Body armour

gezebo

I was out riding today at a well know North East Wales trail centre I realised that nearly everyone was wearing body armour. Now I realise that wearing a helmet and gloves is pretty sensible but at what stage does body armour really become necessary ? For clarity the people I saw were riding the imo overgraded 'black' run.

I've been riding for years and remember riding the dh tracks up in clwydians on rigid bikes!

I guess the point of my 'rant' is are mtn bikers just becoming a bunch of fairies who like dressing up like soldiers or are people genuinely pushing the boundaries of mtn biking? I suspect the former.

TheNorthernTrain

Not everyone can afford to take time off work with injuries that could well be avoided by wearing protection ;-) Yes, when I wear it, I feel completely over the top but I don't get sick pay... So for me I don't really have the option, 99.99% of the time I won't come off, or if I do I don't need protection but for when I do - I'm covered.

Secondly, it personally gives me a bit more confidence to do stuff I wouldn't or go faster on certain bits. On one of my local routes there is a drop that I just bottled every time until I went out without knee pads on... now I hit every time, pads or no pads.

gezebo

I take your point about time of work etc...

I suppose I take the view that mtn biking is about taking risks and we are reaching the stage were bikes are so well developed that they hide the poor technical skills of riders who can now rock up at a trail centre and get round a black run in their commando gear and not really experience the challenge or consequences of messing up.

Now I'm not saying that people should go out and hurt themselves but it seems to me that that's people are missing out on the real meaning of mtn biking -adventure, challenge, self reliance etc and are just doing it as its fashionable and 'the' thing to do and part of the image of this is wear armour etc to look the part and it all appears to be a bit ott.

dhobiwallah

gezebo wrote:

....... not really experience the challenge or consequences of messing up.

Now I'm not saying that people should go out and hurt themselves .........

It seems like thats exactly what you are saying :?:

1mancity2

Im all for wearing body armour, I have come off a few times and hurt my shoulders with armour on, I know if I didn't have the armour I would have broken something so worth it.

Like you say "wear a helmet" why? to stop head injuries so why not wear armour to stop body injuries.

diy

north-sure wrote:

Secondly, it personally gives me a bit more confidence to do stuff I wouldn't or go faster on certain bits. .

Which probably over compensates for the safety benefit. I do think there is a market for more xc oriented protection, perhaps something on the level of the basic protection found in cheap motorbike gear. At the moment its DH oriented protection or pretty much nothing.

dan shard

I wear body armour every time I go out. Knee/shin guards, elbow, a sub gear top and full face helmet. To be quite honest I couldnt care less what anyone thinks of me wearing them at a trail centre and if someone makes a comment I'll repsond accordingly..I think any heros that feel the need to comment about it are obviously missing the point of mountain biking which is getting out and enjoying yourself and the great outdoors, screw what anyone else thinks. If I wanted a day out posing I'd walk around town head-to-toe in Vivienne Westwood..

Personally Id rather wear armour and reduce the chance of me having to take time off work, and months off my bike..but I cant help reading posts like this and translating it as "ooh everyone look at me, Im sooo tough"..

miss notax

gezebo wrote:

I was out riding today at a well know North East Wales trail centre I realised that nearly everyone was wearing body armour. Now I realise that wearing a helmet and gloves is pretty sensible but at what stage does body armour really become necessary ? For clarity the people I saw were riding the imo overgraded 'black' run.

I've been riding for years and remember riding the dh tracks up in clwydians on rigid bikes!

I guess the point of my 'rant' is are mtn bikers just becoming a bunch of fairies who like dressing up like soldiers or are people genuinely pushing the boundaries of mtn biking? I suspect the former.

Hmmmm. Like others have said, I can't afford to take time off work and nor do I particularly want to smash all my teeth out, break any more bones or end up covered head-to-toe in scars from MTBing.

I also think your comments sound a bit arrogant actually.... Are you really THAT good a rider that you can 100% guarentee that you won't slip on a root, skid on mud, get whacked by another rider etc etc? Those silly little things that no-one can forsee? Skill gets you a very long way in MTBing but I still think there's that 1% of 'fluke accident that no-one expected'. That's precisely why it IS exciting!

I just like riding bikes, and it makes me happy to see lots of other people riding bikes too. If I or they choose to wear hear-to-toe body armour, ride unusual bikes or whatever then fair play - I really don't care

Stu Coops

I do XC and Trail Centres and some XC I do in Brecon and Dartmoor is qiute demanding on me and the bike but I personally don't wear it and I do take falls regurlarly and hurt myself regurlarly, obviously I wear the usual lid and gloves but always considered Body Armour for the DH Loonies. The reality in my opinion is if you want to wear it wear it and who cares what others think as looking back I wish I had elbow or knee protection on times

.blitz

gezebo wrote:

..at what stage does body armour really become necessary ?

