Boardman CX Owners Thread

apreading

I got mine on American Classic hubs with 32xD-Light spokes - beautiful wheels and really light. Went fot the AC hubs as I wanted the quietest possible so it was a toss up between those and the DT350 hubs, but the AC ones are lighter and quieter (albeit more expensive...). Have shed minutes off my local loops that I train on and I am less fit at the moment than I was last summer.

alexul

If I would want to upgrade to BB7, will I have to also change the cables and housings? Or is just a matter of swapping the calipers? Thanks.

fret

Hi Fret - just lost another 50g on some new handle bars and I think that pulls me below the magic 20lbs threshold now (excluding pedals). I seem to recall that you said in a previous post that you lost a lot weight by switching out the OE skewers. What sort did you go with as I may give that a go with my next bit of pocket money?

I can't recall, they were some Ti ones from China. I thought I would give them a go as they were cheap and if they failed then it wasn't much to lose, around £12.00 from memory. They look like these, but are black. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AEST-Road-Bik ... _525wt_732
And they're dirt cheap.

Another thing I will do is a Superstar or similar wheel upgrade and BB7 SL's when I have the cash as that's the best place to lose weight from. I reckon you can get down to 1500g or less a pair of clinchers.

I'm debating getting the same CF bars and stem as on my bike as they are only 215g, but I'm not 100% sure about off-road with them as there are still debates on how long carbon lasts,some say a year, but Orbea give 5 year warranties, so who is correct? Alloy is just as light too to be honest in many cases and the pros still use it.

brassnipple

apreading wrote:

I got mine on American Classic hubs with 32xD-Light spokes - beautiful wheels and really light. Went fot the AC hubs as I wanted the quietest possible so it was a toss up between those and the DT350 hubs, but the AC ones are lighter and quieter (albeit more expensive...). Have shed minutes off my local loops that I train on and I am less fit at the moment than I was last summer.

Nice - I went with DT 240s Hubs and Sapim CX Ray spokes. Likewise very light and smooth running, but have no experience with AC hubs so no idea how they compare. Cant say enough good about the H plus Son rims though - they are just perfect for freeroad / CX type duties.

brassnipple

fret wrote:

I'm debating getting the same CF bars and stem as on my bike as they are only 215g, but I'm not 100% sure about off-road with them as there are still debates on how long carbon lasts,some say a year, but Orbea give 5 year warranties, so who is correct? Alloy is just as light too to be honest in many cases and the pros still use it.

To be honest it was more of a ride quality thing with my switching to CF bars. As you say not a lot to choose weight-wise between CF and alloy these days (only 50g difference in my case). I used a set of 5 year old CF Bontrager X-Lite blade's from my outgoing road bike to see if they made much difference as I was finding the Ergonova bars plenty stiff but a bit jarring, which was making my wrists ache on longer rides. The difference in feel was utterly transformative - a much smoother, yet sharper feel all round on the bars. I would never have believed the chalk and cheese feel unless I had tried the direct comparison myself.

I've never had a carbon bar or seatpost fail on me in either mountain biking or road cycling, so I'm a 'believer' - its just a case of being sensible and checking carefully if you crash a component badly. CF is typically stronger than alloy and gives better ride qualities, its just less resilient to kinetic energy form certain angles!

warren_s3

alexul wrote:

If I would want to upgrade to BB7, will I have to also change the cables and housings? Or is just a matter of swapping the calipers? Thanks.

I just swapped calipers and it was all good.

Search for BB7 set up guides on web as they're not quite as straightforward as the marketing bull states!

My bike is currently at 22lb 6 oz with pedals, but on Monday I have some Mavic Open Pro hand built wheels arriving from Harry Rowland which will be shod with Schwalbe 28c Durano tyres. I've also got some light tubes, to go in, so interested to see if I get anywhere near 21lb. Drivetrain is largely untouched other than front mech (105), so that's the only other tangible weight save opportunity when it wears out.

fret

I've decided to get the same carbon 'bars as on my road bike, then both are the same bend as I can tell as the Cannondale C1 that I had on the CX9. Superbly comfy, even on the drops. They have a flat aero shape on the top, which is quite comfortable too and enough room for lights and the suicide lever (which I may ditch as they rarely get used)

Anyway, look what arrived yesterday in the mail? Brand spankers off ebay for £65.00 Not a good pic, but it's SRAM FORCE.


