Are the Dragon Ride organisers listening?

Krys

OK, so everyone's stated their opinion of the Dragon Ride. But has anyone heard anything from the organisers?

I know I, and others, have emailed them but I haven't had any response. All we have is the pitiful "blame the timing company" statement on the website...

So, has anyone had more luck getting a reply from them than me?

(and in just in case you are, and you've missed my email and my blog - you can find it here! http://www.thecyclingmayor.com/?p=1925 and I'll be in touch again for my refund...)

Bobbinogs

Why would they? I saw the same complaints last year and the ride sold out this year in 22 hours. To be fair to the organisers, they have added a new complaint this year (timing didn't feature last year but parking, queueing, food, etc., all did). Hence, I expect the ride to sell out in under 20 hours next year.

I haven't done the dragon (clashes with a family commitment to the BHF ride in Glastonbury) but I am tempted to try the 2009 route on the 364 days now available to me.

BruceyboyNotts

I sent an email containing my feedback on Tuesday night and to be fair to the organisers received a response yesterday afternoon.

Thank you for your feedback.

We will endeavour to resolve your points. Especially 1 and 2.

We still have no idea what went wrong with the timing chips and are working with Race Ahead to resolve.

Last year they worked well ( if you take into account some failures we did have).

Nothing has changed with the timing chip.

We did alter the number size for the bike, (taking on board that riders would prefer a smaller number) but that was it.

So we do not as yet know what went wrong.



For clarity, Points 1 and 2 being the lack of toilets at the start and the slow starting procedures.

Not exactly a mind blowing response, but a response nonetheless. I guess without knowing the exact cause of the failure there isnt much more they can say at this stage, although I would like to see them being more forthcoming with this type of information rather than having to chase them for updates.

Zoomer37

Perhaps we need to start a few more threads about it on here just in case they missed the first lot.

I still cant get over some of the foil trays were left on the underneath of the apple pies at the feed stops. Just dangerous.

Dont even get me started on that wet rain.

Legshaver

I would like to think that the organisers are so busy adding/amending riders times that have been sent in, that they don't have a lot of time for much else at present. The final results have to be out very soon.

They will also be holding de-briefing meetings to discuss what went wrong, and how to eliminate those problems in the future. Yep - I'm sure that they will be all very busy.

Surfr

Interesting email from Wiggle explaining that they hope to have all times online by the end of the week, which implies to me that there was a technical error and it had nothing to do with blaming the riders for incorrectly mounting their number boards and chips. Smells fishy to me.

Yemble

Zoomer37 wrote:

Perhaps we need to start a few more threads about it on here just in case they missed the first lot.

I still cant get over some of the foil trays were left on the underneath of the apple pies at the feed stops. Just dangerous.

Dont even get me started on that wet rain.

LOL, after all the moaning recently I almost took this seriously

My only complaints are the inadequate toilets for women and obviously the start procedure. Curious to know if the staggered start was requested by local authorities or if it was just for the ceremony of the music and so on.

With seven hundred more starters than the previous year, and the need to stagger the start, riders were set off in groups at two minute intervals, and despite the extra numbers, the last riders started just fifteen minutes later than last year.

We’re aware of a few issues with riders not getting away as early as they would have liked, so we're already looking into having different start times for next year’s ride. Our proposal is that the Gran Fondo riders begin at the earlier time of 7.30am and the Medio Fondo riders afterwards, which should make things smoother.

BruceyboyNotts

On a practical level how will they give me an accurate time? If my timing chip hasnt recorded me going over the start or finish are they just going to make something up? :?

Legshaver

I think that they probably want everyone to send in the times from their computers, which obviously is open to all manner of 'untruths', but the only option.

Yemble

Timestamped finish line photos and rider numbers? Same way all the photos were tagged. I gather it's a minority who didn't get an automatic time so wouldn't be tooooo much trouble.

Legshaver

Has anybody stated officially that the timing foul up was due to riders not attaching the front numbers correctly? If so I don't buy it.

One of our group had his card attached using only the top two punched holes and his card was dead flat. It didn't register at the start or any other part of the course. He did a very good time on the Gran Fondo, but his name doesn't even appear on any of the results listings. It's as though he didn't do the ride. Maybe it was just an apparition that he was beside me for forty-odd miles! The photos prove he was there.

A lot of running races have either a video camera at the start/ finish line or photographer at least, and the timing clock is in the background to record the lot. As a backup a video is unbeatable.

andrewjoseph

I did the dragon ride a few years ago, the start was very slow then, rider tailback from pencoed college through hundreds of meters of lane to start gate, took about 45 mins for me to get through.

