Becoming a coach- looking for advice from practising coaches

lef

I'm seriously considering and looking into training to become a cycle coach. As there are no doubt numerous coaches who use the forum I thought here would be a great place to ask for advice.

I'd like to think there is a living to be made from it, no doubt there are people that do. I would be leaving a career to pursue this, and though not expecting to become rich I would like to earn a living. So is making a living from coaching likely? I am certainly committed and have a real passion for this and have been into fitness all my life though no formal qualifications. As far as putting the time & effort in, that's a given. I'm also considering supplementing cycle coaching with other services such as bike fitting (something else I am very interested in). I guess the challenging bit is getting the clients, but that's like anything I guess.

So I've been doing some research about courses and came across the Association of British Cycling Coaches. I've had a discussion with them and decided to enrol on their distance learning course. Once qualified I believe I would become a registered coach. Does anyone have any experience of this course? It looks quite comprehensive though I'm sure some of the subjects are just an overview.

I would also like to hear anyone's comments on the British Cycling coaching courses. I am also considering Level 2 Cycle Coaching, Level 2 Road and TT and further down the line Level 3. I hear the Level 2 Cycle Coaching is pretty basic stuff though not sure of the more specialist courses. There's very little about course structure. I will get in touch with them to get more but keen to hear comments from those with first hand experience of the course?

Are there are any other routes I should look into? And once qualified is there further training, qualifications areas of expertise that are worth holding? Are there any other associations / bodies who are worth getting in contact with for more advice?

Any advice would be warmly received, though as I say I'm primarily looking for advice / insight from practising coaches or those in and around the industry.

Thanks,

Leon

...I did do a search on bikeradar for similar posts, couldn't find anything so apologies in advance if this is duplicating previous posts.

SBezza

I am a BC Level 2 Coach, and it is basically aimed at teaching Go Ride coaching sessions. As Level 2 coach you are not qualified to teach on a one to one basis.

If you wanted to do Level 2 specific and Level 3 however, you must do level 2 first and practice your coaching before you can do the other levels.

The ABCC coaching is a very good starting point, whilst I am not a ABCC coach I think this is probably the best route to take. You could do the BC coaching alongside this, as I would have thought the more experience you egt the better you would become.

Pross

I'm not a coach myself (yet - hopefully starting BC level 2 soon) but I would have thought it would be hard to earn a full time living out of cycle coaching straight away. I would think you would have to do some coaching part-time to build a reputation before giving up the day job unless you are already well known in cycling circles for success on the bike which might help get you some clients. If specialising in track then it may be possible once qualified to get some casual work at a velodrome.Looking at this http://cyclecoachingwales.com/?page_id=7 you would be earning around £50 to £80 per rider each month so would need 15 - 20 regulars to make a living.

jgsi

I did ask the same question a few weeks back.
The general consensus was to go the BC route.

johncp

I did the BC coaching lvl 2 and found it was of limited benefit. It was more about how to coach than what to coach. And you are not legally allowed to coach on the open road. If you want to know about physiology etc and how best to prepare for racing/sportives, the ABCC is probably a better bet.

GiantMike

There is no living to be made from coaching unless:

a. you can live on little money or

b. you can come up with a new 'scheme' and write a book.

The real question is 'why would somebody want to pay me lots of their hard-earned money to tell them to try harder during training?'

Alex_Simmons/RST

GiantMike wrote:

There is no living to be made from coaching unless:

a. you can live on little money or

b. you can come up with a new 'scheme' and write a book.

This is incorrect.

It is certainly possible to earn a reasonable living from coaching. It is my sole source of income, and the sole source of income for many people I know.

To do it well requires a sizable investment in one's self, and exploring opportunities to gain experience. Often that might mean working along side or under the guidance of another highly experienced coach, or taking on local coaching assignments with your club.

