TT training questions.

freehub

Well I'm thinking about training for TT's more, I rode yesterday on my winter bike with aero bars (raised the seat, moved it as far forwards as possible and tipped it so it's pointing down more), I did this about 16 miles into the ride, and whilst the way back was tailwind/crosswind and a small section of headwind, for around 6 miles I averaged 26.5 mph.

Now that's not fast for the terrain in Selby area and it was only 6 miles, but damn it was fast for me!, the best I've done before was I think the last 3 miles of that at like 23mph average and that was last year, I also felt pretty comfortable in the TT position and "on the rivet", the first 16 miles was proper painful so the position change must have worked. Anyway, basically the above made me more enthusiastic, I was amazed on some parts how it seemed easy to just hold 28-30mph.

Today I was thinking of going out and doing a 10 mile loop, well rather 2x 5 miles loop, it's not totally flat, but it's only got one proper corner, and I was thinking of just seeing what time I could do.

It's a proper windy day today, so am wondering, if I do try 10 miles, should I be pushing fairly hard in the tailwind, but save power for the headwind and inclines where I should really try to push the power?

Or would It be more beneficial to do 2x20? I don't want to murder my legs so they're dead tomoz tho.

This is the loop I will do twice, or just over twice if I was to get to 10 miles:

http://bikeroutetoaster.com/Course.aspx?course=236874

It's not completely flat, it goes up hill abit but it's balanced out by abit of downhill, I rekon it'll be proper tough in the wind though!

danowat

"I averaged 26.5mph, now thats not fast" and "I was amazed at how easy it was to hold 28-30mph"

If thats true, and you aren't banding around misc figures with gay abandon, then you are going to do VERY well in open TT events, an avg of 26.5mph would give you a 22:40min 10 time, which is up there with some of the quick guys, you are talking a top 10 time on a fast course like the E2/10 with that.

As for training, 2 x 20's, or 5 x 5's seem to work well for me, as specific training as for pacing strategy, I find pushing hard into wind / uphill, and recoverying downwind and downhill, works for me opposed to even power distrubtion, thats not to say it will work for you.

Anonymous

My best advice is for you to actually do another TT! You haven't done one since the one you did last year?...

markos1963

I was set a target time by my coach for this season. This breaks down into riding it as 4 x 6 min intervals at the average speed. You can only race at a certain speed if you train at it so try the same. If you can't manage the whole interval then break it down more, say 6 x 4min intervals but DON'T ease up on the quality of the effort. If you can't complete or hold the speed end the session and ride easy back. Try to ride in your HR zone 4 and later on push one or more of the intervals to level 5.

freehub

I ended up doing this today, cause I thought it'd be less taxing on my body than a 2x 20 but I will try that next week or maybe 5x5 I don't think I'd cope with a 2x20 yet.. I would do a Thursday TT here but I can't as I'm not a member of the club yet.

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/82287044

Horrible into the wind might need to tinker with the position some more.

danowat, top TTers would probably be averaging 30mph+ where I averaged 26.5 for 6 miles yesterday and on one straight they'd probs be hitting 40 mph. I averaged 29mph for like 0.8 miles with a tailwind today they'd probs be doing 40ish.

danowat

You said holding 28-30mph seemed "easy" though.

As for the avg speeds, I think you are a little bit off, 30mph+ is a sub 20min 10, which is very, VERY fast, and something that not many people can do, I've been at opens where the winner has been a fair way off that.

If you can managed 26.5mph for 6 miles, then you are going to do very well in 10milers, for the record, you don't need to be a member of a club to do a club TT, you only need to be a member to do open TT's

@Markos, whos coaching you?, I am being coached by Jim Burgess, seems to be working well at the moment, busting PB's left, right and centre!

markos1963

@ Danowat, Russell Parkins has taken me on as a project for his BC level 3 qualifiation

danowat

Cool, are you doing any local opens?

markos1963

When I get my summer work roster(around 2nd week in May) I will be able to plan more for opens, just doing club TTs atm

danowat

Which ones?, didn't think VCN ran club TT's?, don't forget our club 10's on Wednesday evenings , we've had a couple of VCN riders turn up this year, North Tuddenham 10 this week.

markos1963

Usually NNWheelers or Godric might give you guys a go but wednesdays will be Lotus soon

freehub

danowat wrote:

You said holding 28-30mph seemed "easy" though.

As for the avg speeds, I think you are a little bit off, 30mph+ is a sub 20min 10, which is very, VERY fast, and something that not many people can do, I've been at opens where the winner has been a fair way off that.

