heart rate/lactate threshold

trickydisco

HR data for races or the tests?

This is the road race about 10 miles in (as i was a bag of nerves i forgot to switch it on until 10 miles in)

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/79730061

I have a massive problem with nerves and this being my 1st race tmy HR was through the roof. To put it into context when i first get on the rollers my HR is around 100.. this day when i was going to warm up it was already at 150 and i hadn't even done anything!

i've been told the nerves get better with time

this is the crit race

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/80781886

a little less nervous for this one and the effort required was easier.

i've had two fitness tests (i in december and 1 before the season started) to compare and show my improvement. Of course stats are one thing, racing is something differenta nd it's not all about the figures.

trickydisco

I am intrigued by the lower HR threshold training

Do you mean base training? or aerobic threshold training?

I haven't just done base training in this time .It started out as mainly base training but i still had to improve my aerobic threshold quite a bit

jgsi

Both stages.. base and aerobic threshold... was % of max is that in your given plan?

basically my issue is race tactics pure and simple.. but that does often mean red zoning for too long.and suffering the consequences hence my interest in other ways of training via HR and perception and not power in particular as dont have recourse to that on my bike.
At the mo also riiding 'alone' with doesnt help but will have a few 'team mates' next week involved

trickydisco

After my 1st fitness test my zones were (my max is 185)

Zone 1 = <125 beats per minute. You will only need to use this for recovery rides.

Zone 2 = 125-144 bpm
It is important to note that when out on the open road you may find on hills etc that your heart rate goes out ofthis zone. It is important to avoid this happening. You may think after uphill sections you can recover back into zone 2 and burn fat again but that’s not the case. Once your heart rate has gone up your body will kick into sugar
burning mode and it can take over 30 minutes to get back to fat burning so the training session can be wasted80% of your cardiovascular training should be spent in this zone. This may seem a little easy and hard to keep to,but the main thing is to be aware of not spending too much time out of this zone. Over time this zone will increase
to a level (in terms of heart rate and power output) where you still use fat as an energy source.

Zone 3 = 144-165 bpm
This zone can be used for strength training sessions on the bike, producing more power and getting used toclimbing long hills, but it is not a zone to spend more than 10 minutes at a time in at this stage. Avoid this zone when riding with others, it’s easy to get dragged into being competitive. Think of how the big guns on the tourteams do it. They may keep a high average speed but they are in groups of 10-12 riders and so for their long training rides they spend most of the ir time cruising in the slip stream in zone 2

Zone 4 = 165-178 bpm
This zone is used for functional threshold training, trying to push your threshold up to a new level, getting your body used to buffering lactic acid and hold intensity for longer to help with race efforts. Efforts lasting between 4 and 20 mins in this zone are good for increasing your performance in this zone.

Zone 5 = 178 + bpm
Max effort, used for hill top finishes and sprints.



After 5 months of training these have now changed to

Level 1 = <140
Level 2 = 140 - 158
Level 3 = 158- 172
Level 4 = 172 +

My coach gives me an outlined plan every month. The first few months were about building a solid base. after time he introduced more threshold work (to push my aerobic threshold up) This mainly involved holding the effort at my threshold level for certain intensities. e.g 1st week was 30 secs. 2nd week ws 1 minute and building to over 8 mins (this was absolute pain)

here's an example of a couple of threshold workouts i've done

Turbo 10 mins warm up then 10 x 1 mins
L4 with 1 min easy L2 between them,
then 4 x 4 mins L4 with 2 mins easy L1


10 mins warm up then 2 x 8 mins
L4 with 8 mins easy L2 between them, do
these on rolling route. 20 mins c.down to
finish.
between them, then 10 mins c.down

ozzy1000_0

this is really interesting to me!! I've just come back to cycling after many years and my attitude was just to go hard; heres my little training loop that i've started doing;

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/82840758

I have a turbo trainer somone lent me, based on what you're suggesting i'm thinking of slipping in a couple of dedicated slower hours on a the turbo per week?? would this be sensible given that I basically don't have any base of training...??

o

StanwaySteve62

My heart rates are very high.
This was as hard as I could go
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/82070098