Now just 4 components to go and then it's time for new wheels.

fret

Just weighed it on the work scales. 9.14kg, or 20.1lb in some obscure, obsolete measurement.
Still got the seatpost, 'bars, stem and rear mech to go and the suicide levers to remove.
I've worked out it will then weigh a mere 8.81kg/19.382 lb. I reckon on 8.5kg when I've done the wheels.

Burndust

well 2500 miles without a puncture...and i get 3 in 2 days....scary doubler yesterday when i flew over some falling debris...and another one on the rear this mornin...hope i havnt done my wheels....the back seems to be snaking under breaking a bit worried tbh

alexul

warren_s3 wrote:

alexul wrote:

If I would want to upgrade to BB7, will I have to also change the cables and housings? Or is just a matter of swapping the calipers? Thanks.

I just swapped calipers and it was all good.

Search for BB7 set up guides on web as they're not quite as straightforward as the marketing bull states!

Thanks for the confirmation. I was worried that in case the cables were too short I have to also change them, which is a little over my experience and going to a bike shop can be as expensive as the parts.

warren_s3

Replacement wheels have arrived, so I thought I'd peel the OEM wheels apart and do some real world checks to see what they're all about. First up was the rear wheel as there is more to be done with that.

Typical challenges including getting the cassette off. Chain whip and a long wrench was the order of the day, and it was off. Aim was to strip the wheel back to 'rim / spokes / hub / rim tape' and see what the damage was.


WHEEL: OEM Ritchey OCR Disc Rim / Formula Hub / Spokes(?) / Stan's rim Tape: 1129g


No surprises there, pretty much as expected. Quick release was out when I took this picture, so add another 63g for full weight.


CASSETTE: SRAM PG-1050 (11-32T): 299g



I took the cassette off, sprayed it with some Muc Off Degreaser spray, then ran it through sonic cleaner with some washing up liquid. Rinsed it off, put it all back together in order and whacked it on the scales. I'll be re-using it as it hasn't done significant mileage, and it saves changing the chain. Located back on making sure the spacers were in the right places (I tend to lift it off in a lump and keep it that way till it goes back on), then guesstimate 40Nm doing it back up (it's quite tight!)


BRAKES: Avid Clean Sweep Rotor 160mm (inc. 6 bolts): 132g



Again, another part being reused as it's as new. Slightly heavier than I thought, but does the job so won't be changing until it's worn out.


TYRES: Ritchey Excavador 35c: 365g

No picture here so you'll have to use your imagination. These tyres are actually quite a bit lighter than I expected. I'd purchased some spare Schwalbe Smart Sam 35c tyres from Chain Reaction Cycles in the sale a few weeks back and these are circa 525g. I've got some Schwalbe Durano 28c tyres on order from Bike-Discount.de which are quoted at 290g, so there is a potential 75g saving if you can accept the fact you have lost the ability to detour off on the hardpack. On that point I'm building the Ritchey's back up with Excavadors for winter / off road duties, and the Mavics will be Spring / Summer / Autumn wheels.


INNER TUBES: Chen Shing 700c: 124g



I've purchased some Schwalbe XXL tubes to replace the Chen Shing OEM tubes thinking for a few quid there could be a decent weight saving to be had given the small investment of cash (£15ish). I initially had no idea what the OEM's would weigh, and given the Schwalbe's quoted 99g per wheel I was hoping for about 50g per wheel. The reality is by the time you overlook the marketing bull the Schwalbe's are 103g, and the C-S's are 124g..... Unless you take leave of your senses and blow £40 (per tube) for Eclipse's 62g jobbies this is likely to make F-A difference so disappointing. Proof that Boardman didn't source the cheapest rubbish they could find.


QUICK RELEASE: OEM supplied (63g - Rear)

I do have a 22g Planet X Ti QR which I could use, but given the bike is running discs I've always been reluctant to switch from the OEM QR's as they must be under a fair amount of pressure (and the discs don't need any excuse to rub any more than they do!). The Novatec ones in the new rims are only 2g lighter than the OEM ones (at 61g), so again not much of a weight saving there.


COMPARISON - Overall weight saving (estimate): 278g (not including air)

So you get an idea of the comparison of the new kit I'm including a few additional photos of the new kit. Gives an idea of potential weight saving opportunities for those interested in that kind of thing.

