What is it about horse riders?
Comments
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Yes it'll be a minority - probably a large minority on here - it was just your second page post asking if we had insurance, the assumption we didn't and then the "gone very quiet" - quite a few will be insured but they probably haven't responded as they don't see it as particularly relevant.
it's a hard life if you don't weaken.0 -
I live in Warwickshire and my other half is into horses ( has 2) and it is unusual to go out and not see horsey types , if I am behind I shout to let them know as it is a bit scary when one starts getting skitterish and begins a mini ballet in the middle of the road.
If it can stove a car in, imagine what igt could do to you and don't forget that the rider could be thrown off and badly hurt
I have just joined CTC for the 3rd party cover, I do not race etc and probably fall into the MAMIL group, out about twice a week this time of year and as much as possible in the summer. I also try and cycle to work twice a week.0 -
Insurance or not it still doesnt get away from the fact that huge quantities of horse muck are left where they fall. On unlit cycle paths and in the road where we cycle and it also doesnt answer the fact that its ok for them to ride two abreast but motorists think cyclists are just blocking the road.
And yes I have insurance and no i'm not 'anti horse' (just the muck left).Novice runner & novice cyclist
Specialized Tricross
Orbea (Enol I think)0 -
Cars generate muck - you usually can't see it, but you can't dodge it and it gives you bronchitis and lung cancer, y'know? Next you'll be complaining about the smell of manure on farmers' fields.Lancslad wrote:Insurance or not it still doesnt get away from the fact that huge quantities of horse muck are left where they fall...
And riding through horse muck is much less nasty than getting hit by a motor.
Surely, that is the motorists' attitude problem, not the horse riders' fault?Lancslad wrote:...it also doesnt answer the fact that its ok for them to ride two abreast but motorists think cyclists are just blocking the road.0 -
+1 to the above.
I ride country lanes regularly and have never skidded on the "huge quantities" of horse manure. I've trodden in enough of the stuff while mucking out as well and can't say it is particularly slippery stuff as it's so fibrous. The worst offenders for making the lanes slippery are farmers trudging mud out of fields and spreading it on the road - on a construction site vehicles will have to go through a wheel washer as part of the planning conditions but farmers can do what they like.
So, rather than saying why don't horse riders get any stick the question should be why don't farmers get any stick with their slow moving, wide tractors blocking the lanes they cover in mud and fertilizers but then tractors weigh a few tonnes
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Not quitePross wrote:The worst offenders for making the lanes slippery are farmers trudging mud out of fields and spreading it on the road - on a construction site vehicles will have to go through a wheel washer as part of the planning conditions but farmers can do what they like.
And I think we need to start a long and pointless thread about the legality of riding horses on pavements
But seriously, isn't the big difference between equestrians and cyclists that horses can cause serious injury and damage - often by unpredicatable and hard to control behaviour, i.e. "spooking" - whereas cyclists don't?0 -
bompington wrote:
Those are NFU guidelines that considerate farmers may wish to follow, sadly the majority of farmers are neither considerate or inclined to do anything more than they absolutely have to.0 -
You missed this bit then:*AL* wrote:Those are NFU guidelines that considerate farmers may wish to follow, sadly the majority of farmers are neither considerate or inclined to do anything more than they absolutely have to.Depositing mud on the road is an offence under the Highways Act. It is the legal responsibility of the farmer to ensure that every precaution is taken to avoid any mud being carried off the field. Accepting that in cultivating and harvesting operations some mud will inevitably end up on the road, it is important to make arrangements to remove it immediately.
If mud is left on roads, warning signs should always be used to alert motorists to the potential hazard. It is also important to make sure that those cleaning the road are clearly visible, wearing reflective florescent clothing, and that the mechanical brusher has hazard warning lights.0 -
Out of all that the only thing I've ever seen done is the farmer to put out warning signs (usually a brown cardboard box with some writing in black felt). Has anyone been prosecuted over it? I've seen construction sites be threatened with closure due to mud on the road.
