but there is also a real world barometer surely.

If you have to put it in the lowest gear and grit your teeth and get out of the saddle to make it up that has to be a hill. Maybe not a text book defined one but a hill none the less.

jamienorton

Ive just been playing with bikely and plotted a 40mile loop, it came to 5000ft, everywhere seems to be uphill from here. How accurate are programs like bikely for altitude.

Bobbinogs

jamienorton wrote:

Ive just been playing with bikely and plotted a 40mile loop, it came to 5000ft, everywhere seems to be uphill from here. How accurate are programs like bikely for altitude.

They can be reasonably accurate but I mainly use them for an idea of the route rather than an exact calculation. The best way to check any site is to look at an accredited AAA audax ride. AUK insist that AAA points (1 x A for ~1,000m of climbing) are only given when the ride organiser submits the results of one of the following:

1. Three independent altimeter readings.
2. A GPS tracklog of the event.
3. Map contour counting. This is the traditional AAA method.

AUK then review the data before they give accreditation. Hence, if an audax route shows 3.25 AAA then you can pretty much say it is fairly accurate and then map the route in Bikely/RidewithGPS, etc., to see if that site also shows 3,250m, or what any difference is.

The big difference between the mapping sites and reality is usually in the gradient of any climb because of the way that the sites average data. You can see the difference mapping a route for 50 miles and finding the steepest bit...and then redoing the map with just the steepest climb itself. The gradient will usually vary a great deal whatever site you use.

OwenB

Thanks guys, where I live (south lake district) it seems the majority of rides could be classed as hilly (according to Ride with Gps at least). Just wanted clarification really.

morstar

thegibdog wrote:

A hilly ride = a ride with hills in it. According to the 1,000ft per 10 miles rule this ride isn't hilly:

http://app.strava.com/activities/1796613

Seemed pretty hilly to me!

But clearly that was a ride of two halves. First half was undulating and second half was hilly! You've got no excuses as there were plenty of opportunites to make those first 50 so much more hilly. :twisted:

It's like a GT stage when they ride on the flat for 100 miles with one large climb at the end. It's not a mountain stage but it is a MTF.

sub55

Bobbinogs wrote:

Yepp, agree with Pross although I work in metres

An average w/e ride for me is about 100k each so <1,000m of climbing is a treat (so saved for sunny Sundays), ~1,500 is undulating and >2,000 is hilly (and best endured through gritted teeth on miserable Saturdays).

Like so often on here , i think some are deluding themselves! Lets see some links to these hilly routes.
Happen to live in one of the hilliest areas of the country and just plotted one or two loops to see . Once you go over 40 odd miles and make it a loop , its nigh on impossible to end up with more than 1000ft in ten miles. As a whole.
Can do it as a hill climb repeats but even that takes some finding.

masterchef

i like riding both!, flat, so i can push big gears and hit big speeds on flats and hilly because i love knowing i have to work hard to get up that hill!, but depends on the length on the climb, i prefare the big climbs( longer that 4miles) and different gradients! at each bit!

briantrumpet

sub55 wrote:

Lets see some links to these hilly routes.

Hilly.

Dartmoor generally gets over the 1000ft per 10 miles, though my general Devon riding works out at about 600ft per 10 miles on average.

sub55

masterchef wrote:

i like riding both!, flat, so i can push big gears and hit big speeds on flats and hilly because i love knowing i have to work hard to get up that hill!, but depends on the length on the climb, i prefare the big climbs( longer that 4miles) and different gradients! at each bit!

"longer that 4miles"

i bet there's not to Many of them around either

sub55

briantrumpet wrote:

sub55 wrote:

Lets see some links to these hilly routes.

Hilly.

Dartmoor generally gets over the 1000ft per 10 miles, though my general Devon riding works out at about 600ft per 10 miles on average.

fair do`s , looks like a tough ride that.
i live in west wales , can find a couple of routes that achieve it, but im sure you appriciate what i was saying.

thegibdog

briantrumpet wrote:

sub55 wrote:

Lets see some links to these hilly routes.

Hilly.

Dartmoor generally gets over the 1000ft per 10 miles, though my general Devon riding works out at about 600ft per 10 miles on average.

Doesn't look that hilly to me though, I'd say that's very undulating.