There are a few routes to earning a full time living from it:

- set up your own coaching business (that is hard and requires one have far more than coaching abilities)

- join an existing professional coaching business (this may well be a good way to gain experience while having infrastructure support already provided, as well as a support network and some clients)

- be employed by an organisation such as a pro team or institute of sport (if you are not experienced/qualified, then it is likely you would need to volunteer your services for a while in order to learn).

As others have said, another route is to do it part-time for a while, e.g. providing coaching services to your club, while you gain experience and build up your knowledge. But even though you may do it part time for a while, you need to treat it as a profession/business and not as a hobby.

GiantMike wrote:

The real question is 'why would somebody want to pay me lots of their hard-earned money to tell them to try harder during training?'

Agreed, which is why we apply sound evidence based principles to our coaching, rather than sprout random fluff like that.

GiantMike

Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:

GiantMike wrote:

There is no living to be made from coaching unless:

a. you can live on little money or

This is incorrect.

It is certainly possible to earn a reasonable living from coaching. It is my sole source of income, and the sole source of income for many people I know.

How much do you earn from coaching? How many hours a week do you work? How guaranteed is this source of income?

Pseudonym

GiantMike wrote:

How much do you earn from coaching? How many hours a week do you work? How guaranteed is this source of income?

how much do you earn from your job? How many hours a week do you work? How guaranteed is your source of income?

GiantMike

Pseudonym wrote:

GiantMike wrote:

How much do you earn from coaching? How many hours a week do you work? How guaranteed is this source of income?

how much do you earn from your job? How many hours a week do you work? How guaranteed is your source of income?

I'm only asking because there is a debate about whether a decent living can be made from coaching.

If an average coach earns 20k a year working 60 hours a week and works from month-to-month through a series of different customers, that is evidence that it isn't very well paid (per hour) or very secure.

If an average coach earns 60k a year working 40 hours a week and had a long-term contract with a single well-funded organisation, that is evidence that it is a decent living from coaching.

I don't think that an average coach earns an average UK wage, but I'm happy to be proven wrong.

Alex_Simmons/RST

How much I earn from coaching is my business. Note that I am based in Sydney, Australia, one of the most expensive cities to live in the world, yet still manage to earn a sufficient income. It's like most small businesses, you have to work hard to do well.

if you are lazy, then coaching is not for you.

GiantMike

Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:

How much I earn from coaching is my business.

Yes it is, but you are arguing a point from the perspective of a practising coach who has access to the information the OP was asking for. Do you have any idea what an 'average coach' earns, hours worked, time to get to that income etc?

For the OP to give up his job to become a full-time coach, I think he was looking for advice, rather than a generic 'Yes it can be done'.

Alex_Simmons/RST

GiantMike wrote:

Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:

How much I earn from coaching is my business.

Yes it is, but you are arguing a point from the perspective of a practising coach who has access to the information the OP was asking for. Do you have any idea what an 'average coach' earns, hours worked, time to get to that income etc?

For the OP to give up his job to become a full-time coach, I think he was looking for advice, rather than a generic 'Yes it can be done'.

Then how come your advice was a generic response that it couldn't be done (when clearly it can)?

I'm not saying it's easy, or what the pathways to full time coaching might be for any given individual circumstances. That is too specific for a general advice forum.

lef

Well it's good to see a healthy debate! I live in London, likewise an expensive city. I think this can work both ways. Considering there are many new cyclists, people with disposable income etc, it could be a positive but then possibly quite dense as far as coaches per population, though that I don't know.

GiantMike, I have no grounds to disagree with your suggestion that there is no money to be had, but could you confirm what your knowledge of the industry is? It would be good to understand the context of your comments.

Alex, thanks for the suggestions on options available to get started. Plenty to consider.

I think I'm going to do the ABCC course though there was a suggestion at the weekend I should look into triathlete coaching as more flexibility in clients, I will look into. I am still considering doing the British Cycling route also though from comments I've heard recently it does seem like the earlier training is not that useful. I will get some coaching over the coming months too, should be helpful in gaining further insight.