I've seen a few cyclists spook, difference is they usually end up getting hurt whereas a horse usually hurts someone else 0 -
What about horses jumping red lights then? Which makes me wonder, am I right in thinking that the law traditionally sees horses and bikes as the same thing?
I know that some forums have members who love to use their legal knowledge to inform the ignoramuses and prove them wrong wherever possible, now we could sort out all these legal niceties if only we had someone like that here...0 -
bompington wrote:What about horses jumping red lights then? Which makes me wonder, am I right in thinking that the law traditionally sees horses and bikes as the same thing?
I know that some forums have members who love to use their legal knowledge to inform the ignoramuses and prove them wrong wherever possible, now we could sort out all these legal niceties if only we had someone like that here...
Don't know if there are many horses could jump that high, about 7 foot is the highest they can clear
Incidentally I saw a police officer on horseback in Bristol earlier waiting at a red light, it looked a bit strange. Not sure on horses and bikes being classed the same, you get Toucan crossing for cyclists at signals but there is also Pegasus crossings for horses (I've only ever seen one at the end of Constitution Hill by Buck House). Could be they only have different crossing types due to the height of push button horse riders need though. 0 -
I have had horses since I was about 8 years old (25 now) and in that time I have cleared up an enormous amount of waste, generally from the field or stable. Where I live the only riding I have availible if I go off the yard is highways for atleast 6 miles to the nearest bridleway. Inevitably my horse(s) over the years have probably dropped quite an amount of waste onto the local roads. Horse feaces is relatively safe although I do go back to the local village after riding to clear up any feaces that may have been deposited there (Generally though the locals have already been out and scooped it up for their roses). I get little to know warning as to when he is likely to go to the toilet. (If possible I move him into the long verge grass to go failing this it will be in the gutter line of the highway).
There is little point in arguing over who has the 'right' to be on the road. We all have to get along with each other, we all are allowed to use the highway and that is not likely to change in the near future.
Horses are a herd animal and there natural instinct is to flee if something startles them, they are placed in a new/unknown situation or if the rider is nervous. The only way to improve a horses behaviour on the road is through experience, it is how we all learn, it's no different for horses. Choosing the right location and time to teach a horse in traffic is the riders choice, rush hour in a city isn't the best place to start.
Generally the horses I have ridden pick up people approaching from behind far more quickly than the rider, and generally before the person approaching has declared there presence. If the rider hasn't looked over their shoulder to see you then make your presence known. It is normally a rider 'jumping' because they didn't hear/know you were there that causes the horse to react.....huge quantities of horse muck are left where they fall. On unlit cycle paths and in the road where we cycle ....
horse muck or how about a pot hole? both can be considered hazards in the road, surely riding with lights at an appropriate speed for the conditions would avoid hitting either?Specialized Allez Sport 20100 -
bompington wrote:What about horses jumping red lights then?
The rules of the highway apply to riders as well as any other road user and should wait at a red light.
The only instance I can think of is where the lights are triggered by a sensor which the horse does not activate. In this case it would be proceed with caution possibly removing yourself from the highway and proceeding down the verge where safe to do so.Specialized Allez Sport 20100 -
KeimanP wrote:bompington wrote:What about horses jumping red lights then?
The rules of the highway apply to riders as well as any other road user and should wait at a red light.
The only instance I can think of is where the lights are triggered by a sensor which the horse does not activate. In this case it would be proceed with caution possibly removing yourself from the highway and proceeding down the verge where safe to do so.
Failure of the sarcasm sensor there then? None of the above should be taken seriously, and certainly not personally.0 -
Pross wrote:
So, rather than saying why don't horse riders get any stick the question should be why don't farmers get any stick with their slow moving, wide tractors blocking the lanes they cover in mud and fertilizers but then tractors weigh a few tonnes
I'll quite happily draft a tractor for as long as it's heading the right way - won't catch me drafting a horse though Has the head wind picked up or the tail wind dropped off???0 -
You missed this bit then:Depositing mud on the road is an offence under the Highways Act. It is the legal responsibility of the farmer to ensure that every precaution is taken to avoid any mud being carried off the field. Accepting that in cultivating and harvesting operations some mud will inevitably end up on the road, it is important to make arrangements to remove it immediately.
