Mud, Sweat and Gears 2012

VWsurfbum

So by that logic i'm a Jedi Master?

bigdawg

yep... 8) What were you last year sport??

Ive only just realised the race is an hour later, I kinda liked the 1pm starts, 3pm finish and home by 5... :?

VWsurfbum

I have fired off an email, asking why? about all the time issues i have with it?
I'll post up the reply.

Bigdawg i was a Warrior then a racer? Sport in Gorrick.

VWsurfbum

Matt has a good fast response! I like.

Matt wrote:

Hi Ian



We’ve moved the start time back for the Sport, Master, Vet, Grand Vet and Elite/Expert categories 1 hour to 2pm so to allow us more time for the Under 12’s race (starts at 12:30pm (2011 – 12pm)) and prize presentations. Also it allows some practice time for the afternoon races which we have to provide. We had a big problem with adults riding the course whilst the Under 12’s were racing last year which is a big no no. The morning race start time has remained the same.



Your suggestions for start times are interesting but cause some difficulty as the Under 12’s must race on their own and the course has to be altered (in an ideal world we’d have a separate course) and marshals redistributed, this all takes time and man power. We push the rules at the minute allowing the Youth and Juveniles to race with the Open category.



The morning races will be finishing approx 11:45 that gives us 45mins to change the course and redistribute the marshals including feeding and watering them. Under 12’s finish at 1pm giving us 1 hour to again alter the course, move marshals (lunch break), prize presentations and allow practice. Afternoon races finish at approx 3:45pm prize presentation ASAP after finish.



Should you continue to race the Open race (1 hr approx) then your daughter can enjoy the coaching session followed by the race. In reality the podium presentations for the morning races will be straight after the Under 12’s race (1pm a similar time to last year).



We’re going to run with this format for the first event and evaluate after.



Thank you for your comments I really do appreciate them.



Kind regards



Matt Ewings

Cycling Development Officer

2012 Legacy and Strategic Sport



Essex County Council | mobile: 07879 117437 | email: matt.ewings@essex.gov.uk

---

From: Robinson, Ian P
Sent: 01 February 2012 16:54
To: Matt Ewings
Subject: MSG timings



Hi Mat,

Hope you had a good off season?



Why on earth is there such a late start on the 2hr race? That practically takes the whole Sunday out of contention?

I know when I was doing the hour races I could be home by late lunch, but now doing the 2hr I cant do anything in the morning and I wont be able to do anything in the afternoon?

Surely it would be better to have the 2 hr race first ting 9 or 10 (probably 10 to allow for practice etc) then the 1hr races (and kids) at 12:30 or 1 then the people who get podiums etc can all be dealt with in a reasonable time? I don’t see why dragging the event out over the whole day is going to achieve? I was going to bring my daughter to force her into racing this year but I cant have her sitting around all this time???



[/rant]



Anyway I’m sure I said to you before, if you need a hand setting up the courses or general stuff just drop me a email or see me online

evo3ben

To be honest, times aren't really a bother for me. If anything will give me more time in the morning to organise myself rather than rushing around for an early start. And the family wont moan at me for the early start anymore lol.
Saying that, i can understand what people are saying. Matt seems to be a very decent and efficient person with regards to his emails and reply’s and i am sure that if anything needs to be changed after the first round, he will ensure its sorted.
I am presuming that the format has changed because it needs to be run under the BC rules and regulations. Because of this i can understand what Matt is saying in his email with regards to separate races for certain age groups and the time frame there is to get everything organised.
Matt emailed me this morning to say there had been a typo on the site. 'Sport' did say 19-39 yesterday but was meant to say 19-29. This has resolved my confusion over the categories and will definitely be entering the Masters cat 8)

bigdawg

so who's training already..?!?!

VWsurfbum

Now I have a working bike im trying to get out as much as I can. Hard to do 2hrs non stop, as a route I mean

bigdawg

ive taken a different approach this year - ride to work monday to friday (even today!) - 8 miles each way, straight no stopping, with a hill or two added and then at the weekend race simulation on the turbo for 90 minutes... (at 5.30 in the morning :shock: ) Come summer Ill be over the downs with the kids, but thats it...