Thanks for everyone's comments thus far. Still keen to hear from anyone else who has done BC or ABCC routes, or other?

GiantMike

lef wrote:

GiantMike, I have no grounds to disagree with your suggestion that there is no money to be had, but could you confirm what your knowledge of the industry is? It would be good to understand the context of your comments.

I am currently a BC Level 2 coach, working towards level 3. I haven't tried to get employment as a coach but I'm doing it out of interest and hopefully to improve my riding.

While I say there is no money in it, clearly there is for the professionals. Pro teams need coaches and there is a large market of cyclists who want to improve (and a lot of them have a lot more money than talent). However, I doubt that the AVERAGE COACH earns the UK average wage (26K) and probably does it as a spare time hobby rather than a full-time job.

I would like to know what an average coach earns and what hours they work (if there is such a thing). I've seen websites with different price plans, but I don't know how many customers an average coach has and how much contact/interraction they have with their clients. I could set up a snazzy website, offer 4 coaching plans with the 'Platinum Plus Perfection Programme' costing $650 per month and giving 1 hour of contact per week. This doesn't mean I have any customers though.

BeaconRuth

I'm not sure it's all that helpful to talk about the 'average cycling coach'. Cycle coaching can mean a massive range of activities from an inexperienced parent organising a group of fifteen under-7-year-olds to balance safely round cones on a school playground to the tactical coaching advice given by former world medallists to prospective olympians training on the track. Then think about all the possible cycling disciplines from road racing, time trialling and track to downhill MTB, BMX and Speedway. 'Cycle coaching' encompasses a massive range of skill, performance and experience levels, disciplines, aspirations........

What is true is that the vast majority of coaching has traditionally been (and still is) done by volunteers. If you want to make money from it you need to know what your market is and how you are going to provide a service worth paying for.

I've been making a living from cycle coaching for 5 years but I started out with a big advantage (both in knowledge of performance cycling and, shall we say, 'kudos') because I'm a former multiple national TT champion. I've also got an academic scientific background and I'm a qualified teacher - all of which help.

I'm a tutor for British Cycling Coach Education so I know the BC courses pretty well. What I would say about them is that they set the very highest standard in terms of organisation, structure, course materials and administration. Having talked to many people involved in coaching qualifications in other sports it's very clear that few get close to the quality of the British Cycling coaching courses. However, you do need to realise that getting to the stage of being able to deliver one-to-one performance coaching with BC is a fairly long haul and the initial courses are all about coaching groups to develop basic cycling skills - a very long way from taking an individual to a championship win which most people imagine they're going to do as a 'cycling coach'! However, if a coaching qualification is worth having, surely it's worth investing a couple of years and the time and commitment to gain it.

Very happy to answer questions by PM from the OP or anyone else.

Ruth

Pross

Very good response Ruth. I think the kudos aspect as you call it can be key. People will pay a lot of money to the likes of David Lloyd who has a history of results in racing himself as well as coaching but will they really seek advice from a local 3rd cat with no coaching experience who wants £60 per month for them? It may well be that they are an excellent coach with a strong understanding of training principles but I think a lot of people will say that if they understood things that well why haven't they got better results themselves.

BeaconRuth

Pross wrote:

Very good response Ruth. I think the kudos aspect as you call it can be key. People will pay a lot of money to the likes of David Lloyd who has a history of results in racing himself as well as coaching but will they really seek advice from a local 3rd cat with no coaching experience who wants £60 per month for them? It may well be that they are an excellent coach with a strong understanding of training principles but I think a lot of people will say that if they understood things that well why haven't they got better results themselves.

And therein lies a big dilemma, Pross - this is a really tricky one and I think I'm just about to argue it from both sides :

Of course you don't have to have performed at the highest level to be an extremely good coach - and yet many people simply are drawn to a coach who was a top performer because they think they must be able to pass on good advice - which does not necessarily follow at all.