Basically when you become tired of pinging off trees, using your elbows as brakes and are clean out of MTFU.

If you are riding regularly and want to keep riding regularly you have to look after yourself.

Mojo_666

I first ride mtb's before most people wore helmets, these days I have helmet and light pads (661 Evo) but for long rides drop the pads. I have also just acquired full face/armour and hard shell pads due to getting a full sus but will only wear the armoured gear on DH days, It's nice to have options and it is nice to know you can do the riding you want and feel safe doing it..I also work for myself and don't get sick pay, I am also on the hunt for personal insurance.

Pudseyp

gezebo wrote:

I was out riding today at a well know North East Wales trail centre I realised that nearly everyone was wearing body armour. Now I realise that wearing a helmet and gloves is pretty sensible but at what stage does body armour really become necessary ? For clarity the people I saw were riding the imo overgraded 'black' run.

I've been riding for years and remember riding the dh tracks up in clwydians on rigid bikes!

I guess the point of my 'rant' is are mtn bikers just becoming a bunch of fairies who like dressing up like soldiers or are people genuinely pushing the boundaries of mtn biking? I suspect the former.

What do you actualy "mean" by body armour....I doubt that everyone was wearing it....body armour to me is pressure suits and hard body armour. Knee and elbow pads are just protection.

You may be a weirdy beardy on your hard tail, but MTB'ing is now for the masses and like any sport technology has given us better bikes that enable the rider to ride a hell of a lot faster over more difficult terrain, hence why protection is much more important. Old racing car drivers used to have leather helmets...gedit ? if someone called me a fairy for wearing knee pads on the trail...whilst I would be going home with my knees intact and they would be going home with a bloody nose.

Raymondavalon

I see very few people wearing pressure suits to be honest
However I do wear knee and elbow pads, but if I were to embark on a Black run I would seriously consider a 661 Pressure Suit or similar, as at my age, irrespective of my riding skills, I don't bend any more, I break bones.
Prevention beats cure and if some judgemental cheeswand wants to look down upon me because I am "overkilled" with safety gear, then so be it.

miss notax

gezebo wrote:

I guess the point of my 'rant' is are mtn bikers just becoming a bunch of fairies who like dressing up like soldiers or are people genuinely pushing the boundaries of mtn biking? I suspect the former.

Just re-read the original post and this bit made me chuckle. I am certainly NOT ever 'pushing the boundaries of mtn biking' but I am on a regular basis pushing my OWN boundaries and challenging myself to ride things that I have never ridden before. I'm pretty certain that most of my riding buddies would agree with this too.

I have entered the 2012 Megavalanche and in an attempt to prepare myself for it I have started doing some DH runs. I'm slow and probably quite rubbish, but I am managing to ride most of it even though I am so far out of my comfort zone it's unbelieveable. I am on the hunt for a pressure suit / jacket or whatever you call it for some added protection. I'm pretty sure that won't make me one of the bunch of fairies as i'm personally pushing myself far harder than I ever thought possible.

And i'll stop rambling now (hey, it's Christmas week and I don't have much work to do)

Stu Coops

Pudseyp wrote:

gezebo wrote:

I was out riding today at a well know North East Wales trail centre I realised that nearly everyone was wearing body armour. Now I realise that wearing a helmet and gloves is pretty sensible but at what stage does body armour really become necessary ? For clarity the people I saw were riding the imo overgraded 'black' run.

I've been riding for years and remember riding the dh tracks up in clwydians on rigid bikes!

I guess the point of my 'rant' is are mtn bikers just becoming a bunch of fairies who like dressing up like soldiers or are people genuinely pushing the boundaries of mtn biking? I suspect the former.

What do you actualy "mean" by body armour....I doubt that everyone was wearing it....body armour to me is pressure suits and hard body armour. Knee and elbow pads are just protection.

You may be a weirdy beardy on your hard tail, but MTB'ing is now for the masses and like any sport technology has given us better bikes that enable the rider to ride a hell of a lot faster over more difficult terrain, hence why protection is much more important. Old racing car drivers used to have leather helmets...gedit ? if someone called me a fairy for wearing knee pads on the trail...whilst I would be going home with my knees intact and they would be going home with a bloody nose.