Whilst the OEM wheels felt slightly unresponsive (slow to spin up), once at speed they always felt OK to me. Unlike MTB riding where you are more likely to have the bike in the air, my OCR's have only ever been bunny hopped up the odd curb, so I don't tend to feel the extra weight in them. However what has been promised from the new wheel build is a much better quality of ride (more responsive / less crashy / better feel). Until the new tyres arrive I can't confirm on if the hype delivers, but will be interesting to see the difference. You can certainly feel there is more tension in the spokes of the custom wheels (which have more pronounced butting along their length - Sapim Race).

I could have gone quite a bit lighter, but was advised against it given my riding style / weight (95kg) / use of discs rather than conventional brakes / long term durability. For instance I went for brass nipples instead of alloy as they tend to be more durable over time, and I didn't go for fancy aero spokes where you could feasibly achieve another 100g+ saving across both rims.

Some pics for context:

NEW REAR WHEEL: Mavic Open Pro / Novatec Hubs / Sapim Spokes / Brass Nipples: 949g (Excluding QR)







Not a tremendous difference in terms of rim girth, the Mavic is quoted as coping with 23mm - 32mm from memory, although on some forums I've read you can get away with quite a bit wider.

TUBES: SCHWALBE XXL Tubes: 103g



Just buy a few beers instead; an extravagance too far, and it seems Schwalbe's quoted figures are mainly fiction. Save your cash!

When the tyres arrive I'll weigh the entire wheel to see where it ends up fully inflated (I'd always assumed air would be 'for free', but in with an MTB tyre with 2.25 tyre / 26 wheel running 35psi you can add about 8g for air!)

I'm planning on doing the front wheel build later in the week, so more on that later (along with a brief review of first impressions of the ride on Saturday morning).

warren_s3

Was able to grab an unexpected lunch break today, and didn't need an excuse to switch front wheels over.

FRONT WHEEL: Ritchey OCR Disc / Formula Hub / Spokes : 924g (Excluding Quick Release)



Ritchey front wheel isn't the heaviest 29'er I've ever lifted given what it's build to tolerate, in fact the new wheel was only 121g lighter at 803g (exc. QR).



All the rest of the hardware (minus cassette) is the same as for the rear wheel posted above, so no point reposting. Durano tyres didn't arrive in the post so I've just bunged the Conti Ultra Race cheapo 28c roadie tyres on until they arrive.

So (assuming Durano tyres), this is how the weight savings stack up for the wheelset: 496g or 1.1lb - see table below:



3.7kg for the fully kitted out Ritchey factory wheel set against 3.2kg for the Mavic wheel set. On a 10kg bike you get the picture of just how much weight is rotating round the frame. Take a 1lb (450g) bag of sugar and whirl it about at arms length and it will give you some indication of the kind of weight reduction were taking about here.

Considering I took the conservative route of longevity rather than weight weenie, it gives you some indication of how much weight you can loose without trying too hard. The slightly cheaper Kinesis wheels would achieve much the same (for £250 from Winstanley's whilst they're in the sale), but I just fancied something a bit more 'bespoke' given I'm no flyweight. With a rangier budget, and carefully chosen rims / spokes / hubs (for a lighter rider) I think you could loose closer to 750g on wheels (1.7lb).

One other thing I thought I'd mention whilst I'm on a roll, the fork wedge expander on these bikes is a nightmare, and when I changed to the Pro stem the expander dropped into the fork steerer and needed a lot of coaxing out.

In case you're unfamiliar with what I'm taking about it plugs through the stem to lock the stem to the forks (and keep your steering straight!). Offending item pictured below:



I'd read on a few other forums that Specialized make one for their carbon forks that wasn't hugely expensive, so I went to investigate. Turns out their wedge is £5, and the top cap (if you don't have a spare) is £4. For £9 the clamping area is far superior to the crude elastic band / wedge version in our forks, and there is now no chance I'll be spending chunks of time fishing parts of wedge out the fork steerer. Here is a pic of the Specialized wedge:



Absolute weight parity unless you head off to source something like a Syntace cap, so no weight loss achieved here, just better function and form.

So what's the score? Basically I've made a few changes to the pretty much standard bike over the last 4 weeks and the bike was: 23 lb 2 oz. To my reckoning that weight was just too high given my MTB with dropper post and suspension forks was 23lb 6oz! So what has this little diet achieved? Today (with Conti tyres, not Durano's which will be lighter still), the bike weighed in at 21lb 10oz. Someway off of what's been achieved on here by some, so god only knows how I'd ever achieve anything close to 20lb which had been the target weight. I've revised that to 21lb and will be satisfied with that for summer spec!

BEFORE:


TODAY:


With the Durano's I'll hopefully be someway to 21.5lbs, then subsequent changes to drivetrain may nick the remaining half pound back in check.