If mud is left on roads, warning signs should always be used to alert motorists to the potential hazard. It is also important to make sure that those cleaning the road are clearly visible, wearing reflective florescent clothing, and that the mechanical brusher has hazard warning lights.
In order for the police to act they have to link the mud on the road to a field and then to a farm (considering fields are pretty much anonymous) which is pretty difficult to do and very time consuming, or actually catch the farmer depositing the mud.
If the farmer is there, they apologise profusely and promise to clean up the mess asap (which seldom happens) if they're not present the police passes it onto the highways dept.
The highways dept haven't the resources to trace the farmer to bill them for the clean up or the budget to send out a sweeper to clean the road at their own costs (remember the farmer is responsible for the mud and it's removal not the highways dept) so they dispatch a van with a couple of slippery road boards to warn motorists of the mud and wait for nature to do it's job.
Legal requirement or no, very few farmers clean up after themselves.0 -
Isn't the main thing about horse riders that;
a) you think they're posher than you
b) they sh!t all over the road, which ultimately means, you.
c) they do that weird Hitler salute thing when you pass.
d) you feel they are judging you by the way in which you pass them whilst they are, rather commically (or sexually), astride their beast.0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:Isn't the main thing about horse riders that;
a) you think they're posher than you - No. Nobody is above me or beneath me. Well some are beneath me :twisted:
b) they sh!t all over the road, which ultimately means, you. - No. Dodge it.
c) they do that weird Hitler salute thing when you pass. - Eh?
d) you feel they are judging you by the way in which you pass them whilst they are, rather commically (or sexually), astride their beast- The one I see, I'd rather not picture like that thanks :shock:None of the above should be taken seriously, and certainly not personally.0 -
daviesee wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Isn't the main thing about horse riders that;
a) you think they're posher than you - No
b) they sh!t all over the road, which ultimately means, you. - No. Dodge it.
c) they do that weird Hitler salute thing when you pass. - Eh?
d) you feel they are judging you by the way in which you pass them whilst they are, rather commically (or sexually), astride their beast- The one I see, I'd rather not picture like that thanks :shock:
They do this one when you pass
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daviesee wrote:KeimanP wrote:bompington wrote:What about horses jumping red lights then?
The rules of the highway apply to riders as well as any other road user and should wait at a red light.
The only instance I can think of is where the lights are triggered by a sensor which the horse does not activate. In this case it would be proceed with caution possibly removing yourself from the highway and proceeding down the verge where safe to do so.
Failure of the sarcasm sensor there then?
Maybe a little... :oops:...
It struck a nerve on the 'Green' traffic lights though and the designing out of some road users having had to alter route to avoid some.Specialized Allez Sport 20100 -
KeimanP wrote:I have had horses since I was about 8 years old (25 now) and in that time I have cleared up an enormous amount of waste, generally from the field or stable. Where I live the only riding I have availible if I go off the yard is highways for atleast 6 miles to the nearest bridleway. Inevitably my horse(s) over the years have probably dropped quite an amount of waste onto the local roads. Horse feaces is relatively safe although I do go back to the local village after riding to clear up any feaces that may have been deposited there (Generally though the locals have already been out and scooped it up for their roses). I get little to know warning as to when he is likely to go to the toilet. (If possible I move him into the long verge grass to go failing this it will be in the gutter line of the highway).
There is little point in arguing over who has the 'right' to be on the road. We all have to get along with each other, we all are allowed to use the highway and that is not likely to change in the near future.
Horses are a herd animal and there natural instinct is to flee if something startles them, they are placed in a new/unknown situation or if the rider is nervous. The only way to improve a horses behaviour on the road is through experience, it is how we all learn, it's no different for horses. Choosing the right location and time to teach a horse in traffic is the riders choice, rush hour in a city isn't the best place to start.
