When are the Sclecks going to do something?

zammmmo

For me, this years TDF has become a bit dull because of everyone marking each other and ironically this might be because none of them are on the sauce. Maybe it is because of this that Voeckler is mixing it with these GC riders.

Although 2010 was a closer/harder race I actually quite liked the 2009 TDF because there was the interest around Wiggins and LA, as well as the Schleck/Contador aspect, even though the latter eventually turned out to be dominant.

LeicesterLad

wicked wrote:

RowCycle wrote:

I also wished Andy would've followed through with one of his attacks.

I wished I had gone out and ridden my bike instead of watching that dross. Oh well.

My thoughts exactly.

babyjebus

I would rather watch the Schleckle Brothers taking on the Klitschko siblings, first on bikes, then in the ring. Though Andy's brave dash to take two (TWO) seconds off Cuddles could be the difference between wearing yellow and being yellow...

RichN95.

I'm not going to criticise them because I have no idea what their plan is and they did put in some digs, which only Sanchez really did otherwise.

However, this seemed like a lost opportunity. Really, there's only the Galibier (long but not steep) and Alpe d'Huez finishes to come. If they're banking it all on one massive attack (a la Sastre 2008), that's a big risk.

Whenever Andy attacks he then seems to look around, for whatever reason. What would seem to be a good tactic, to me is for Frank to attack first (Evans et al don't seem that bothered by him attacking) and if he gets 10 seconds, Andy attack hard and then latch on the back.

All easier said than done though. I think Andy's hopes may be helped if Bertie is a little more on form in the Alps and ready to attack.

jerry3571

Andy must learn not to advertise that he is going to attack and also to doubley not do it from the front. He seems to stand up look behind a while and then makes his move. AC had about 5 seconds to get prepared on one of Andy's attacks and the attack was a non starter. Andy should drop to the back of th group and then build up speed to sling shot past leaving the others no time to get up to speed.
It's basic stuff really.

-Jerry

top_bhoy

Seems a lot are questioning the Schleks. Reality is, we don't really know if are they are actually good enough .to open up significant gaps over their rivals. Next week will answer all the questions (apologies for the cliche )

I really think next week in the Alps will be a cracker and looking forward to it.The Schleks will need to attack but are they good enough? Right now, Cadel is looking the best bet but thtis was also the case when he lost to Sastre. This year he appears to be mentally stronger and his head is in the right place to go one better.

wpdoolan

very disappointing
no one is prepared to risk anything to try and win it

Contador is getting an armchair ride
the Shleks are going to lose minutes in the time trial and attacking in the last few
kilometres isnt going to give them the time they need

This race seems to be more about not losing a top ten place than trying to win it
best watched in fast forward till last 10kms

anonymousforobviousreason

I just want to say thanks to everyone for keeping this an interesting and very insightful discussion. I came off cycling boards after being active for years and years because everything just turned into flaming/trolling session.

I am refreshed to see (and I recognise a lot of names from when I was active) that there isn't too much trolling going on at all.

It is all substantial reading and interesting insight.

This board is making the Tour less boring...we are all calling it as we see it in my eyes...and not just licking into people for the sake of boredom...

Cheers!!

anonymousforobviousreason

squired wrote:

In theory you should go out and try to win a race. In the case of this race it seems that everyone is too worried about losing it to try to win it. Why can't someone just ride hard on the front and see if they can ride the others off their wheel on a climb?

One lesson the Tour constantly fails to learn is stretches of valley before the final climb. Whereas I used to watch every minute of the all-day coverage on Eurosport I've stopped bothering until they reach the final climb now. When was the last time a GC rider actually broke away on the penultimate climb, or earlier?

Can anyone remember back to the 1991 Tour? There was a stage with about 5 climbs to Val Louron. Indurain went with Chiapucchi extremely early by modern standards. Going up the penultimate (2nd cat) climb riders were already solo and the final top 10 was as per the link below:



http://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme/resultat ... ETAPE.html

How things have changed....