Didn't get time to ride it, but should get time to head out tonight and give it a couple of miles (if the BB7's play ball and true up as the rear one is playing up since the wheel change :x

And finally how she's looking now:

warren_s3

And finally....!

I've been doing some weighing of bits coming off the bike in the last few weeks. Any numbers listed in black have been weighed on my own home scales, numbers in red I've poached off of the net, anything I can't find is ??? (feel free to offer up if you have them). Thought the weight table maybe useful for people considering upgrades:



EDIT: Just remembered
CBoardman Seatpost clamp: 31g

brassnipple

Hi warren_s3 - some great info in there, thanks for taking the time and trouble to post all the details. A real help for the rest of us.

The OEM wheelset is, as many have us have already discovered, VERY heavy - and definitely the best place to start with any upgrades / weight saving as it has the biggest single effect on ride characteristics.

More than a few ideas in there for me as well in terms of dropping a bit more weight, enjoy your new ride!

Burndust

nice one warren.....well mines is back at halfords....reckon theres def sonething up with my rear wheel....no punctures in 2500 miles then 4 in a week....def not right....now bikeless until the middle of next week....

fret

Very useful info. Especially the wheels weight, which ties in with the 2100g or more according to many posts I have read on the 'net.
And the OEM weight is scary, especially as they quote 10kg on the web. Hey may have been VERY conservative as the CX-PRO weighs exactly the same, despite a lighter groupset.
Although what is this antiquated, obsolete lbs lark?

I reckon I can get mine down to 8.5kg or maybe 8.4 without spending a great deal, just the wheels really at £400-500
Was yours weighed with or without pedals? The claimed weight is without.
Is the S3 bit on your handle to do with a certain 3 cylinder motorcycle?


Burndust, are you sure it's not the tyre or rim tape rather than the wheel?

Burndust

yeah fret considered that...asked the guys at halfords to check...but the reason i think its the wheel is it just doesnt feel right in the corners feels kinda loose..suppose that could still be the tyre right enough...hate not havin my bike...might be an ideal time for a wheel upgrade...quite fancy those mavics above

warren_s3

fret wrote:

Very useful info. Especially the wheels weight, which ties in with the 2100g or more according to many posts I have read on the 'net.
And the OEM weight is scary, especially as they quote 10kg on the web. Hey may have been VERY conservative as the CX-PRO weighs exactly the same, despite a lighter groupset.
Although what is this antiquated, obsolete lbs lark?

I reckon I can get mine down to 8.5kg or maybe 8.4 without spending a great deal, just the wheels really at £400-500
Was yours weighed with or without pedals? The claimed weight is without.
Is the S3 bit on your handle to do with a certain 3 cylinder motorcycle?


Burndust, are you sure it's not the tyre or rim tape rather than the wheel?

Weight measured above was with Shimano XT SPD's (345g). Went with them as they're familiar and work with MTB shoes. Not lightest.

S3 in handle is carry over from Audi forum! No way the bike was 22lbs from factory, I'd guess closer to 23 before pedals.

warren_s3

A few more pics of weighed stuff; I'll add to this post as and when I peel anything else off during servicing / replacement:

apreading

I guess that the biggest weight saving now might be in the cranks? How much can be done (sensibly) in that area???

fret

147 grammes if you go SRAM RED
179 grammes if you go FSA K-FORCE

I have just gone to a SRAM FORCE and saved 132 grammes

A useful tool as the current listings are now for 11 speed, not 10. http://www.totalcycling.com/component-weights.html

And then ceramic bearings weigh less as well.
And cyclocross 46/36 or 46/34 combinations will make that even lighter.

I initially weighed mine when the first and second weight loss programmes started with the pedals. Shimano SP520 SPD's at 380g, so when I take that off the weight it comes down quite a lot.

warren_s3

Good to hear there is so much scope in the cranks as I was starting to scratch my head for much more benefit.

I'm too 'robust' for carbon bars, I'm not going lighter on rims or tyres, so drivetrain is last area to save. Was tempted with carbon Romin saddle, but as I held it in my hand I just couldn't square something that light having a lifespan!

When I do drivetrain I'm going to go whole hog and switch to SRAM S-700 hydraulic levers and ditch the BB7's as whilst they brake fine they're just tedious to set up and require regular attention. Likelihood is, whilst I'd originally wanted to go for Ultegra, I'm going to be stuck with SRAM again. Wouldn't be going Red, more likely Force.

