Calories and Lactic burn
Cleat Eastwood
Posts: 7,508
Can anyone explain the connection, if any, between calorie intake and lactic build up. If I eat X amount of carbs will it put off the build up or will the build occur anyway at a given rate, ie is it biological and beyond outside control. And if it can be controlled what's the most effective way to build up a tolerance to it. Ta muchly.
The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.
0
Comments
-
Lactate is an effect of how hard you ride not how much cake you eat. Not eating enough cake (or similar ) will result in running out of energy eventually and having to slow down.
The point along the scale of agony where lactate builds up to a point where it becomes a problem varies between individuals and is very trainable.
This point is called threshold and all threshold training is intended to move your threshold closer to you rmaximum cycling capability. I think intervalls like 2 x 20 are considered threshold training, but also shorter harder intervals with incomplete rest have similar effects.0 -
Lactate Threshold is not influence in anyway by calorie consumption. It is the point at which the production of lactic exceeds your bodies ability to break down the lactic. To improve the point at which this occurs (Lactate Threshold) you need to exercise slightly above your current Lactate Threshold (e.g. the 2*20 mentioned above). Exercise too far above LT and you'll actually target your VO2 max and not your LT.
ut_och_cykla > Surely shorter harder intervals with incomplete rest are more aimed at improving VO2 max?0 -
Training adaptations are on a continuum with intensity, they are not discrete to level.derbygrimpeur wrote:ut_och_cykla > Surely shorter harder intervals with incomplete rest are more aimed at improving VO2 max?0 -
Alex > Sorry, not quite sure what your point is, can you explain a little clearer? My understanding is that training to improve VO2 max and LT are done at two different intensities. If you are in the VO2 zone, you will gain some LT benefit but will not be able to exercise for the same duration as if you exercised at the LT level (which is generally lower). The point being, if you want to specifically increase LT, you should train just above LT for longer than you might if you were training VO2.0
-
derbygrimpeur wrote:Alex > Sorry, not quite sure what your point is, can you explain a little clearer? My understanding is that training to improve VO2 max and LT are done at two different intensities. If you are in the VO2 zone, you will gain some LT benefit but will not be able to exercise for the same duration as if you exercised at the LT level (which is generally lower). The point being, if you want to specifically increase LT, you should train just above LT for longer than you might if you were training VO2.
My understanding is that as Alex says there is no cut off point between one and another level of training. On your way up to doing VO2 intervalls (say 4:4 minutes)you will probably spend several minutes 'passing through' the LT level, training it by default so to speak. Moreover an improvement in the VO2 max will mean that you can exercise harder before reaching your limits. You won't have made yourself more tolerant - just fitter!
As a total amateur I've had a lot of improvements just doing one focused session of each a week , which for me provided me with good improvements for a total of 2-2½ hours a week of turboing.0 -
derbygrimpeur wrote:Alex > Sorry, not quite sure what your point is, can you explain a little clearer? My understanding is that training to improve VO2 max and LT are done at two different intensities. If you are in the VO2 zone, you will gain some LT benefit but will not be able to exercise for the same duration as if you exercised at the LT level (which is generally lower). The point being, if you want to specifically increase LT, you should train just above LT for longer than you might if you were training VO2.
Page 20More problems but still living....0 -
yes, you're correct in what you're saying, you will get some LT benefit, I've not said otherwise. But you will not get as much as if you specifically trained your LT by exercising for longer, but at a marginally lower intensity.
It depends what event you're training for. Short events = VO2. Longer than an hour = LT (whilst VO2 is useful, LT will have a bigger influence on performance).0 -
amaferanga wrote:derbygrimpeur wrote:Alex > Sorry, not quite sure what your point is, can you explain a little clearer? My understanding is that training to improve VO2 max and LT are done at two different intensities. If you are in the VO2 zone, you will gain some LT benefit but will not be able to exercise for the same duration as if you exercised at the LT level (which is generally lower). The point being, if you want to specifically increase LT, you should train just above LT for longer than you might if you were training VO2.
Page 20
link doesn't work for me (probably due to crappy work IE browser)0 -
The link is to a document about training with power and that page shows the adaptations that occur from training at various levels. You'll find similar in good exercise physiology textbooks (e.g. by say Astrand & Rodahl).derbygrimpeur wrote:amaferanga wrote:derbygrimpeur wrote:Alex > Sorry, not quite sure what your point is, can you explain a little clearer? My understanding is that training to improve VO2 max and LT are done at two different intensities. If you are in the VO2 zone, you will gain some LT benefit but will not be able to exercise for the same duration as if you exercised at the LT level (which is generally lower). The point being, if you want to specifically increase LT, you should train just above LT for longer than you might if you were training VO2.
Page 20
link doesn't work for me (probably due to crappy work IE browser)
Here's a link to an old blog post of mine which graphically represents the same information, i.e. most adaptations occur from training at most levels (above recovery):
http://alex-cycle.blogspot.com/2008/01/ ... ining.html
The levels highlight which adaptations occur at a greater rate per unit of training time (they are descriptive, not prescriptive). But remember that most adaptations occur from training at most levels. e.g. it's possible to increase VO2max without ever training at levels above threshold. And just because you are doing "VO2max interval work" doesn't mean you are not improving threshold power, or working on basic endurance.0 -
-
Thanks, that makes sense. But if all training was equally effective, there'd be no need to do anything other than just ride steady. But it's not. Whilst you get some benefits from most training, if you're specifically looking to increase LT then you will be most effective in doing specific LT focussed work. This comes back to my point about what event you're training for. If you're preparing for a 50, 100 or 12hr then your never likely to get near your VO2 max so you don't need to be too concerned about developing that (but I'm not saynig that it's completely irrelevant). You would see better improvement in performance by working on aerobic capacity and LT (for the 50/100).
If you're looking to optimise your performance in your club 10 as well as the odd 50 or road race, then the "all round" approach you mention makes perfect sense.
The OP was asking a question specifically about LT and the best way to target LT is not by short very hard efforts, but longer sustained efforts at a slightly lower intensity.
I agree with what you're saying, but I'm just approaching this from a slightly different angle (I think).0 -
Soy Sauce has lots of lactic acid in.... so don't have a chow main the night before the etape!0
-
"so don't have a chow main the night before the etape"
But would it be OK as a starter??0 -
ready2burn wrote:Soy Sauce has lots of lactic acid in.... so don't have a chow main the night before the etape!
Well I live and learn, never knew that!
With regard to lactic threshold (also known as OBLA - Onset of Blood Lactate Accumulation, and Anaerobic Threshold), on average it starts to occur around 80-90% of maximal heartrate though it can be as low as 65-70% for less fit individuals. Easiest way to establish this without a monitor is to note how hard you are working when you start to get breathless. The breathlessness is another indication that the body is unable to get enough oxygen to work.
Ideally, you want to maximise this, according to studies (including Weltman 1995) by training at the point of OBLA or slightly above it. Your point of OBLA will increase more rapidly than an increase in VO2max. Train at a point below breathless until you are comfortable, then increase the workrate slightly so that you become breathless. Hold it at that level for 3-4 minutes, then ease back for the same period. Work in this 1:1 ratio for around 6-8 intervals of each before cooling off. Probably easiest to train on a roller rather than hitting the road, given the inconsistencies of weather/hills/junctions/traffic etc.
As your lactic threshold increases, you will find yourself being able to go faster for longer.0
