When it's rigid it slides on simple like!
Comments
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No you said "You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud)" there is a reason football/ruby players have spiked shoesDonDaddyD wrote:roger merriman wrote:DonDaddyD wrote:Rich158 wrote:SimonAH wrote:Sheldon has (deservedly) demigod status in the pantheon, however I disagree on the tread side of things.
Yes, tread on a car tyre is there for prevention of aquaplaning but on a bicycle (where this is obviously not a danger) it is there to complement the frictional grip of the rubber with mechanical grip where the tread interacts with projections on the riding surface.
If you always ride on biliard table smooth surfaces then a slick or a likely cut slick is going to win - in real world city surfaces then I think a modicum of tread is very advantageous.
I don't follow your logic here, the more rubber there is on the road the more grip you have. Any form of tread reduces the contact patch and therefore the amount of grip available. The mechanical grip you refer to just doesn't exist on the road, it's fine on soft surfaces but just doesn't work on tarmac. I've ridden 700x23 slicks almost exclusively for years on some of the worst roads arround in all weathers, even through snow and ice, and never wished I had something else
Yep.
Slicks on tarmac.
You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit.
Um mud and grass are where knobbly tyres shine and slicks really don't work well.
The rubber compound has a large part to play, mtb tyres partically downhill types use some very soft compounds, road tyres i don't think get any where as soft, persumably as the drag and wear would be horrific!
That's what I said.
:shock:
As for mud there are lots of mtb tyres just for that.0 -
roger merriman wrote:
No you said "You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud)" there is a reason football/ruby players have spiked shoesDonDaddyD wrote:roger merriman wrote:DonDaddyD wrote:Rich158 wrote:SimonAH wrote:Sheldon has (deservedly) demigod status in the pantheon, however I disagree on the tread side of things.
Yes, tread on a car tyre is there for prevention of aquaplaning but on a bicycle (where this is obviously not a danger) it is there to complement the frictional grip of the rubber with mechanical grip where the tread interacts with projections on the riding surface.
If you always ride on biliard table smooth surfaces then a slick or a likely cut slick is going to win - in real world city surfaces then I think a modicum of tread is very advantageous.
I don't follow your logic here, the more rubber there is on the road the more grip you have. Any form of tread reduces the contact patch and therefore the amount of grip available. The mechanical grip you refer to just doesn't exist on the road, it's fine on soft surfaces but just doesn't work on tarmac. I've ridden 700x23 slicks almost exclusively for years on some of the worst roads arround in all weathers, even through snow and ice, and never wished I had something else
Yep.
Slicks on tarmac.
You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit.
Um mud and grass are where knobbly tyres shine and slicks really don't work well.
The rubber compound has a large part to play, mtb tyres partically downhill types use some very soft compounds, road tyres i don't think get any where as soft, persumably as the drag and wear would be horrific!
That's what I said.
:shock:
As for mud there are lots of mtb tyres just for that.
Someone help me out here.
Slicks = road.
Knobbly tyres (of which include mountain bike tyres, cyclocross tyres and mostly any other tyre that has knobbly bits on it) = off road (extending beyond mud and grass).
I'm almost positive we are saying the same thing.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
DonDaddyD wrote:
Someone help me out here.
Slicks = road.
Knobbly tyres (of which include mountain bike tyres, cyclocross tyres and mostly any other tyre that has knobbly bits on it) = off road (extending beyond mud and grass).
I'm almost positive we are saying the same thing.
we are but i'm pointing out that your mild off road isn't Mud is serious (fun) stuff, try it with slicks and see how far you get.
even with grass add gradient or wet or just turns even on dry short grass slicks will let go quite early on.0 -
roger merriman wrote:DonDaddyD wrote:
Someone help me out here.
Slicks = road.
Knobbly tyres (of which include mountain bike tyres, cyclocross tyres and mostly any other tyre that has knobbly bits on it) = off road (extending beyond mud and grass).
I'm almost positive we are saying the same thing.
we are but i'm pointing out that your mild off road isn't Mud is serious (fun) stuff, try it with slicks and see how far you get.
even with grass add gradient or wet or just turns even on dry short grass slicks will let go quite early on.
Yes, but that's why I said "slicks = road" and previously "slicks on tarmac".
At no point did I suggest slicks should be used on any other surface and I justified that by adding knobbly tyres for off road. Even then I expanded on this logic by saying not just grass and mud.
I think you are being needless pedantic. There was nothing wrong or incorrect with what I said.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
DonDaddyD wrote:roger merriman wrote:DonDaddyD wrote:
Someone help me out here.
Slicks = road.
Knobbly tyres (of which include mountain bike tyres, cyclocross tyres and mostly any other tyre that has knobbly bits on it) = off road (extending beyond mud and grass).
I'm almost positive we are saying the same thing.
we are but i'm pointing out that your mild off road isn't Mud is serious (fun) stuff, try it with slicks and see how far you get.
even with grass add gradient or wet or just turns even on dry short grass slicks will let go quite early on.
Yes, but that's why I said "slicks = road" and previously "slicks on tarmac".
At no point did I suggest slicks should be used on any other surface and I justified that by adding knobbly tyres for off road. Even then I expanded on this logic by saying not just grass and mud.