Does anyone know any rear mech alternatives to the Apex mid-long cage. Can you use MTB XO?

fret

SRAM Red and FORCE both have WI-Fli.

warren_s3

Just switched to Continental Supersonic inner tubes (50g). Another 100g gone.

Be interested to see if they leak much. With Durano tyres it's now down to 21lb 2oz or 9.58kg.

That's the end of the journey till something goes pop.

jamieayres

Quick question for the CX owners. Has anyone not got on with the 20mm layback seat post? I have just got a small CX, and despite not being a complete hobbit at 5'7", I find myself having the seat pushed forward with about 10mm till hitting the max marker.



Any reason not to get an inline seatpost for both aesthetic, and adjustability reasons? For the record, on road it isn't too bad, it's when I am off road it feels a bit weird being perched further back than feels 'right'.


...also, just to double check, the seat post is 31.6mm?

fret

31.6, check (thumb up smiley)

Whatever feels best is probably best, or get a bike fit from your LBS. Try a shorter handlebar stem.
Is that just an optical illusion, or does your saddle point down? A saddle should be dead horizontal.

Just got back from a 26 mile jaunt around the South Downs Way. Took 2 1/2 hours :oops:
It felt more like 126 with the claggy mix of wet loose chalk and whatever else. One "road" beat me and I had to walk carrying the bike as it just clogged up (remember to remove mudguards next time) :oops:
I fitted the OEM wheels and tyres and averaged a mere 6.6mph until I hit the last bit of road for home, where I lost 3 road bikes and overtook a Colnago on the bike that by then was filthy and had bits of grass and leaves sticking out of everywhere and the rider (me) was also covered in mud & chalk.
OEM tyres coped with everything that was thrown at it, even when it was spinning on the wet chalk. Had a couple of moments when I hit some wet roots, but didn't fall off. One momentous bit was coming down the side of Butser Hill where the grass is nears as dammit billiard table smooth and I hit 30mph. Top speed limited by lack of suspension and, more importantly, the ageing and unskilled pilot of the bike.

Bike is now clean and has the road wheels back on. Chalk takes forever to remove and is also highly abrasive. It has rubbed the paint away on the seatstays by the bridge. :x
Still, it is good training for the Wiggle Fallen Leaves event in December that I have entered.

fret

MUDGUARDS AGAIN.
So, we're all pretty much in agreement that the best mudguards for normal road use are the SKS Chromoplastics. Width varies from post to post. I use 35mm as they fit a 23 or 28 tyre fine and give just enough clearance for the OEM tyres..

But what about off-road? What do we use? For a CX bike there isn't a great deal of clearance really. Certainly less than on my old CAAD 9 CX9. I have used some cheap clip on type ones, but clearance still isn't brilliant. I prefer to use mudguards to save getting filthy
In fact, the P35's seem to still give the best clearance, but aren't quick release.

alexul

So I finally got the time to upgrade the brakes to the BB7 I ordered a while ago. Rear brake went fine, aligned very well, I feel them very strong pushing on the disc but I didn't have the time to bed them in so they feel kind of slippery. On the front brake it was a completely different business. First, BB5s have a barrel adjuster, BB7s don't and without it the housing came shorter by 1.5-2 cm. Maybe not much normally, but the front housing was already short. After a few weeks I got the bike the cable had already stripped the paint around the fork, where it was rubbing when turning the wheel. Now, when shortened even more it's even tighter. When turning even slightly it actually starts to break so there is no way I can adjust the breaks to be strong but not rubbing.
Funny thing is that the rear housing was originally too long, didn't like the big side way loop I had in front. Not it looks a little bit normal.
So over the weekend I spent some time reading about housing and cables. I didn't realize how important is to have them set properly. It seems that a lot of breaking problems and inefficiencies come from bad routing.

tincaman

Brake outers are cheap. so worth changing, I have found that I fitted the inline adjusters when I changed to BB7's but never used them, all the adjustment can be done on the calipers themselves, so will leave them off if I change the outers in future

alexul

Mine also came with inline adjusters but I already have some adjusters at the flat bar brake lever. I was taking into account to remove those levers and place the inline adjusters there but maybe in some future. I definitely need to change the front so I bought two outers with different lengths, just to have some to spare. I just don't know how to cut them. The LBS doesn't sell them, maybe I can convince them to cut the cable for me for free and also give me some ferrules. If not, what would be an alternative solutions for cutting? I don't want to buy some pliers just for the bike now and never use it again in years.