Did you get the memo? I didn't.

sketchley

I don't really have that much of a problem with motorbikes in ASLs unless they are blocking it for a venerable cyclist that is. I certainly prefer them there than blocking the route into the ASL. What does p!ss me off is getting beeped at by bike, van, car etc because I blocked them in by using the ASL, this particularly p!sses me off when the only reason they end up blocked in is because they blocked all or part of the ASL in the first place. There was a case in point this morning, taxi driver half way over ASL blocking part of the box, scooter in bike line to ASL stopped just inside ASL in turn stopping me from going passed. I went round said Taxi and stop at front of ASL. Taxi then bibs horn at me as I go across then junction, then scooter rider shakes head at me once they pass. FFS I would have been nice and out of the way on the left hand side of the ASL and not in either of your way, had you both used the ASL according to the Highway Code…

Grrrrrrrrhhhhhhh

Butterd2

rjsterry wrote:

thecrofter wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I'm sure the motorbike riders can confirm this, but motorbikes use the gyroscopic effect of the revving engine to aid their balance at low speeds.
Not sure if this applies to the situation you decribes, but once I knew that my acceptance of bikers improved.

Nah! This is BS I'm afraid. I never noticed any gyroscopic effect from the engine, except on my CX500 which had an in-line engine. If you were particularly sensitive to it you could feel a slight sideways kick when stationary, but it made no dicernible difference to the balance
The gyroscopic effect of a couple of kilos (max) of crankshaft is going to make sod all difference to keeping a 200KG motorbike upright.
You see pit crews at race meetings blipping the throttle to warm up the engine prior to a race which will be where they get it from, but on a modern road bike with electronic fuel injection it's completely unecessary. The engine will quite happily tick over without this affectation.

+1 Not a motorcyclist, but it just sounds like a load of cobblers. The same applies to non-motorised bikes: it's the 'castoring' effect that encourages the bike to straighten up, not the gyroscopic effect of the spinning wheels. Certainly for some, the revving is all about making them feel all big and important.

+2, I was a biker and it's BS. Nothing more than wanting to pretend you're Carl Foggarty.

rjsterry

EKE_38BPM wrote:

RJSTERRY, I meant the gyroscopic effect of the engine revving, not the road wheels rotating.
Never having ridden a big motorbike (my old 50cc could never be described as 'big') I am not speaking from experience, but the gyroscopic effect can be quite strong.
I know a hand spun bicycle wheel (26" without a tyre, innertube or rim tape) is enough to spin me (~82kg) around on an office swivel chair when held at an angle or resisting my efforts to spin on the chair when held vertically. A 1000cc motorbike with the engine spinning at ~2000 rpm *may* have some effect to help maintain balance at low speed.

I will definitely accept that revving can be used for intimidation though.

I know you meant the engine, I was just expanding on the point. Someone with more knowledge in the area can tell us who is right, but for starters, here's the Wikipedia article

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_and_motorcycle_dynamics#Gyroscopic_effects

EDIT: This suggest that you may be correct, although if a rider has both feet on the ground and the bike stationary, quite why he needs help to keep the bike upright is another question. How do we cyclists manage with out a spinning lump of metal to keep us right side up?

EKE_38BPM

I've just had a chat with the rider of an R1 (a 1000cc sports motorbike) and he said the revving at low speed to aid balance is feasable (but he has no experience of it). He also said no sensible motorcyclist would make a habit of it as it would do the clutch no favours.

My conclusion: revving is pure intimidation.

Jay dubbleU

Stopped at pedestrian crossing - cars behind me and coming the other way also stopped to allow woman, pram and small child to cross - moron on a bouncy bike coming the other way overtakes cars and nearly wipes out small child on the crossing :roll:

cyberknight

Kieran_Burns wrote:

You know. I'd love for some of you guys to share my morning commute. You wouldn't know what hit you.

Quite apart from never actually stopping for the whole 12 miles, you'd have to cope with pitch black roads, almost no cars for 75% of it, peace and quiet and people actually being nice to you.

It really is a whole different world when you commute through the countryside.