Generally the horses I have ridden pick up people approaching from behind far more quickly than the rider, and generally before the person approaching has declared there presence. If the rider hasn't looked over their shoulder to see you then make your presence known. It is normally a rider 'jumping' because they didn't hear/know you were there that causes the horse to react.....huge quantities of horse muck are left where they fall. On unlit cycle paths and in the road where we cycle ....
horse muck or how about a pot hole? both can be considered hazards in the road, surely riding with lights at an appropriate speed for the conditions would avoid hitting either?
I take my hat off to you for having the decency to go back and clean up the horse muck your horse deposited in the road, I dont understand why this isnt common practice amoungst horse riders?
If I had a horse and it pooped in the road outside someones house id feel compelled to go back after the ride and clean it up. Its just not nice to see if your not a horse person in the same way dog dirt isnt nice to see either.
Also I have seen some horses with a kind of bag fixture at the back to collect said poop, are they a good idea?0 -
JD_76 wrote:KeimanP wrote:I have had horses since I was about 8 years old (25 now) and in that time I have cleared up an enormous amount of waste, generally from the field or stable. Where I live the only riding I have availible if I go off the yard is highways for atleast 6 miles to the nearest bridleway. Inevitably my horse(s) over the years have probably dropped quite an amount of waste onto the local roads. Horse feaces is relatively safe although I do go back to the local village after riding to clear up any feaces that may have been deposited there (Generally though the locals have already been out and scooped it up for their roses). I get little to know warning as to when he is likely to go to the toilet. (If possible I move him into the long verge grass to go failing this it will be in the gutter line of the highway).
There is little point in arguing over who has the 'right' to be on the road. We all have to get along with each other, we all are allowed to use the highway and that is not likely to change in the near future.
Horses are a herd animal and there natural instinct is to flee if something startles them, they are placed in a new/unknown situation or if the rider is nervous. The only way to improve a horses behaviour on the road is through experience, it is how we all learn, it's no different for horses. Choosing the right location and time to teach a horse in traffic is the riders choice, rush hour in a city isn't the best place to start.
Generally the horses I have ridden pick up people approaching from behind far more quickly than the rider, and generally before the person approaching has declared there presence. If the rider hasn't looked over their shoulder to see you then make your presence known. It is normally a rider 'jumping' because they didn't hear/know you were there that causes the horse to react.....huge quantities of horse muck are left where they fall. On unlit cycle paths and in the road where we cycle ....
horse muck or how about a pot hole? both can be considered hazards in the road, surely riding with lights at an appropriate speed for the conditions would avoid hitting either?
I take my hat off to you for having the decency to go back and clean up the horse muck your horse deposited in the road, I dont understand why this isnt common practice amoungst horse riders?
If I had a horse and it pooped in the road outside someones house id feel compelled to go back after the ride and clean it up. Its just not nice to see if your not a horse person in the same way dog dirt isnt nice to see either.
Also I have seen some horses with a kind of bag fixture at the back to collect said poop, are they a good idea?
+1 - well done KeinmanP for considering others.
People who are closely involved seem to distinguish between different types of poop but to the general layperson poop is poop, period.
This is the bag fixture http://www.bunbag.com - interesting that in the U.S. is marketed as a way of avoiding tickets - do riders ever get tickets in the U.K. for dumping on the roads? I've never seen one of these bags - why aren't they widely used?0 -
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Personally, I don't have a problem with horses on the road, as long as:
The rider has full control of the horse.
The rider has proper insurance in place.
In my view, the first point is the important one. I've come around a corner before, to find a startled horse (not my doing) dancing around in the road. Whilst I wasn't knocked off, evasive action had to be taken and I ended up riding into a shallow ditch and getting two flats. Had I not taken evasive action, I'd have ended up with a kicking from the rearing horse. Not ideal and somewhat scary at the time (try avoiding an unpredictable 1/2 tonne beast whilst trying not to end up in the brambles). Just to add insult to injury, I got a mouthful from the rider because he thought that I should have expected an out of control horse to be around the corner. :roll:
As an aside, and not really related to horses and riders on the roads, but there was a somewhat alarming court case several years ago (at least 12, as I was dating my first wife !).
