Sold dodgy wheels

SLX01

I purchased some built to order hand built wheels off ebay. Promised 10 day delivery but eventually after several emails arrived after 3 weeks. Fitted them to the bike and went out for test ride and it was awful the bike was wobbling all over the road.
I got back after riding less than 1km and checked the wheels and 30% of the rear wheel spokes are now loose and the spoke retaining nuts on the mavic UST rims are only finger tight and can be unscrewed by hand is this normal? The front wheel is slightly better with no loose spokes but isn;t straight. I have emailed the shop and got told the boss is away until next week I'm livid is there anything I can do apart from demand a full refund which I wont get until the end of next week if they agree? I'm so angry the whole transaction has been a nightmare from the start and now this!

1mancity2

Take them to your LBS and have them looked at and get there opinion, but they should be trued and tensioned correctly.

Its the hassle of sending them back etc that can really get to you, before you know it no wheels for weeks.

SLX01

1mancity2 wrote:

Take them to your LBS and have them looked at and get there opinion, but they should be trued and tensioned correctly.

Its the hassle of sending them back etc that can really get to you, before you know it no wheels for weeks.

I was considerig that but I feel a bit annoyed at paying another £40 to put right something that I paid nearly £400 for.

paulbox

I would just send them back, you're not going to be happy with them.

cooldad

Ebay/Paypal have a very simple disputes process, and you will win. Use it. End of.

jayson

Its reasons like this that i always buy wheels from Merlin, handbuilt still but atleast i know they'll be great quality and well built for that money.

Giraffoto

The situation that you've described should be impossible with a properly made wheel - it sounds more like you've got a wheel at the "built" stage but not yet tensioned or trued. Take it to your bike shop, have nothing more to do with the seller and leave appropriate feedback on eBay and on here

SLX01

Giraffoto wrote:

The situation that you've described should be impossible with a properly made wheel - it sounds more like you've got a wheel at the "built" stage but not yet tensioned or trued. Take it to your bike shop, have nothing more to do with the seller and leave appropriate feedback on eBay and on here

That was my thought I think I will go with this advice, Merlin will cost me £60 extra for the same wheels plus there is the time spent messing about. I think I will spend the extra money and get them re built at a LBS.

delcol

jayson wrote:

Its reasons like this that i always buy wheels from Merlin, handbuilt still but atleast i know they'll be great quality and well built for that money.

not in my experience the ones we got from merlin had to be constantly trued and rebuilt twice the third time we binned the rim and got a new wheel built up reusing the pro 2 hub, by a shop in whistler...

MountainMonster

delcol wrote:

jayson wrote:

Its reasons like this that i always buy wheels from Merlin, handbuilt still but atleast i know they'll be great quality and well built for that money.

not in my experience the ones we got from merlin had to be constantly trued and rebuilt twice the third time we binned the rim and got a new wheel built up reusing the pro 2 hub, by a shop in whistler...

If you got them trued 3 times and it still happened, either the person truing them is terrible, or the parts were faulty. Should have contacted merlin.

Mojo_666

jayson wrote:

Its reasons like this that i always buy wheels from Merlin, handbuilt still but atleast i know they'll be great quality and well built for that money.

+1

recently got some from merlin and am super pleased with price, service and quality.

Markmjh

jayson wrote:

Its reasons like this that i always buy wheels from Merlin, handbuilt still but atleast i know they'll be great quality and well built for that money.

Had a few sets from them over the years and ALWAYS been happy. Never had an issue with a wheel from there

delcol

MountainMonster wrote:

delcol wrote:

jayson wrote:

Its reasons like this that i always buy wheels from Merlin, handbuilt still but atleast i know they'll be great quality and well built for that money.

not in my experience the ones we got from merlin had to be constantly trued and rebuilt twice the third time we binned the rim and got a new wheel built up reusing the pro 2 hub, by a shop in whistler...

If you got them trued 3 times and it still happened, either the person truing them is terrible, or the parts were faulty. Should have contacted merlin.

maybe i wrong with the retrued bit,, the spokes kept coming loose and the wheel wobbled, the spokes were tightend back up by a guide in whistler who is a compitant wheel builder,, the spokes came loose again this resulted in 3 or 4 spokes being replaced.. then same happened again...
again 3 or 4 more spokes were replaced (different spokes) the 3rd time it happened we were adivesed to swap the rim out anhave a new build, (as the shop said it will probably keep happening having to replace 3 or 4 spoke a time.). so that what we did
so either it was a clever marketing ploy by the shop or the merlin wheel was faulty. either way it been fine since it was rebuilt with a new rim and spokes by the shop in whistler.

EdW

Take them to your LBS and have them looked at and get there opinion, but they should be trued and tensioned correctly.

Also find out how much it'll cost to get them put right. Then tell the seller & ask them for a partial refund to cover this cost, with the threat of sending them back for a full refund at their cost if they refuse.

jayson

Thats odd cause ive had 4 sets of wheels from merlin and the only problem i ever had was on the last set and a spoke snapped in the rear wheel, my LBS replaced it, checked the tension and it was good as new.

Personally i wouldnt buy wheels from anywhere else, i know people have good experiences from a few different places but i feel the quality of service and price from merlin make them the best for me atleast.