Dare I mention Landis?

anonymousforobviousreason

Gazzetta67 wrote:

Was'nt it the late great Laurent Fignon who put the boot into Andy Schleck last year about how they were to Palsy with Contador etc.... On the bike you should be a warrior and hate your enemy or words to that effect

Funny you mention it, I am reading Fignon's book (for the second time) as the Tour goes on.

Now I don't remember him putting the boot in last year, but reading it in parallel with this years Tour, the contrast is stark. The sentiment that is contained above is pretty much on every page in the book, and I am now starting to agree with him, his age was Golden...and will we ever get it back?

It is of course a translation however the book is clearly beautifully written in either language. Definitely a lot more substance to his fan given name "The professor" the account of those seconds is like some kind of war poem....

Knock kneed, coughing like hags....

iainf72

A big part of the failure of yesterday was Sly Szmyd having an off day. I think Basso is right, they needed someone to set a very hard pace for the first half of the climb and cut the group down.

Leopard, for all their earlier riding, didn't seem to have anyone who could step up on the final climb, so you ended up with CVV setting a strong pace, but not strong enough.

Ron Stuart

Andy Schleck was a waste of his own ability yesterday. Brotherly love is all well and good but not when you throw away the chance to win the TDF. Not only do you let yourself down but your team (especially Stuart O'Grady), your fans, and sponsors. How often is it you have better legs than Bertie in the high mountains? This was a real opportunity missed; having the Schlecks together only works if they have similar good legs. Yesterday, up until the finish they all rode to Frank’s inferior pace. The management needs to split them up put one in the Giro and one in the TDF and get them to bloody race.

moray_gub

Ron Stuart wrote:

Andy Schleck was a waste of his own ability yesterday. Brotherly love is all well and good but not when you throw away the chance to win the TDF. Not only do you let yourself down but your team (especially Stuart O'Grady), your fans, and sponsors. How often is it you have better legs than Bertie in the high mountains? This was a real opportunity missed; having the Schlecks together only works if they have similar good legs. Yesterday, up until the finish they all rode to Frank’s inferior pace. The management needs to split them up put one in the Giro and one in the TDF and get them to bloody race.

I think this brother thing is getting blown out of all proportion it was clear yesterday the AS didnt have the legs to sustain an attack of any great distance even Tommy Voeckler was able to shut them down, no point in attacking if he cant pull out any kind of distance. What happened yesterday was a level playing field with Bertie maybe just a tad lower then the rest but doing enough to hang on. Also i wouldnt say when you are sitting where AS is sitting in the GC you have thrown away a chance to win the Tour.

blazing_saddles

iainf72 wrote:

A big part of the failure of yesterday was Sly Szmyd having an off day. I think Basso is right, they needed someone to set a very hard pace for the first half of the climb and cut the group down.

Leopard, for all their earlier riding, didn't seem to have anyone who could step up on the final climb, so you ended up with CVV setting a strong pace, but not strong enough.

Which begs the question: Having had Jens Voigt crash twice, why use up all your other big engines chasing down the non-GC threatening breakaways?

Which I think made Basso's point about being unable to make a more selective group.

jerry3571

I think the attitude of a few top riders in the years gone by was to give it a go and if you crack, well, you crack. You lose the Tour but you went out fighting. After, a top rider cracked, stage wins would be on the Menu for a bit of compensation. Nowadays, It all seems to be about placings on GC.
For the Shreks, this could end up like the finish at Leige this year; taking a dangerous rider all the way to the finish to then get worked over in the last few yards.History repeating itself.

-Jerry

PS- Probably would have been good for Frank to lose time yesterday as on other stages he could be sent up the road as a dangerous rider and leaving Andy to shelter of the group and the others to contemplate chasing. If it all goes to pot there's alway the Vuelta.
Gets some BALLS CHAPS!!! ...or 2 Kiwi Fruit which may look like them??

Gavin Cook

Gazzetta67 wrote:

Your correct it has become a bit bland and boring - I was brought up watching the Hinault Fignon tours. Lately the race seems to be ridden from the drivers seat in the team car. Bonuses at the top of finishes you say ? I dont know but after today's bore .....I mean can anyone remember the last time there was 2 bland mountain top finishes within days of each other. Like i say maybe i am comparing today's racing to Hinault & Fignon years.