Sound like either:

they have learnt very little

or

this is the safest, most efficient way to get riders out onto the course.

I've only ever done this one large sportive (flat out in the fens doesn't count), but compared to the several mtb 'marathons' I've done, a mass start behind safety vehicles is not beyond organisation.

bendertherobot

4000 Riders.

What do those who took ages to start suggest?

100 riders SHOULD take 40 minutes at 1m per 100. Is 1 minute enough?

Remember the police will have had an input here and there's a need to stagger the "peleton."

But, 4000 riders. It is a few to get through.

Krys

Well according to the email they've finally sent out - only 3600 riders (picky picky).

Apparently "the last riders started just fifteen minutes later than last year." I bet that didn't leave them enough time, cycling at a reasonable average speed with the odd quick food stop, to get to the route split before the cut off though!!

(Yes, I'm still bitter...)

bathpaul

Even at 100 riders every 2 minutes the 4000 (3600 according to the newsletter) would only take 80 minutes to start.

Doesn't explain the 90+ minutes I was waiting in the queue and I didn't get to queue until ~8:15 (due to the wait for the car park) so about 800 riders should already have gone!!

And I don't have a time listed...........

oldwelshman

Maybe also set the riders in ability also. FAstes on previous or expected times to go first, would be less "passing" of riders all over the road
Groups of 200 should be safe enough to let go, thought they set off in groups of 200 previously.
I had response back from Lou also and to be fair they have asked for feedback before and do generally try to change as a result.

etapecymru

Apologies - if have any suggestions on how sportive market can be improved interested on hearing it. Please email info@k-extreme.co.uk

Krys

Plenty of toilets - both before, during and after!

No massive wait at start line - let's say < 30 minutes for arguments sake.

Well stocked regular food stations with savoury and sweet options

Reasonable entry fee. A few years back most events cost <£25 and that included a t-shirt. These days it's more like £30+ with a crappy goody bag if you're "lucky". No-one really needs another drinking bottle...I'd rather pay less to enter!

After event food is always a bonus - especially good coffee. (I'll pay for good coffee!)

young dog

Why do you all enter this. It's put on by a bike shop to promote a bike shop and make money for a bike shop!!!!!!!!!
It sounds easy, unorganised,boring etc etc.
You should perhaps try a proper sportive!!

Bobbinogs

etapecymru wrote:

Been directed here by a poster who emailed me directly (thanks Gethin) & probably setting myself up but am one of the organisers behind www.etape-cymru.co.uk the new major closed road event in N Wales on 9th October, 2011.

I have done Dragon Ride for past 3 years (not this year) & have always found it v good and must state categorically that I do not have anything bad to say about the Dragon Ride.

I am curious to know though- if not too cheeky to take peoples time - what are the 5 main gripes in order that people have about the organisation of sportives in general

ie is it lack of parking, toilets, waiting at start line, feedstations, after ride food etc

Any suggestions to resolve the gripes would be interested to see.

I will post this on other threads as well.

Many thanks in advance

Why not start your own thread?

It sounds easy, unorganised,boring etc etc.
You should perhaps try a proper sportive!!

Bit early for the trolls to come out.

twotyred

I have done Dragon Ride for past 3 years (not this year) & have always found it v good and must state categorically that I do not have anything bad to say about the Dragon Ride

Now you've said that I'd be very wary of entering any event you organised as your standards don't appear to be too high.


Ideal sportive should have

Plenty of parking

Interesting well signed route on well surfaced roads marshalled where necessary

Effective timing and efficient registration with limited hanging around waiting to start

Plenty of loos

Well stocked feed stations with something other than cheap jam tarts and apple pies.

Prompt posting of times on a website.

etapecymru

Apologies - if have any suggestions on how sportive market can be improved interested on hearing it. Please email info@k-extreme.co.uk

Bobbinogs

Again - just trying to open dialogue to give people a chance to air gripes & ideas to resolve.

Or shamelessly plug your own event by high jacking someone else's thread, one of the two.

etapecymru

seriously!!!! there are far easier ways of plugging our event ....
Don't worry, I'll delete my posts and try and start a new thread in next couple of weeks (as off to the alps).
Apologies was directed here by an email received this am from a poster & thought this would be the easiest way to hear views.
Wish you all good cycling what ever you do.
If anyone does wish to comment in meantime then send email to info@k-extreme.co.uk
Many thanks

Redhog14

Bobbinogs wrote:

Again - just trying to open dialogue to give people a chance to air gripes & ideas to resolve.

