climbing the alp d'huez

reacher

hang on , i said i do 100 rpm in the gym , i have no idea what i do on a road bike , obviously not that as you have pointed out and to be fair i can see your point now , except that i ride on a 53 at the front 11 on the back , i dont see what all the fuss is about , i dont do this for 50 k as i have already stated , but i do ride like this , its realy not that hard to do for me , i come from a sports back ground , started when i was 13 years old , not cycling , which i'm new to and took up only this year , or late last year to be exact, pushing that gear realy is not a strain on my knees at all , its not evan difficult to do for me , it feels like any other gear on the bike , but i can tell you now i can motor along at some speed ,for sure i cant hope to compete , age is against me so i train for fitness thats all , this climb is just a goal to help me concentrate on the job in hand , my primery aim at my age is fitness and well being ,
how long i could keep that up for on a 53 x 11 i dont know maybe after a few years on the road quite a while i expect , the improvement has , to be fair , been quite dramatic ,
what you have to take into consideration is that not every one has normal strengh legs mine are no where near a normal persons not evan close ,

reacher

any way as i said its academic , i will have a hard enough job to do this climb at any pace without worrying about what speed i can ride on the flat on , i'm more interested in hill climbing anyway , that for me is what i like , its hurts like hell and rips the guts out of you , riding on flat roads holds very little interest or no interest for me , thats why i hardly ever ride on the flat anyway .
when i was told i would need a 28 thats what got me worried that it was a hugely difficult incline , thats all ,

oldwelshman

reacher wrote:

but i train at 100 on a top of the range ( so i'm guessing it would be reasonably accurate) spin bike , but if these bikes are accurate then i dont pedal on the road at any where near as slow as 65 or 85 , as i find the road work a lot easier to do ,

I responded the way I did due to the quote you made about not riding as slo as 65 or 85 and as I said even if you do only 85 that would be 30mph presuming you have a 50 chain ring.
By the way using the same gear at 65 rpm gives 22mph approx which is far more plausable so you may be between 65 and 85 I guess on flat sections.
It is obvious that you currently prefer using big gears which is obviously up to you.
To be honest I have never even used a 50 x 11 either racing or training and never found a need for it but there seem to be quite a lot of beginners who seem to need it for some reason
Anyway, it will not hurt to have a 28 tooth casette handy because with the continental climbs such as the alpe it is not the gradient that makes it hard, it is the length of the climb and the heat you may encounter that make them difficult and how hard you try to ride it. If you attempt to ride it like a typical UK climb and go off too hard you will suffer very early. Take it easy and gradual and you will have no trouble, hopefully But if you grind up on a big gear you may struggle with muscle fatigue and cramps, so may be good idea to have some gear in reserve.

ThatBikeGuy

11-26 should be fine, for you and your daughter. That's what i use and i rarely go into the 26 unless i am on some seriously steep gradients (25%+). Doing longer rides with plenty of climbs would be very beneficial, lake district being very good for that.
By the sounds of it you both seem to be in pretty good shape already and any extra training needed would be hill climbing to get used to the gradients etc.

forward_loop

It would be a shame to spend time down there and not do some of the other (and in most cases more beautiful) climbs. Just stick a 28 on the back - it will give you both the confidence to just ride it and not worry about anything else. If you want to break records (time trials up the alp every thursday in the summer iirc) take a few other cassettes
As others have said though - constant climbing uses different muscles so ease yourself into it. Nothing compares in the UK to either climbing - or descending the alps imho.

If you do grind the gears <70rpm in the uk you would be well placed to try and up your cadence though for the trip if nothing else - - or your knees WILL suffer progressively as you get older if you are pushing a 50 - 11 - AND putting the pressure on.

Bert Grabsch (sp) I think has the slowest cadence in the pro peleton at the moment - he sometimes pushes a 56 up front at 70rpm - but he aint no hill climber.

cougie

Newbies tend to pedal 60-70 rpm.

Pros cadence is typically 85 or so. You do the math.

I first rode it years ago when I was cycling lots and I was lighter on a 39 x 26. Went back a few years ago and used a 27 on the back and used that too.

If I was riding it now I'd be on a compact.

If your daughter regularly rides at 22mph on the flat she should be on some performance plan. Or get her computer calibrated.