+1 Thats spot on
There was one stage which was like the 80's racing when Gilbert and Voeckler attacked the race when in Green and yellow but other than that, boring !!

martylaa

My thoughts before the last climb were they would both attack constantly until they got away, how disappointed i was watching the climb up, yeah i admire all those guys but i remember the days of armstrong, indurain, pantani destroying their competion in the mountains and if either one of them wants to win the big race then they surely need to do it in the mountains, tt's are not their style.
Personally i think they need to be on a different team to one another to reach their potential...

Gazzetta67

I think the Schlecks are forgetting about one man (Evans) whats the point of both riding back down the line to watch Contador when Evans will blow them both away in the TT. You have to wonder what their Directuer sportif is thinking. One example Sanchez attacked Andy Schleck got up to him sat on then you guessed it he "Looked round" when he should be giving it full gas and counter attacking as everyone can see Contador is not at 100% - I can see Contador coming into his own next week in the alps dropping evans and Frank Schleck and then it will be down to the TT.

Gaspard

anonymousforobviousreason

I have watched and loved this race since I was five years old...I don't ever want to bring it down, it guts me to say that a stage like today turned into a paint drying session. Nobody can argue with that. It was incredibly predictable and incredibly boring.

I agree. Every mountain stage is a potential damp squib. I'm thinking Ventoux 09, Tourmalet last year in particular. And now yesterday.

Who is telling the Schlecks to keep looking back for bro? Or are they going for a fraternal podium pic? Frank's attitude to Voeckler stinks as well.

Hoping Clentador can come good and take time in the Alps. He has style at least.

anonymousforobviousreason

zammmmo wrote:

For me, this years TDF has become a bit dull because of everyone marking each other and ironically this might be because none of them are on the sauce. Maybe it is because of this that Voeckler is mixing it with these GC riders.

Although 2010 was a closer/harder race I actually quite liked the 2009 TDF because there was the interest around Wiggins and LA, as well as the Schleck/Contador aspect, even though the latter eventually turned out to be dominant.

http://bikeraceinfo.com/tdf/tdfstats.html

OK we are one number missing...time will tell...sauce or not...

rick_chasey

In fairness to the Schlecks, Andy was the only one who actually put in a dig.

Frank didn't have the legs, Evans wasn't going to attack, and Basso looked like a boy-lost without his Polish workster.

frenchfighter

You saw them lamenting the lack of work? Well here is how it works: you want to take time, you attack with murderous intent and hope the others dont work so you get a gap...that the others were unwilling to work should have meant they could create gaps.

You think Contador wants the others to help him. Nien, see comments from him on Stage 15 spoiler thread. When he goes he goes hard and long. No messing around.

Would be nice to have a Rujano in this race or any Colombian climber.

Also not sure how many of you saw this quote from Frankie:

"Andy was very strong and it was perfect. I told him to go and when to wait and we had really good communication..."

sportvan

frenchfighter wrote:

Would be nice to have a Rujano in this race or any Colombian climber.

Uran is Colombian and had he got lost time in the Contador and wiggins crash would have been in 6th place now

frenchfighter

Ah didnt know that, thanks. Like that rider a lot.

ms_tree

frenchfighter wrote:

Ah didnt know that, thanks. Like that rider a lot.

Yup been watching him for a few years now - did come 3rd in Lombardy when with Caisse d'epargne so no slouch.

ms_tree

Just found this:
Stephen Roche comments particularly funny! but other one about 'grinta' kind of nearer the truth.
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fulls ... est%20News

frenchfighter

sportvan wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Would be nice to have a Rujano in this race or any Colombian climber.

Uran is Colombian and had he got lost time in the Contador and wiggins crash would have been in 6th place now

Wow. Respect.

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/lat ... ister.html

eh

I don't get this attitude the Schlecks of having to win alone, surely you isolate GC riders and eliminate them a few at a time. LA or Indurain often finished a stage with one other GC rider in tow, but they knew they'd stuck time into all the rest that day.