Or shamelessly plug your own event by high jacking someone else's thread, one of the two.

So you would rather just pointlessly whistle at the wind, as the dragon ride people can't organize and don't seem to care, than open dialogue with someone who is at least trying to get it right.

P_Tucker

Redhog14 wrote:

Bobbinogs wrote:

Again - just trying to open dialogue to give people a chance to air gripes & ideas to resolve.

Or shamelessly plug your own event by high jacking someone else's thread, one of the two.

So you would rather just pointlessly whistle at the wind, as the dragon ride people can't organize and don't seem to care, than open dialogue with someone who is at least trying to get it right.

He's charging £65 FFS. To ride your bike on the road.

I reckon you could hire an NEG rider to take you wherever you wanted to go for that. You could even have him carry food and bottles around for you, and if you got tired you could take a "turbo bottle", or if the commissaires aren't looking, a cheeky tow on the back. As a bonus, if you're lucky he'll have a working watch too, so he'll be able to time you.

With all that (moto, food, watch) you'd probably need at least one mate to share the cost, but sounds a hell of a lot better than lining this plonker's pockets.

red ed

Closed roads sounds like a nice feature I know, but if they'd had that for last Sunday it would have been a disaster because the basic skills of the typical rider there just wasn't adequate for closed roads. Why should anyone expect the typical rider at Etape Cymru to have taken the time to learn the basic skills of holding a straight line and being aware of what's happening behind them, when so many at the Dragon Ride couldn't be bothered? Ask yourself do you want to come round a blind bend at speed and find someone wobbling around slowly in the racing line? At least when the roads are open to traffic and the riders keep to the left lane then you have somewhere to go to get yourself out of trouble.

Most people in cycling understand that the UK Sportive scene as currently arranged is a bubble, so it's normal you get speculators and chancers trying to make as much money as possible before the bubble bursts. Hence events like Dragon Ride repeating the same mistakes, and hence people thinking they can charge £65 for a one-day ride. By the time you've chucked in some petrol to get there and somewhere to stay in Wrexham so you can register the day before and get to the start for 8, it'll be cheaper to get on Easyjet to Geneva or Milan and have a day riding around there.

jet26

I will be doing it.

I am happy to make a choice and go ride it, as I am sure will many others.

If it's poor I won't go again. If you don't want to do it don't. Let those who do go enjoy it.

To slate an event that hasn't even happened yet seems unfair.

I will decide whether the entry fee was worth it when I have been, done it and seen what I got for my money.

Krys

I don't worry about my fellow riders. I worry about me. I worry about not getting my line right around a corner and finding myself face to face with a car coming the other way. So the idea of having 100 miles of not having to worry about that really appeals to me!

Actually I lied. I do worry about my fellow riders. The ones who come belting past, without so much as an "on your right" warning, as I'm going downhill, and scare the living daylights out of me. I am not "wobbling around slowly in the racing line", and even if I was it's not a race.

Redhog14

I agree that £65 is too steep and have let Etape Cymru know that I won't be coming for this reason, the Etape Caledonina was £55 which was still steep given that the course is on my doorstep, but I enjoyed the Cale very much and even more so due to the Closed roads (no tacks neccessary). We had quite few crashes which I do feel may have been avoided if the organisers had stressed a "racing line" but then where is the racing line on a LH bend on the right or the left? Getting to the front and away with the faster riders gives some sense of security that most people at least have a notion of what they are doing but I was surprised at how quiet riders were on this my first road event. Having done XC MTB racing too everyone there is pretty vocal in getting the slow riders out the way.
There is no real solution here and if you dont want to pay for participation in a Sportive I don't really understand why you come on here and complain about them.

red ed

Krys wrote:

Actually I lied. I do worry about my fellow riders. The ones who come belting past, without so much as an "on your right" warning, as I'm going downhill, and scare the living daylights out of me. I am not "wobbling around slowly in the racing line", and even if I was it's not a race.

racing line is a term referring to the fastest line around a corner, it doesn't imply that it's a race but there does seem to be a consensus that one tries to complete these rides as quickly as one can, does there not? In an open road scenario a faster rider has the opportunity to overtake in the right hand lane; in a closed road situation you don't have that option. Even in races where everyone is of roughly similar standards fully closed roads are more technically demanding than races where you keep to the left lane: there is no easy way to move up, plus every small obstacle in the road becomes a pinch point.

And sorry, but if you're getting spooked by a rider coming past you then the problem is with you. The overtaking rider may shout a warning but you should know what is happening on the road around you and you should be following a straight predictable line.