Northwind

You just have to weigh up the advantages and disadvantages. Frinstance, I almost never ride without my Kyle Strait kneepads- the advantages are obvious, knees are delicate and exposed. The disadvantages, well, not much really. Slightly warmer knees. And it's an extra expense, and an extra bit of kit to drag around/look after. But they don't have any negative effect on my riding at all, except when I forget to clean them or I let dirt get inside anyway)

But then you've got your pressure suits, which offer more protection but also rack up the disadvantages- I don't even like to wear mine for pushing up, it's pretty much uplift only.

Some people get a bit arsy about this but really, kneepads are no different from helmets. In fact, knees are more vulnerable than heads, and there's less ambiguity about the protection offered by kneepads.

Also people get fixated on serious injuries... Now I doubt mine have ever saved me from a broken knee. But, I guarantee they've saved me from sore knees, spoiled rides, time off the bike, and general grumpiness and moaning. Bargain.

diy wrote:

At the moment its DH oriented protection or pretty much nothing.

Don't really agree with this... Lots of XC kit out there- loads of pedallable kneepads, soft elbow pads, etc.

dan shard

delcol

if you lowered your 4ft tall seatpost, took off your spds and replaced them with flats, stoped wearing lycra,

then you would ride faster and there for push your limmits and perhaps you would see why people wear protection..
who knows you might just like feel of neoprene on your shaved legs... :shock:

DodgeT

Reminds of a few weeks ago up gisburn. We were playing on the top of the hope line, but a niggle is people always seem to stop right in the middle of the big area by the picnic bench, ie. just where you want to ride to get a run into the top of the line.
So, I politely asked the guys to move to the side so as we could carry on doing what we were doing, only to get a bit of a jibbing, saying i'd best be good now i'd been bigging it up etc (???) comments about gear, i had full face and pads on.

So, I keep hitting the jumps minding my own business.

When they left, they just pootled over the lumps ever so gently... Then a bit later, just to amuse me a bit more, we caught up on them at homebaked where there's a nice little rock garden. They got off and walked down it. We just waited, then rode down it casually.

So, I guess the op falls into a similar category of these guys, ie you dont need pads and stuff to do mtb'ing...

Or, if you actually want to have a go at stuff and still get up for work the next day, then pads and stuff can be a good idea. (unless your Danny Hart of course then you probably dont need them)

Horses for courses and all that

Squarepants

miss notax wrote:

I have entered the 2012 Megavalanche

B1tch!

In the absolute nicest and non offence sense of the word with no grey area that I actually mean that mailiciously

Me and the boys are entering hopefully in 2014 - I demand a full write up from conception to reflections. I suspect that will be a whole other thread though.

Meanwhile, back on topic. I ride armour on DH days (armour jacket) so what..

ilovedirt

I wear my kyle strait knee pads pretty much all the time. Wore them at Llandegla the other day, nowt wrong with that. If I have a crash (I do it quite a lot, I tend to push myself a lot), then I usually end up landing on my knees, and hardpack/rocky trail centre surfaces aren't particularly forgiving. The pads are lightweight and I don't notice them. I also just wear them for general warmth, I can't really afford a 4 season riding wardrobe, so shorts and knee pads have to make do all year round. I hope the OP will forgive me. (And the fact that I tend to overtake a lot of the all-the-gear-no-idea folk on the climbs on my mini downhill/freeride bike, and rinse them on the descents gives me great joy too )

I also wear a wrist brace no matter what I'm riding, as I've injured my left wrist a few times as I tend to land on that particular wrist most of the time when I crash. Again, anyone got a problem with that? I think not.

It does irritate me a little when people turn up to trail centres kitted out for downhill though, full face helmet, pressure suit etc, and then puff and pant at any sign of a climb because they're over-laden with protective gear (a full face isn't needed at any trail centre IMO). I've only ever really needed mine while riding downhill, as it tends to be steeper, and the potential for going over the bars and landing on your face is far greater (it's saved my teeth a fair few times). But hey ho, that's their decision.

S-M

Been riding again since around may-june after 16-17 years off, clocked up around 1100 miles now.

Main injury's so far.....

Dislocated shoulder
Dislocated hip
Multiple smashed ribs (probably 3)
Suspected fractured wrist bone of some type.

All of the above were done just wearing a normal MTB helmet (not a fullface)

I am considering some body protection myself, its either get the gear on, or stop going daft trying to learn how to fly through the air again.

Now i have spent most of my life as a self employed chap, but due to our wonderful country and its recession, that all came crashing down faster than me the last time i tried to remove some body parts.