I think you are being needless pedantic. There was nothing wrong or incorrect with what I said.
firstly chill
2nd yes what you posted was wrong,
your post is "You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit"
by adding in brackets "not just grass and mud"
you've changed the sentence from be fine and correct to a WTF?
I'm guessing you ment to mean not just park grassland etc.0 -
roger merriman wrote:DonDaddyD wrote:roger merriman wrote:DonDaddyD wrote:
Someone help me out here.
Slicks = road.
Knobbly tyres (of which include mountain bike tyres, cyclocross tyres and mostly any other tyre that has knobbly bits on it) = off road (extending beyond mud and grass).
I'm almost positive we are saying the same thing.
we are but i'm pointing out that your mild off road isn't Mud is serious (fun) stuff, try it with slicks and see how far you get.
even with grass add gradient or wet or just turns even on dry short grass slicks will let go quite early on.
Yes, but that's why I said "slicks = road" and previously "slicks on tarmac".
At no point did I suggest slicks should be used on any other surface and I justified that by adding knobbly tyres for off road. Even then I expanded on this logic by saying not just grass and mud.
I think you are being needless pedantic. There was nothing wrong or incorrect with what I said.
firstly chill
2nd yes what you posted was wrong,
your post is "You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit"
by adding in brackets "not just grass and mud"
you've changed the sentence from be fine and correct to a WTF?
I'm guessing you ment to mean not just park grassland etc.
OK:
1). Why is it when I disagree with people on here and or call them out, they immediately jump on the "DDD needs to chill" bandwagon. You are being pedantic, I don't need to be stressed and/or angry to tell you so.
2). I'm not wrong and here's why (and in the course of this explanation I will demonstrate why you are being pedantic).
3). I'm surprised that you cannot see that you are being pedantic especially as you admitted that we largely agree but then continue to tell me I'm wrong:
[/quote]Roger wrote:I wrote:I'm almost positive we are saying the same thing.
we are but i'm pointing out that your mild off road isn't Mud is serious (fun) stuff, try it with slicks and see how far you get.
4). You have completely misunderstood the use of brackets in my sentence. The phrase (not just grass and mud) in the context of the sentence I had written implies that there are other off-road surfaces where knobbly tyres are of benefit including grass and mud. The word "just" in that phrase qualifies this. It does not mean 'excluding grass and mud' or I would have written that. At no point in any of my posts have I written that slicks should be used off-road (which includes grass and mud).
Anyway let's dissect this:
Background
Sketchley posted the Sheldon Brown link: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html#hydroplaning,
SimonAH disagreed with this and Rich158 posted the following:Rich158 wrote:I don't follow your logic here, the more rubber there is on the road the more grip you have. Any form of tread reduces the contact patch and therefore the amount of grip available. The mechanical grip you refer to just doesn't exist on the road, it's fine on soft surfaces but just doesn't work on tarmac. I've ridden 700x23 slicks almost exclusively for years on some of the worst roads arround in all weathers, even through snow and ice, and never wished I had something else
I then responded by saying:I wrote:Yep.
Slicks on tarmac.
You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit.
a).
"Yep"
Widely accepted as the colloquial term for "yes", this indicates that I agree with what Rich158 had written.
b).
"Slicks on tarmac" Later I went on to say "slicks = road". This is the correct assertion for the type of bicycle tyre that should be used on tarmac.
My assertion of "slicks on tarmac" is in line with what Rich158 had written in detail.
I think we are both agreed that slick tyres are the appropriate tyre choice for a road bike being ridden on tarmac.
The above "Slick on tarmac and "slicks = road" clearly indicates that I am not, have not and at no point in this thread suggested that slicks should be ridden off road including, but not limited to, grass and mud.
c).
The counter-point to slicks on tarmac is that you need to use knobbly tyres for off-road which is what I wrote below, twice.
"You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit."
"Knobbly tyres (of which include mountain bike tyres, cyclocross tyres and mostly any other tyre that has knobbly bits on it) = off road (extending beyond mud and grass). "
Now, I'm not going to list all the types of off-road surfaces so the qualifier: (not just grass and mud) was used.
Roger, read these two sentences, then read them again, slowly. Lastly, get someone else to read them for you.
Then, can you for me demonstrate two things. (i) Where in the above sentences I have suggested that slicks should be used on mud and grass. (ii) Where in the above have I written that slicks should be used on mud and grass.
By placing the phrase "not just grass and mud" in brackets does not suggest that knobbly tyres shouldn't be used on grass or mud. Because within the context of the sentence it wouldn't make literary sense due to the use of the word "just". Had I meant that knobbly tyres shouldn't be used on grass or mud I would have written (not grass or mud) or not grass or mud minus the brackets.
The use of brackets does not remove the phrase within from the context of the sentence. Brackets can be used to 'ad-lib' within the context of sentence while largely not being a part of the actual sentence.
The reason why I said you were and are being pedantic is that there was nothing wrong with what I wrote - aside grammar and spelling (probably), Greg - it was clearly understood, you admitted that we were agreeing but yet decided to tell me I was wrong because of the way I had written it (though there was nothing wrong with the way I had written it). Even in your attempts to correct me you've not added anything to what I said. Ergo, pedantic.
As I said earlier:DDD wrote:Yep.
Slicks on tarmac.
You really need to be going off road (not just grass and mud) for knobbly tyres to actually benefit.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0