VWsurfbum

I'll start doing the ride too and from work, but once it gets a bit lighter, plus I only have one set of wheels now which are tubeless so it'll be loads of faffing around. Might get a cheap commuter bike?

stylish

Stopped training for 2 weeks following aan operation, and doing light spinning on the turbo as i cant load myself or raise my heart rate too high, but i think that may well do me more good than the flat out sessions every week to be honest, after d2d i said i would slow it up a bit, but didnt, just piled on through, even riding twice a week at night on the road, which i quite enjoy as i am too far from home to ride to work.

I aim to be fitter and lighter, by the time MSG 1 comes along, as it will be my first race as a Veteran, and would like to carry over the form i had towards the end of last year, but more than anything i hope my race luck changes in 2012, no more broken mechs, crashes and chest infections........

Good luck everyone in 2012, and see you on the start line.

bigdawg

thats the 'theory' behind my plan, if I carry on 'racing' every week I should hit the ground running come the first race. As always though with this weather everythnig slows up a bit bewcause of cold muscles etc...

C0LL0

The whyte winter series is my training, as well as 3 hour sessions on the hadleigh downs on Monday mornings and 2 hours in belfares woods on Thursday nights, but have got used to 2 hour races, so don't raelly want to drop back down to a 1 hour race, but I can't waste all of my day off waiting around for a race so I will be doing the open class and be done before lunch.

bigdawg

what on earth do you do over the downs for three hours..?!?!

C0LL0

I've got a course in my head, so keep going around as if in a race, I rode from the big muddy hill at the castle end and ride criss crossing the park all the way to just behind the benfleet station and back, I usually do 4 or 5 laps depending upon how many dog walkers are about. It's easy to loose concentration and just ride which is where I have to stay focused, it works for me the winter series round 3 on Sunday I thought was fairly easy as thats the type of training I have been doing.

bigdawg

tbh over the down I only ever follow the firepath with a couple of detours off (after the horseshoe loop) to go up the hills to the highest parts, and do some of the downhill bits (from the top of the bumpy hill) - because of the race theyve put in a part of the course just off the horsehoe, I thought it was a down and crashed a couple of times trying it (rocks deliberately placed where your wheel will be!) but Ive sinced learned its an up! Next time om over there Ill give it a try, but it wont be till its warmer as Ill have the littluns with me...

I do love riding over there though...

anet367

There seems to be general confusion around the categories, even from MSG themselves. In an earlier post someone has detailed that Matt stated that re the Sport category the age range was a typo and should be 19-29, but Sport is actually an ability grouping not an age grouping. From the BC rulebook:

Senior From 1st January year of 19th birthday

All Male and Female Senior age riders, may be further categorised into ‘Ability’ groupings as follows: Sport, Expert and Elite.

From year of 30th birthday, senior riders without an ability category are classified in the following age bands:

Master From 1st January year of 30th birthday to 31st December year of 39th birthday

Veteran From 1st January year of 40th birthday to 31st December year of 49th birthday

Grand Veteran From 1st January year of 50th birthday to 31st December year of 59th birthday

Super Veteran From 1st January year of 60th birthday onwards

bigdawg

thats how sport always was 17 through 29, then masters....

always knew we should have gone back to the old way....

rocks in chair with slippers and cat on lap....

C0LL0

bigdawg wrote:

I thought it was a down and crashed a couple of times trying it (rocks deliberately placed where your wheel will be!) but Ive sinced learned its an up! I do love riding over there though...

I thought the same thing, couldn't see how you could ride up it till I saw them doing it.

Thats the end of my lap, ride up there drop down the bumpy muddy hill and turn right at the bottom and carry on over the grass bumpy track until the gravel and climb all the way on gravel track until nearly the end where you can drop left by the side of a gate and I start the grassy section of my lap still going west past the house in the park then turn and back along the tight single track with the tree roots (stiil catch me out they do) 25-30 minutes a lap depending upon walkers (I give way to them) but not many around on a cold and miserable monday morning

C0LL0

So has anyone entred yet??

evo3ben

From how i read it, it seems that on the BC site 'Sport' is the same class as 'Senior'. If that is the case im sure according to the BC site, age group is 19-39 even though MSG has it as 19-29 now. 'Masters' was only introduce in 2011 purely for those that wished to race in that specific age group. If you are between 30-39 you may still opt to race in the sport catergory. Below is what i have copied from the BC site:

Senior / Expert / Elite - When a rider reaches his or her 19th year then the Senior or Sport category is the appropriate aged based category. See below for how riders can attain Expert or Elite status.