People forget that you have to have more than your fair share of genetic talent to perform at the top level so just because someone hasn't made it beyond 3rd cat doesn't mean they've been doing everything wrong and they've no idea how to train. However, if someone has been a very good rider then I guess that could be evidence that they do know how to train effectively (although, actually, it doesn't prove anything and even if they have the knowledge, are they able to communicate it well? Also, are they truly interested in working with you even if your level of talent is not in their league? ).

Basically, if you're a prospective coach who is not a (current or former) top performer then you probably will have to work much harder to demonstrate your coaching ability and build a good reputation in order to make a living from it. It can be done but you will need to either be extremely good at coaching or extremely good at marketing yourself - but preferably both.

Personally I draw on my own experience all the time and this quote from a rider I coach is quite telling: "There are times when I start a training session I don't know whether my legs will get me through but its almost surreal the way the sessions are structured that you know how my legs will react/recover." The reason I have that surreal knowledge is of course that I've been through it all myself and I really don't think I could do the job if I hadn't.

Ruth

mattshrops

The thing i would like to add from a none coaches perspective -but someone who has been self employed- after you've nailed all of the above you've still then got to work your ass off , chasing enquiries, making contacts networking, etc etc. The self employed forget when bank holidays are, work when other people are in their leisure time(presumably especially in this area) Oh and i nearly forgot be prepared not to make any money for at least a year or so. Not trying to be negative but realistic, as long as you know what to expect, then good luck to you.

Alex_Simmons/RST

Pross wrote:

It may well be that they are an excellent coach with a strong understanding of training principles but I think a lot of people will say that if they understood things that well why haven't they got better results themselves.

I think most professional coaches will have performed to a reasonable standard themselves in the sport so they understand the nature of the events and its demands but it is unrealistic to expect all good coaches to have been pro level riders. And a pro (or former pro) level rider may not possess many of the attributes a successful coach needs.

I know of more than one coach that had never ridden the track but has coached track riders to world championship wins, world records and world cup and Olympic success across several disciplines.

Many of my clients are far more talented/genetically blessed that I ever was/am. But my job is not to prove how good I am/was, rather to show clients the way to being the best they can be (given their individual circumstances).

Like Ruth, I draw upon my own experience in training and racing, such that it is rare that I ask a client to do something I haven't expected of myself at one time or another. It does happen though, as some simply have a far greater capacity for training load than I did or have event goals that I did not, so while personal experience is a helpful contextual guide it should not be a limiter to what is right for any given individual.

If I were looking at engaging a coach, then I would be more interested in their coaching palmarès than their riding achievements, organise to interview them, and speak with some of their clients about their experience.

Some coaches do get lucky, and have success despite what they do as the nature of the talent at their disposal is so high. In some respects their job is not to screw it up.

Alex_Simmons/RST

mattshrops wrote:

The thing i would like to add from a none coaches perspective -but someone who has been self employed- after you've nailed all of the above you've still then got to work your ass off , chasing enquiries, making contacts networking, etc etc. The self employed forget when bank holidays are, work when other people are in their leisure time(presumably especially in this area) Oh and i nearly forgot be prepared not to make any money for at least a year or so. Not trying to be negative but realistic, as long as you know what to expect, then good luck to you.

Correct. You are running a small business as well as delivering the service. That is hard work. It's the same for any small business delivering a professional service. You might be a great coach, but if you can't also do all the other business stuff well then it will be hard to be successful. I know USA Cycling in their coaching accreditation have courses specifically covering the business side of coaching.

It's also why we have worked to develop a coaching infrastructure support system so that coaches with us can focus on the coaching, and worry less about marketing and sales, client contracts, invoicing and payments, websites and documentation management, client communications systems and so on. It also means our team has a professional support network so that they can engage and discuss coaching matters, latest developments and learn from each other.