SLX01

OK been to LBS who were very helpfull but refused to fix the wheels. They said the wrong size nipples had been used (too short), alloy nipples used instead of steel, wheels had bent spokes and the nipple retaining nuts should have been loctited which they weren't, front wheel not straight, rear wheel not tensioned. They said the best thing was to send them back as I never should have paid money for them and they are dangerous!!

supersonic

What exactly was your wheel build? Spokes/nipples/hubs/rims?

maybe i wrong with the retrued bit,, the spokes kept coming loose and the wheel wobbled, the spokes were tightend back up by a guide in whistler who is a compitant wheel builder,, the spokes came loose again this resulted in 3 or 4 spokes being replaced.. then same happened again...
again 3 or 4 more spokes were replaced (different spokes) the 3rd time it happened we were adivesed to swap the rim out anhave a new build, (as the shop said it will probably keep happening having to replace 3 or 4 spoke a time.). so that what we did
so either it was a clever marketing ploy by the shop or the merlin wheel was faulty. either way it been fine since it was rebuilt with a new rim and spokes by the shop in whistler.

This sounds like a bent rim. Why the builder insisted on replacing spokes and retensioning is beyond me, hes should have told you that from the start.

memsley89

Have you got the shops eBay user ID handy?
Just so we all know to avoid them in the future!

SLX01

memsley89 wrote:

Have you got the shops eBay user ID handy?
Just so we all know to avoid them in the future!

http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/life3140/

I have checked the Mavic website and the LBS are correct 16mm nipples should have been used along with loctite, so the claim on their website to be 'The UKs premier wheel builders' is laughable.

supersonic

Can you list your build for us?

SLX01

supersonic wrote:

Can you list your build for us?

MAVIC XM819 UST Disc rims,
HOPE PRO2 EVO Dis hubs
DT SWISS stainless black spokes

The Spiderman

I`d have a word with the builder first and tell them what your lbs said,and see if they will remedy it. If they`ve cocked up and admit their fault,you`ll get them fixed for free and they may even compensate you for your trouble.

Not many shops will want their reputation sullied,on bikeradar......

mrmonkfinger

Is loctite a UST requirement?

SLX01

The Spiderman wrote:

I`d have a word with the builder first and tell them what your lbs said,and see if they will remedy it. If they`ve cocked up and admit their fault,you`ll get them fixed for free and they may even compensate you for your trouble.

Not many shops will want their reputation sullied,on bikeradar......

Thats a good idea but I already had to wait 3 weeks for something I was told would take 10 days including wasting 3 days waiting at home for an alledged next day delivery parcel, I have had to waste time going to my LBS, waste time taking off the tyres and brakes, waste time waiting until next week because the manager is apparently on holiday or something before they can deal with it, then waste more time waiting for it to get collected and returned, then there is the issue of them sending me wheels that clearly could have collapsed and seriously injured me. There is little they can do to compensate me for the complete balls up they have made of the entire matter really!!

supersonic

You definitely need to contact the retailer again, as the build is not adequate. Is worth noting that 14mm nipples work fine, 16mm is just the 'recommended', as say is 12mm for the XC717 (when you can use others). Depends on the builder. I agree that the inserts should be bonded, but again, some builders do not like using it.

Did you ask for alloy nipples?

EDIT: don't get another shop to touch them: you could invalidate your warranty and have no chance of a refund.

SLX01

mrmonkfinger wrote:

Is loctite a UST requirement?

When the spokes are in place in
the hub and the rim tighten the
threaded eyelets in the rim by only
turn of 360°

Once this is done use
a spoke lock on the
eyelet (type Loctite®
243 or equivalent)

http://www.mavic.com/sites/default/file ... ims_07.pdf

SLX01

supersonic wrote:

You definitely need to contact the retailer again, as the build is not adequate. Is worth noting that 14mm nipples work fine, 16mm is just the 'recommended', as say is 12mm for the XC717 (when you can use others). Depends on the builder. I agree that the inserts should be bonded, but again, some builders do not like using it.

Did you ask for alloy nipples?

EDIT: don't get another shop to touch them: you could invalidate your warranty and have no chance of a refund.

Is does state use 'exclusively' 16mm nipples that to me sounds like it doesn't mean use what you like? The nipples used are too short and the LBS couldnt even get his spoke key on them as they are so far inside the rim. I did ask for coloured nipples but was not advised that they are not recommended and if the wheels were ok I could have lived with them. But the combinatuion of bent spokes, short nipples, loose spokes, untrue rims on top of a 2 week delay takes the biscuit.

supersonic

But 14mm work fine, just look it up - 12mm are tight. Coloured nipples are alloy 99% of the time, as are anodized.

You certainly have rights though for a poor build, and I wouldn't be happy. State the nipple concerns too, but they'll just say the same as me. Unless they used 12mm ;-)

1mancity2

Did you pay with paypal?

If so speak to the seller tell them your opening a claim until the matter is settled, that way paypal takes the money and holds it until the claim is either, closed or resolved, but the seller will not hang around sorting the wheels or resolving it another way.

Make sure you do all your communications through ebay so they can monitor what is being said.

SLX01

supersonic wrote:

But 14mm work fine, just look it up - 12mm are tight. Coloured nipples are alloy 99% of the time, as are anodized.

You certainly have rights though for a poor build, and I wouldn't be happy. State the nipple concerns too, but they'll just say the same as me. Unless they used 12mm ;-)

It says in the manual use exclusively 16mm, it also says failure to follow instructions will invalidate warranty so 14mm may be ok but there is no logical reason to use them without my instruction and they probably invalidate the warranty. I have just checked and they are 12mm anyway so I don't see they have any excuse at all. As for the loctite the nuts are not even the correct torque I can undo them with my fingers. I am just so angry no just because of the inconvenience but because these people are selling wheels that could seriously hurt someone.

supersonic

No, they have no excuse with 12mm. Your rights are with the retailer, so if they build this way, it is on their head, and your consumer rights entitle you to a repair or replacement. Mavics warranty is an addition to your rights. You may be entitled to a refund given the short time that has passed. Any remedy should be done in 'reasonable' time, so is another area I would pursue them with.

I know is nconvenient, but I wouldn't let them get away with it. A rebuild will be very costly.