Master - for riders aged 30 to 39. In Downhill Senior riders will default to Master on reaching their 30th year. In Cross Country, Sport riders will continue to be classified as Sport unless they elect to ride in the Masters category. This change was introduced for 2011 in recognition of the high standard of competition in XC Masters racing, to allow an extra category option for those in this age group.

The last thing i want to do is enter the Masters cat and be totally out of my league. According to the MSG site, if you are 30-39 your only option is Masters :?

As for training, i have been following the Joe Friel training plan since october and using the Thetford winter series as training races. I have just finished my Base period and now into the build period. This should set me up nicely for the first race and then peak for the second. Well, we will see lol

evo3ben

Ah hold it a sec... I have just checked the MSG site again and the age for 'Sport' is back to 19-39. Checked my emails and Matt has said that he needs to contact BC and clarify the age group for sport. I take it he has clarified this thus why back to 19-39 8)

ollie51

bigdawg wrote:

and then at the weekend race simulation on the turbo for 90 minutes....

90 minutes on the turbo? There must be something wrong with you...

bigdawg

nah it's easy, providing youve got a tacx fortius... 8)

4 laps of a world cup mtb course, with the turbo automatically adjusting the resisitance when you hit hills etc..., and you can either save what youve done or download other racers 'rides' to the computer so you can then add opponents - so every sunday I have my own race against 5 me's!

This is what Im seeing on the turbo, but I also have cadence, hr, power, incline showing as well as progress of oponents...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJdixeGg2Ps

bigdawg

this thing about the sport masters category etc... Back in time (ie the 90s!) there were fewer categories for adults - fun (as the name implied - just a bumble round for beginners people just wanting a bit of fun although still got silly cometitive!), sport (17-29), Masters (30-39), Vets (40-49), Grand Vets and then Elite (the silly fast guys!) - I think this is what MS&Gs is trying to get back to - its daft having two categories for the same age group both doing the same amount of laps (ie sport - to 39 and Masters 30-39)

VWsurfbum

bigdawg wrote:

so every sunday I have my own race against 5 me's!

I hope you win?

bigdawg

unfortunately not... The last three weeks Ive been within 15 seconds of myself on each race, and sit there going how the hell did I get up this hill so quickly last week

This week slight change of course, the German world cup course is very hilly, bit like langdon tbh, so sufferfest on sunday!

bigdawg

ok clarification re the cats courtesy of Matt (pointing out it was in the FAQs on the site!)

At regional level (MSG) the Sport and Masters categories are the same apart from the age eligible to race in them. The idea being that you can race against your piers and compete for prizes. If you DO NOT have a BC licence and are between 30 – 39 yrs you can choose to race in either. Should you fall between the 19 - 39 age range and have a BC licence you will automatically be a classed as a Sport rider, you have to request a Masters licence from BC. Be warned though if you select to have a Masters licence and intend on racing at National level the standard of competition is much higher than the Sport category.

The more I think about it quie a good idea as it can sometimes be a bit of a shock when people realize that there are still some very fast racers in the older categories...

ollie51

I'd go as far to say the top masters will be quicker than the top sport riders...

@bigdawg - that turbo's awesome... and bloody expensive! I struggle to do more than an hour of intervals...

bigdawg

yeah it is expensive I bought the base model about 12 years back for £300 and then just added to it with the software and stuff - tbh Ive prob paid over the years what a new one costs but for me now it means I get to train and spend all weekend with my kids at weekends...

Oh and if you think the Masters are quick check out the times of some of the vets :shock:

stylish

I have been using the Tacx Flow for the last 3 years, and quite like the look of the vr headunit for it, but i think i have used all my spending credits for a while after buying a new road bike......

I suppose if you can race yourself on the laptop, it makes it less boring than looking at 4 walss as i do in the garage, i try and make my rurbo sessions really hard and intense so they only have to last an hour, as i get bored being in one place, after all the humble bicycle is a mode of transport, and riding it in one place seems odd to me!