An elderly couple rounded a corner to be confronted by a very spooked horse which had escaped from it's field. The car hit the horse and to cut a long story short the couple were killed and the horse had to be put down. The really shocking part of the story is that the owner of the horse successfully sued the family of the elderly couple for damages to the horse. I'd like to thing that the family sued the owners of the stables for not maintaining their fences, but I don't know that detail.
Not an urban myth, a friend of a friend of a friend, or something that has done the rounds in the Daily Mail. The horse was stabled at the same place as my ex-wife's horse.Science adjusts it’s beliefs based on what’s observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved0 -
MattC59 wrote:
As an aside, and not really related to horses and riders on the roads, but there was a somewhat alarming court case several years ago (at least 12, as I was dating my first wife !).
An elderly couple rounded a corner to be confronted by a very spooked horse which had escaped from it's field. The car hit the horse and to cut a long story short the couple were killed and the horse had to be put down.
What if they'd come round the corner to find a broken down car, or a crash that had just happened, or pedestrians walking in the road, or a cyclist or a fallen tree or.....
You shouldn't be driving in such a way that your stopping distance is more than the distance you can see.0 -
I can't believe this thread. The prejudices being aired are no too dissimilar to those aimed at cyclists and found on Piston heads et al.
Both cyclists and horse riders have an absolute right to be on the highway, as have pedestrians. It's all too easy to have a go at other road users because they are different to you. Some posters in this thread need to take a look at themselves. A bit of mutual consideration goes a long way.0 -
I still want someone to explain why they do their best hitler impression when you pass.
I'm only being half facetious.0 -
bails87 wrote:MattC59 wrote:
As an aside, and not really related to horses and riders on the roads, but there was a somewhat alarming court case several years ago (at least 12, as I was dating my first wife !).
An elderly couple rounded a corner to be confronted by a very spooked horse which had escaped from it's field. The car hit the horse and to cut a long story short the couple were killed and the horse had to be put down.
What if they'd come round the corner to find a broken down car, or a crash that had just happened, or pedestrians walking in the road, or a cyclist or a fallen tree or.....
You shouldn't be driving in such a way that your stopping distance is more than the distance you can see.
+1 - failure to be able to stop is the responsibility of the driver and you should adjust your speed accordingly if visibility is restricted. About the only time this wouldn't be the case is if something coming towards you veers onto your side of the road or if an object suddenly falls into your path.
There's some real guff spoken on this subject by a few on this topic - cleaning up after horses? Give me a break, maybe we should run around the countryside cleaning up fields from cows in case the view offends walkers? It is very different from cleaning up after a dog, as well as the fact that it isn't disease ridden how many times has anyone on here trodden is horse manure and unwittingly dragged it through their house? I haven't despite living in an area with lots of horses! It is generally so dry it doesn't even stick on a shoe.0 -
Sorry, my mistake, I was trying to keep a rushed post short.bails87 wrote:MattC59 wrote:
As an aside, and not really related to horses and riders on the roads, but there was a somewhat alarming court case several years ago (at least 12, as I was dating my first wife !).
An elderly couple rounded a corner to be confronted by a very spooked horse which had escaped from it's field. The car hit the horse and to cut a long story short the couple were killed and the horse had to be put down.
What if they'd come round the corner to find a broken down car, or a crash that had just happened, or pedestrians walking in the road, or a cyclist or a fallen tree or.....
You shouldn't be driving in such a way that your stopping distance is more than the distance you can see.
The car had stopped, but the horse reared up and put it's front legs through the windscreen, killing the passenger and in the ensuing struggle injuring the driver. The driver died as a result of his injuries. Apparently it was horrific, the horse broke both of it's front legs, couldn't get free and had to be put down before it could be removed.Science adjusts it’s beliefs based on what’s observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:I still want someone to explain why they do their best hitler impression when you pass.
I'm only being half facetious.
Do you live near the Royal family?
I am being totally facetious None of the above should be taken seriously, and certainly not personally.0