If you can managed 26.5mph for 6 miles, then you are going to do very well in 10milers, for the record, you don't need to be a member of a club to do a club TT, you only need to be a member to do open TT's

@Markos, whos coaching you?, I am being coached by Jim Burgess, seems to be working well at the moment, busting PB's left, right and centre!

I don't see how it means am going to do well in 10 milers, all courses are different, some are fast, the stretch I did the 6 mile on was pretty fast, my average would only start to go down into a proper headwind.

danowat

Because 26.5mph avg for a 6 mile stretch is a hell of a good starting point for a 10

freehub

Yeh but it all depends on how fast that bit of the route is, if I did 6 miles @ 30mph then find out it was some mountain in France that'd change it totally.

amaferanga

danowat wrote:

Because 26.5mph avg for a 6 mile stretch is a hell of a good starting point for a 10

I'll believe the 26.5mph claim when I see the Garmin activity.

freehub

amaferanga wrote:

danowat wrote:

Because 26.5mph avg for a 6 mile stretch is a hell of a good starting point for a 10

I'll believe the 26.5mph claim when I see the Garmin activity.

I was wrong, it was 5.65 miles @ around 26.4 average. 2 laps - 3 miles @ 26.6 and 2.64 @ 26.2 average. I'm not going to provide the Garmin log tho

I don't see what the big deal is, it was only 26.4 for nearly 6 miles big wow loads of people could average well above that hell some people do above that for 25,50 and 100 miles.

danowat

I think your ideas of average speeds and what "loads of people can do" are way out of whack with what your average club rider can do.

If you did 6 miles at 26.4mph, you'd only need to do the last 4 at 25.7mph to get a gold standard at our club!

Have you done any club or open TT's?, if so, what was your official time.

Anonymous

Will, you are a bit late really as the TT season is in full swing, just get out there, spend your 1.50 and do one!!

freehub

Last year I did a club 10 danowat and I did a crappy 25:15.

Nap D I do intend to do some wheelers 10s when I get back I'm at home atm.

Although I can do "unofficial" 10 mile TT's here and then only difference is I don't get a recorded time and put on a list, if the efforts high and I get a good time I'm happy and my Garmin can't be faulted.

danowat

25:15 is hardly "crappy"

a_n_t

you're never going to know until you do another club 10. Even Bhima is doing them now!

SBezza

Will, there is no point training for TT's unless you are going to race them. Just get along to a club TT and do them, you do not have to be a member of the club normally to do them, just enter as a private entry.

As Danowat has said the average speed you have quoted is a decent average speed for a 10, and although you can't really compare times on different courses, it would still be a good average. Most of the riders on our club 10 course are slower than 26 mph, doesn't stop them enjoying it.

Quite a few could probably manage greater than 26 mph on 25's, 50's and 100's, but they are the top riders, you can't really compare yourself to them to be honest, especially if you are doing your TT's on a road bike.

a_n_t

and like I keep saying, quality not quantity. I get 2 hours of training max per week and I've PB'd on every course so far this season, not bad for a vet?

Matt the Tester

will, just do them!! 25:15 is HARDLY crap! work on it, you get better at TT's by doing them..

SBezza

a_n_t wrote:

and like I keep saying, quality not quantity. I get 2 hours of training max per week and I've PB'd on every course so far this season, not bad for a vet?

Quantity doesn't have to mean lack of quality, just make sure do do endurance rides with quality, no cafe stops, no riding in the middle of the bunch etc.

joeyhalloran

Also 25:15 is an average speed of 23.5 (ish) so even accounting for fatigue in the last 4 miles (and you said you were going into a headwind for those 6) you will absolutely SMASH 25:15 for a 10. I would say around the 23 minute mark which is a pretty decent time.

freehub

Wut I never said I was going into a headwind, it was tailwind/crosswind with a small section of headwind lol.

a_n_t

JoeyHalloran wrote:

you will absolutely SMASH 25:15 for a 10.

You've not seen our club 10 course!

joeyhalloran

In that case he would smash it on a flat/well paved course, lol :P

My bad, just looked back over your opening post. I still think an average of 26.5 in training is pretty darn good and you will be seeing quite a bit of the top end of the results sheets if you do a few opens.

SteveR_100Milers

Stop yacking about it - just man up and get out and ride a proper timed club event, then start bragging about your average speeds

Jeff Jones

a_n_t wrote:

you're never going to know until you do another club 10. Even Bhima is doing them now!

How's he getting on?

Freehub, you can't extrapolate a 10 mile TT time from doing 6 miles with a tailwind. As others have said, just go along to a club 10 with your road bike + aero bars and see if you can go sub 25 min. Simple!