+1

Although we have to avoid cow poo, drivers that are doing 70 down unlit roads and trying to change inner tubes by torchlight when you get a flat in the middle of nowhere, then your wife takes 45 minutes to come get you although its only 15 min drive away and your freezing your ass off in Lycra last night

OOh and the cops drove past me twice and never came to see if i was ok .............

DonDaddyD

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I've just had a chat with the rider of an R1 (a 1000cc sports motorbike) and he said the revving at low speed to aid balance is feasable (but he has no experience of it). He also said no sensible motorcyclist would make a habit of it as it would do the clutch no favours.

My conclusion: revving is pure intimidation.

So my 'death look of intimidation' was justified.


Effing motorcyclist.

rjsterry

DonDaddyD wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I've just had a chat with the rider of an R1 (a 1000cc sports motorbike) and he said the revving at low speed to aid balance is feasable (but he has no experience of it). He also said no sensible motorcyclist would make a habit of it as it would do the clutch no favours.

My conclusion: revving is pure intimidation.

So my 'death look of intimidation' was justified.


Effing motorcyclist.

No, no, no. You want to be giving them this sort of look

EKE_38BPM

I'm glad I won't be on my bike for the rest of the day.
Less than five minutes after leaving work and still on residential roads I was about to turn left into a side road just as a car in the side road was approaching (no indicators showing) the junction. I indicated left and just as I was about to turn the car was about to turn right and severely cut the corner. I gave a long blast on the Airzound and we both stopped just in time. The dickhead car driver had left about a bike width between the kerb and the car. Cue my verbal tirade.

About three minutes after that and I'm on a busier road with one lane each way and one bus lane each way. A ped on a phone steps out in front of me. I saw it coming so a swerve (there would have been no swerve if I wasn't in a bus lane) and an Airzounding is my response.
Immediately after this and still in heavy traffic (as this is approaching one of the entrances to the North Circular) and I'm still in the bus lane with my Spidey senses on full alert when a car overtakes me (the lights up ahead had changed to green a few seconds earlier) with its left indicator showing and drifted across nearly squashing me against the kerb. That car now has 3 EKE fist-sized dents in the roof above the passenger door. More verbals from me left the driver's ears bleeding.

I've got the 3M spoke reflectors on my wheels and 3M reflective stickers on my helmet. I was wearing a hi-vis vest and reflective gloves. The bike has two flashing lights up front and one flashing & one steady rear light. My rucksack has a few reflective details.
I'm quite visible.

WHAT IS GOING ON?!
I've had more drama in the last 90 minutes of cycling than in the last 90 days!


Have your Spidey senses pumped up to the max, peeps!

redvee

The engine revving thing was mentioned on of these police proggys and was wncouraged for trainee motorbike coppers.
Today I had a near undertake as I was about to turn left off a roundabout by another cyclist so I was guilty of a near left hook :x and also hada merc SL convertable race ahead of me to get into the ASL first :x

green thing

Motorbikes and their rotatey bits......the only types on which you'll notice any effect are those with fore-and-aft crankshafts (BMW, Guzzi, the aforementioned CX500) . Blipping the throttle has the effect of making the crankshaft accelerate in relation to the rest of bike, and the rest of the bike reacts to this in the other direction. It's only a slight twitch, and it's very hard to notice on bikes with transverse crankshafts as the distance at which the movement takes place is much further away (front and rear, rather than the sides).

I don't have a problem with motorbikes filtering to the front of traffic and using the bike boxes; they're often quicker away and they get a hard time from 4-wheeled traffic too.

But it isn't nearly as busy as London here......

W1

green thing wrote:

I don't have a problem with motorbikes filtering to the front of traffic and using the bike boxes; they're often quicker away and they get a hard time from 4-wheeled traffic too.

But it isn't nearly as busy as London here......

I don't really either - except when they block the accesses so the cyclists can't get in, or fill the boxes completely. If they acted in a way that showed they were aware that they were "guests" that would help. Sadly most of them don't....

sketchley

W1 wrote:

green thing wrote:

I don't have a problem with motorbikes filtering to the front of traffic and using the bike boxes; they're often quicker away and they get a hard time from 4-wheeled traffic too.

But it isn't nearly as busy as London here......

I don't really either - except when they block the accesses so the cyclists can't get in, or fill the boxes completely. If they acted in a way that showed they were aware that they were "guests" that would help. Sadly most of them don't....