1_reaper

Don't know if this helps but if you can borrow or knows someone who has a Tacx Fortius and has the Alp d'huez RLV that would give you a pretty good idea of how easy/hard it is. People who have used the RLV and done the real think say there timings for it are not that far apart. obviously taking weather conditions into account

reacher

all good advice and thanks , the aim of the question was to turn up with the correct gears for the job in hand as quite rightly pointed out we will have no experiance of this type of climb and want to get this right before we go as we willl only get the one go at it , the other question that we were worried about was could a girl climb this , it appears yes as long as she prepares properly , all thats required is that she can do it with out stopping , time is not important for her , just getting their with the correct kit on the bike as i will train her on the rest , enough to go up the climb anyway in one go
i take all the points on board and the advice is very wecome ,
she is very fast on the flat , more than i would have believed , but lacks power on climbs at the moment , its not important anyway as she has no designs on being a cyclist just uses it to keep fit and to accompny me on my bucket list of climbs

james-m-h

i did it on a full sus mountain bike with a normall mountain bike rear casete, i think it was 34-11 and in the middle chain ring. so if you wanted to you could buy a cheap mountain bike casset and stick it on your road bike giving you a bigger gear choice/ratio just make sure you get the right speed as they are all happily interchangable i believe and youll spin right to the top

malcolmfrost

The pros are now using a much greater number of sprockets, Contador used a 32 this year http://road.cc/content/news/36163-giro-tech-contador-goes-apex. The advantage is that you can stay close to your ideal cadence (whatever that is) at steeper gradients. I proved that (to myself at least) this year. At the Marmotte 2010 I didn't finish, this year I did in a Silver time. I didn't do anything significantly different training wise, but changed my cassette from a 27 to a 30 from IRD. I didn't need to stop going up any of the climbs, unlike the 3 or 4 on the Telegraphe and 6 or so on the Galibier the year before. My natural cadence is around 90.
WRT Alpe d'Huez, just don't go out too fast, the first 3 ramps are the steepest, after that just keep going and you'll be fine. There are some much nicer climbs in the area, my favourite is up to Villard Reymond via the road to Col d'Ornon. As long as A d'H and as steep but no traffic. Otherwise when you get to the top of Alpe d'Huez carry on past the Altiport to the Col de la Sarenne and back down to Bourg. The tourist office has a list of some others that have chip timing on.
Enjoy, it's great out there!

reacher

Ands wrote:

Yes, I'm female and I did it 3 times last year. I did it on a compact 12-27. I have to say, it wasn't really that hard at all - what makes it hard is how hard you go at it. My first ascent I just went up really comfortably, 2nd time went far too hard at the bottom and struggled at the top (vowed never again), 2 days later did it a 3rd time.

It took me 1hr 26min up to the TdF finish line.

I trained in the Peak District for climbing, but to be honest you can't compare a 3km climb with a 14 km climb - if anything, 14km is better as you can settle into a rythmn . In the UK, as I got stronger I started doing all my climbing without using the 27, and then not using the 25. I also did a lot of turbo work - increasing power at lactate threshold which I think really helped with strength.

It's not murderous and your daughter can ride faster than I can on the flat if she's doing 20-22mph (is that riding solo or in a bunch?)

right , just to clarify , its a boardman ladies , 48x34 it says on the front chain ring , but i can only count a 12x26 on the rear cassete , unless i have counted incorrectly , listening to all the advice i'm thinking it would be better for her to have an extra gear on the rear , can i just buy another cassette ? , the guy in halfords where i bought it was useless , he just seemed to think so , but said something about changing the chain , very vague
also looking at whats available for mine ,its ultegra , i have seen a 11x28 , but i wont be useing the 11 or evan the next one whats the best one for me ?
can i not get a 13 x 28 or something ,
also thanks for all the advice , its realy helpfulll , and we would plan on going up as many climbs as we can while we are out their

Lazarus

Soon as you hit the Alpe slam the bike into the easiest gear and sit out the first few ramps, then as you ride yourself into the hill gradually grab a gear back and later on do it again, Tried that this year and found the hill far easier, quicker and far more enjoyable. Still had those spare gears in the bag when i got to the top as well.

malcolmfrost wrote:

Otherwise when you get to the top of Alpe d'Huez carry on past the Altiport to the Col de la Sarenne and back down to Bourg.
Enjoy, it's great out there!

Have always said that's my favourite ride but it must be done in the opposite direction. The other side of the Col De Sarenne is quite simply stunning but the road can be sketchy at the top. If you do the ride anticlockwise you get to appreciate the beauty of an unblemished valley, where if you did it clockwise you would be busy flying down a valley road and missing all the views.