But a general ride would be
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/80930554


( 48 and 17stone)

ut_och_cykla

ozzy1000_0 wrote:

this is really interesting to me!! I've just come back to cycling after many years and my attitude was just to go hard; heres my little training loop that i've started doing;

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/82840758

I have a turbo trainer somone lent me, based on what you're suggesting i'm thinking of slipping in a couple of dedicated slower hours on a the turbo per week?? would this be sensible given that I basically don't have any base of training...??

o

Personally I'd do the longer slower (but notslow) outdoors and do the harder stuff on the turbo or preferably on a quiet road!

amaferanga

I can get my HR very high by spinning at a very high cadence. Doesn't mean I'm putting out a lot of power though or going particularly fast.

I didn't honestly think anyone was taking the science of training with HR very seriously these days with power meters widely available. HR/power are means to the same end, but they can't both be right can they? E.g. I go out and ride at HR zone 2 but I'm on rolling hills (or continually stopping and starting) and my power is all over the place - HR stays in zone, but power is repeatedly up into threshold/VO2max/anaerobic territory. HR says it was a stress free session, but my legs and the power output say otherwise....

So what exactly does keeping to an HR zone achieve unless you are also carefully controlling your effort (guessing your power) to keep that constant and within zone as well? The fixating on keeping to an HR zone must surely lead to very variable power output on all but the flattest terrain.

trickydisco

Not sure.. All i know is most of my base training was done on the rollers/gym bike at 1 hour at a time so the terrain didn't come into it. My coach told me i'd get more out of a session staying in zone 2 on the rollers than out on the road as it was more constant (with HR training)

e.g all my zone 2 sessions were kept at HR of 139/140. This provided me with a better base

He has also told me a lot of racers neglect this when they start racing and prefer to concentrate on intervals and the base starts diminishing so he factors in some base training rides

the power meter/hr thing. When i started training in december he said i didn't really need to get a power meter at that point but now i've started racnig and working on the top end a power meter would be a very valuable training tool.. I just can't afford one at the moment (awaiting info from hiring one)

ozzy1000_0

trickydisco wrote:

Not sure.. All i know is most of my base training was done on the rollers/gym bike at 1 hour at a time so the terrain didn't come into it. My coach told me i'd get more out of a session staying in zone 2 on the rollers than out on the road as it was more constant (with HR training)

e.g all my zone 2 sessions were kept at HR of 139/140. This provided me with a better base

He has also told me a lot of racers neglect this when they start racing and prefer to concentrate on intervals and the base starts diminishing so he factors in some base training rides

the power meter/hr thing. When i started training in december he said i didn't really need to get a power meter at that point but now i've started racnig and working on the top end a power meter would be a very valuable training tool.. I just can't afford one at the moment (awaiting info from hiring one)

so how did your coach determine your base heart rate range??? at the moment I'm going to go by the results of my 'time crunched cyclist' field trial;

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/83491911

from this and the corections he gives in the book i'd assume my equivilant zone would be around 155??

trickydisco

ozzy1000_0 wrote:

so how did your coach determine your base heart rate range??? at the moment I'm going to go by the results of my 'time crunched cyclist' field trial;

From doing a fitness test which gave out calorie usage at various intensities, fat burning profile amongst other things.

in december at my aerobic base point* 43% of energy was coming from fat.. now it's rose up to 83%

This might explain a few things

http://www.cyclistno1.co.uk/features/tr ... aining.htm

*Aerobic base point

- This is where you are the most aerobically efficient after this point you will notice the first change in breathing as you will start to take deeper breaths, there will be a small rise in lactate after this point, fat burning starts to drop off quickly after this point, exercising at this intensity can enhance fat burning and will lead to this point moving up . This will indicate how well developed a persons aerobic system is. For endurance athletes this is the point at which they could sustain for a long duration.

jibberjim

trickydisco wrote:

in december at my aerobic base point (highest HR where i'm predominately burning fat) 43% of energy was coming from fat..

You might want to check your coaches mathematical ability....

trickydisco

Changed it.. i got it wrong mr jibberjim