^^ This

chunkytfg

Re the motorbike crank thing i though i'd add some more info for those who find this sort of thing interesting.

In terms of the actual effect it has then yes the crank spinning does have an effect however for mere mortals such as london commuters or even experienced club racers it will not ever be noticeable.

If however you are a riding God such as the Doctor himself(Rossi) then thses things make a difference. The Yamaha M1 MotoGP bike that Rossi has been riding actually has a crank that spins in the revers direction in comparison to the wheel rotation direction. This is deemed to have such as effect as to cancel out some of the gyroscopic effects off the wheels allows the bike to change direction quicker.

A few years ago in the states there was a small manufacturer who successfully made a bike to race within the motoGP class with two cranks which span in opposite directions completely neutralising any Gyro effects from the engine. The bike was never actually raced but I believe Jeremy McWilliams tested it.

veronese68

Some people in or on all modes of transport are phucktards. I get more annoyed by it when I'm on 2 wheels as I'm more vulnerable.
Some motorbikes may rev more than appears necessary as it's a lot smoother to rev the engine and slip the clutch when manouvering because their engines are rubbish at low revs. Some definitely do it to look big. I do occasionally use it to announce my presence. Usually when next to someone driving round the Kingston one way system talking on their mobile.
I do sometimes enter ASLs on a motorbike. But only from the right and because I want to get away from the cars around me when the lights change. There are not many cyclists along my commute. If there were a lot more then I would rethink things.
When on a bicycle I am of course the model cyclist and completely without fault.

EKE_38BPM

Veronese68 wrote:

I do sometimes enter ASLs on a motorbike.

Burn him!

tptvmbircn

coming off a round-a-bout, last week I had a lovely silver MX5 pulling out from the left and behind me, but pulling out practically touching my left leg..

..take center position in road, look behind and apply brakes..

cretin :roll:

Canny Jock

Clever Pun wrote:

A bus had nearly hit a lorry this morning and they were having a right old barney at each other instead of moving to the side and letting people past... the traffic was proper borked for quite some way back.

Myself and another cyclist had a good laugh about it.. further up the road a cop car screamed past heading towards it I assumed.

Other than that everyone seemed fine

I must have been just behind you then - what time was that?

Have to agree with most of the above - this week I've had more near misses than in a typical month, including nearly being left-hooked by motorbike for the first time. And don't get me started on motorbikes in cycle lanes and ASL's, and being buzzed and revved at by the so-called 'most vulnerable road users'.

EKE_38BPM

Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more!

Kieran_Burns

EKE_38BPM wrote:

Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more!

Cry havoc! and let slip the cogs of war 8)

EKE_38BPM

Havoc!

hatbeard

[the rap-ha men]who let the cogs out? who? who? who? who?[the rap-ha men]

Kieran_Burns

hatbeard wrote:

[the rap-ha men]who let the cogs out? who? who? who? who?[the rap-ha men]

typical... we quote the bard and the beard lowers the tone

EKE_38BPM

Kieran_Burns wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more!

Cry havoc! and let slip the cogs of war 8)

... For James Hewitt's son, England, and a Roman soldier!

DonDaddyD

Coming through London Bridge heading towards Borough a taxi driver pulls left and he isn't looking in his mirror or blind spot. - Had he looked in either he'd have seen me. I have five lights on my bike, a Fenix torch on the front set on lightsaber, a front and rear knog on my helmet. A rear light on my bag and bike. I'm in hi viz. - I'm pulling and slowing, I don't like the surface of this road or layout despite my lane being clear. But its all too close.

He swings left towards me, I swerve round shout out "whoa for f*ck sake".

The guy eventually catches up and shouts that I shouldn't be riding in the middle of the road.

I switch. I demand he parks up. He doesn't. I catch up to him. He continues to shout.

The next thing I can remember is me shouting "look out your fu*king mirror and f*cking blind spot" as froth flows out of my mouth following the glare of my incisors. I can also remember not being able to see anything but this guys face. Everything else was blacked out, I had properly sunk into a feral state.

I pause, he looks at me and says in the sweetest voice. "OK sorry".

Then this morning, I stop in the ASL, a van behind me. Light goes green, he is clutch down revving the engine.

ME?