In my new/current job, i can not take time off, well i could, but if i score more than 50 "bradford points" in a year, my new (no longer a temp) contract is null and void and i`m out of the door, if i get a poor apraisel, then i do not get my next pay rise (an extra 5.5% on top of everybody else for the next 5 years)

What this means in real terms?

I was due my apraisel soon, i dislocated my shoulder, i had 2 days off work then went in to try and please my superiors (it worked) i got back into it, pure hell by the way, i was put on "light" duties which were still hell, this is no office job, but the pay after 5 years will be decent for the area, i got my good apraisel and i am guaranteed my payrise at the end of this month (works out at 7%) but two months later i cabbaged myself up again, this time i did not dare take any time off, i went into work with a dislocated hip and a smashed up ribcage, super light duties this time, i was put on a job that basically greases up headrest plugs for car seats, basically just standing in the same spot all week putting plugs on a machine, while a collegue lifts full/empty boxes for me, i dropped a few on the floor, i could not pick them up, couldn't walk properly, even getting in the car to drive to work was a nightmare, putting on my uniform was hell, even the walk in from the car park was like torture, imo i should not have been at work, i was totally fucked up, but what can you do in this day and age? I have bills, i have a house, the car is paid for so that's not so bad, but i`m still paying off my old business overdraft LOL!

When i was my old boss i would have taken time off work and paid the staff overtime to cover for me, i can no longer do this

I went from having my own little empire where i had some sense of self worth and satisfaction, to back down to a factory mong, i cant afford to mess up the factory mong thing as nowhere else around this area will pay me the same wages, and my self employed skills don't really account for diddly squat when you are working for somebody else, trying my hardest to climb up somebody elses ladder, and its not half as much fun as climbing your own.

Not sure that body gear would have prevented any of my injurys so far apart from the ribs, and they were not so bad to be honest compared with the hip, i only noticed the wrist once the ribs and hip calmed down a bit

Stu Coops

S-M wrote:

Been riding again since around may-june after 16-17 years off, clocked up around 1100 miles now.

Main injury's so far.....

Dislocated shoulder
Dislocated hip
Multiple smashed ribs (probably 3)
Suspected fractured wrist bone of some type.

All of the above were done just wearing a normal MTB helmet (not a fullface)

I am considering some body protection myself, its either get the gear on, or stop going daft trying to learn how to fly through the air again.

Now i have spent most of my life as a self employed chap, but due to our wonderful country and its recession, that all came crashing down faster than me the last time i tried to remove some body parts.

In my new/current job, i can not take time off, well i could, but if i score more than 50 "bradford points" in a year, my new (no longer a temp) contract is null and void and i`m out of the door, if i get a poor apraisel, then i do not get my next pay rise (an extra 5.5% on top of everybody else for the next 5 years)

What this means in real terms?

I was due my apraisel soon, i dislocated my shoulder, i had 2 days off work then went in to try and please my superiors (it worked) i got back into it, pure hell by the way, i was put on "light" duties which were still hell, this is no office job, but the pay after 5 years will be decent for the area, i got my good apraisel and i am guaranteed my payrise at the end of this month (works out at 7%) but two months later i cabbaged myself up again, this time i did not dare take any time off, i went into work with a dislocated hip and a smashed up ribcage, super light duties this time, i was put on a job that basically greases up headrest plugs for car seats, basically just standing in the same spot all week putting plugs on a machine, while a collegue lifts full/empty boxes for me, i dropped a few on the floor, i could not pick them up, couldn't walk properly, even getting in the car to drive to work was a nightmare, putting on my uniform was hell, even the walk in from the car park was like torture, imo i should not have been at work, i was totally farked up, but what can you do in this day and age? I have bills, i have a house, the car is paid for so that's not so bad, but i`m still paying off my old business overdraft LOL!

When i was my old boss i would have taken time off work and paid the staff overtime to cover for me, i can no longer do this

I went from having my own little empire where i had some sense of self worth and satisfaction, to back down to a factory mong, i cant afford to mess up the factory mong thing as nowhere else around this area will pay me the same wages, and my self employed skills don't really account for diddly squat when you are working for somebody else, trying my hardest to climb up somebody elses ladder, and its not half as much fun as climbing your own.

Not sure that body gear would have prevented any of my injurys so far apart from the ribs, and they were not so bad to be honest compared with the hip, i only noticed the wrist once the ribs and hip calmed down a bit

You familiar with the phrase War & Peace :roll:

dusk

I never used to wear armour and never had a bad crash/injury for 20 years but things change. I did have a bad crash in March and I don't want the sort of injuries I got to happen again. I have also seen some nasty injuries happen to people I've been riding with which makes you think.

I would also say that since switching to a Trek EX8 from a Secialized Rockhopper that I can ride a hell of a lot faster so the potential for injury has vastly increased and the Fox Launch pads I have don't get in the way or hamper my riding so I'm far happier to be wearing it now where I didn't previously worry.

S-M

Stu Coops wrote:

You familiar with the phrase War & Peace :roll:

No.

Anonymous

Last time I did Aston Hill without body armour my ribs took nearly 6 months to stop hurting entirely. I did go with a full face however.

Oh, and a month off work I had earlier in the year thanks to busting my back cost a lot a money as a contractor not getting paid for that time off. That wasn't even doing DH though!

Whilst I'll just wear knee pads and regular helmet for normal stuff I do, the proper DH stuff is getting full face and chest, neck and spine protection. Chest to stop me busting the ribs up yet again (a dozen or so times in the last ten years and getting fed up of it), and neck/spine having realised how bad a back break could turn out. If only Superman had found the cure before he died.

And Mega may be on the cards and certainly this stuff will be a requirement unless I want to take it slow and walk down most bits like a pussy. First things first before that though. A lot more experience and skills for a start!

It's not that you need the protection and sure you can take whatever risks you like. It's just in sometimes ManningTFU and dealing with the injuries gets tiresome, if not expensive.

delcol

you some kind of middle class tory voting snob..? :P

why do you refare to it as factory mong.. and what is wrong with being as you put it a factory mong...


and body armour wont stop you breaking your ribs.. they still break with body armour..

Northwind

delcol wrote:

and body armour wont stop you breaking your ribs.. they still break with body armour..

It may stop you breaking your ribs- yes they can still break with body armour (it doesn't stop all injuries) but it could make the difference between a break and not. Ribs are tricky though since it tends to be your own momentum that breaks them rather than the thing you hit.

Muttly1981

ilovedirt wrote:

I wear my kyle strait knee pads pretty much all the time. Wore them at Llandegla the other day, nowt wrong with that. If I have a crash (I do it quite a lot, I tend to push myself a lot), then I usually end up landing on my knees, and hardpack/rocky trail centre surfaces aren't particularly forgiving. The pads are lightweight and I don't notice them. I also just wear them for general warmth, I can't really afford a 4 season riding wardrobe, so shorts and knee pads have to make do all year round. I hope the OP will forgive me. (And the fact that I tend to overtake a lot of the all-the-gear-no-idea folk on the climbs on my mini downhill/freeride bike, and rinse them on the descents gives me great joy too )

I also wear a wrist brace no matter what I'm riding, as I've injured my left wrist a few times as I tend to land on that particular wrist most of the time when I crash. Again, anyone got a problem with that? I think not.

It does irritate me a little when people turn up to trail centres kitted out for downhill though, full face helmet, pressure suit etc, and then puff and pant at any sign of a climb because they're over-laden with protective gear (a full face isn't needed at any trail centre IMO). I've only ever really needed mine while riding downhill, as it tends to be steeper, and the potential for going over the bars and landing on your face is far greater (it's saved my teeth a fair few times). But hey ho, that's their decision.

I've had two over the bar moments at trail centers this year 1st at Llandegla in april on the freeride section, hit the table after the bridge drop without knee pads that left me with a broken thumb and mangled knee that kept me off work for two weeks and off the bike for 8 weeks lucky i was wearing my full face or i'd have probably broken my jaw as i landed chin first. The second was at Glentress in August with knee and elbow pads again with the full face, the jaw peice took a hit but i walked away injury free apart from being winded and throwing up in my helmet.

If i'm riding XC i'll wear my open face and 661 Veggies but for 99% of trail center riding that involve jumping i'll opt for the full face with pressure suit reserved for DH

miss notax

Squarepants wrote:

miss notax wrote:

I have entered the 2012 Megavalanche

B1tch!

In the absolute nicest and non offence sense of the word with no grey area that I actually mean that mailiciously

Me and the boys are entering hopefully in 2014 - I demand a full write up from conception to reflections. I suspect that will be a whole other thread though.

Can't quite believe that i've entered, it seemed a good idea a month or so ago but now it's just making me feel sick thinking about it! :?

And I fully intend to wear every conceivable form of body armour for it (and possibly bubble-wrap myself too )!!!

Northwind

Go down the course beforehand and tape pillows to all the rocks

Dead jealous here too, can't justify the money next year but I really want to do it one of these years...