Question about calorie defecits and timing.

Anonymous

Hang on, Jimboalee's last post on Cyclechat was about 16th Nov. Chiggy joined here on 23rd Nov.

Hmmmm.

amaferanga

NapoleonD wrote:

Hang on, Jimboalee's last post on Cyclechat was about 16th Nov. Chiggy joined here on 23rd Nov.

Hmmmm.

Got to be one and the same....

I might go back and have a look at Cyclechat again if that muppet has stopped posting there.

Murr X

Chiggy wrote:

Let me get this right.

SRM cranks can differentiate between the upward pull and the downward push. Yes because the sensor is between the spider and the chainring.

A PowerTap in the rear wheel cannot. It sees every fluctuation, the total of both legs, however it is produced.

The best track cyclists just push down harder?
So why did Tommy Godwin and Hugh Porter tell me to pull round the whole revolution and heave up with all my might at the sprint?

Don't tell me,,, 1960s cycling is not correct in the 21st Century.


I say, I say, I say. What is the difference between lifting the upward moving leg without generating power and pulling it up to generate power?

I don't know, what is the difference between lifting the upward moving leg without generating power and pulling it up to generate power?

Losing!

Chiggy, this thread has given me a great mornings entertainment.

Just to chime in I'm not sure you have ever used an SRM but as far as I am aware none of the standard models or at least none of the ones I have owned will differentiate between the upstroke or downstroke, I would not be interested in knowing this information anyway as it is not relevant to me. I have used SRMs for over 13 years BTW.

I do not have the time or energy to explain why pulling on the upstroke will generally lead to an reduction in aerobic power output, this is easily demonstrated with a powermeter and a good turbo trainer. Sprinting is a different story and yes for sprints (ie 5 secs max power) pulling on the upstroke is the norm and you will be able to generate more power in this fashion - but for short durations only.

Murr X

SBezza

NapoleonD wrote:

The Garmin overestimates calorie expenditure by about 30% in my experience...

It can serverly underestimate as well, I guess it depends on what power output you have. Mine was wildly out during my 12 hr TT, I don't think there is any way that I only burnt <5,000 calories LOL. I do agree is a guessimation at best.

Alex_Simmons/RST

G-Wiz wrote:

The original question was about coping with the calorie defecit on long ride days.
So, should I aim to balance all that out on the same day, and if so when, and with what?

Have a look here for some helpful nutrition advice:
http://www.ausport.gov.au/ais/nutrition ... ad_cycling

As for how much, replace as many calories as you think is necessary in order to maintain the calorie deficit you desire. On long ride/epic days, not quite eating that much is only a problem if you are planning to do back to back long days.

The weight loss will be as a result of the calorie deficit over the medium term.

Alex_Simmons/RST

Chiggy wrote:

Sorry Alex, but cycling is my hobby, so you're stuck with me.

Just as a sideline. Do your calcs for cyclist's efficiency have the rider using both legs on the down AND upstroke to generate power, or only the front leg on the downstroke?

Well trained cyclists will use the upstroke in addition to the downstroke. Untrained cyclists wont and this will effect efficiency figures.

So lets get a clear understanding for the untrained cyclists out there. If you don't pull up with the back leg, reduce the theoretical efficiency value by 5%.

You really have no idea what you're talking about, do you?

The logical fallacies just keep coming.

Chiggy

Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:

Chiggy wrote:

Sorry Alex, but cycling is my hobby, so you're stuck with me.

Just as a sideline. Do your calcs for cyclist's efficiency have the rider using both legs on the down AND upstroke to generate power, or only the front leg on the downstroke?

Well trained cyclists will use the upstroke in addition to the downstroke. Untrained cyclists wont and this will effect efficiency figures.

So lets get a clear understanding for the untrained cyclists out there. If you don't pull up with the back leg, reduce the theoretical efficiency value by 5%.

You really have no idea what you're talking about, do you?

The logical fallacies just keep coming.

Yes, I've been put right here. A good cyclist ONLY uses the downstroke.

Something to do with speed of thought processing which makes them unable to activate the motor neurons at the right moment.
Their legs go all sloppy and want to pedal the wrong way round.

Cyclists are not multi-tasking. They can't spin the cranks at 120 rpm, apply torque through 360 degrees AND dodge round a photographer.

Garz

NapoleonD wrote:

You really have lost the plot Chiggy. I've never heard such utter tripe. Except for that Jimboalee character on Cyclechat.

2010 British Sporting Course Time Trial Championship contender,,,, but Cycling.

Haha was thinking the same thing myself the other day!

P_Tucker

Chiggy wrote:

Yes, I've been put right here. A good cyclist ONLY uses the downstroke.

Something to do with speed of thought processing which makes them unable to activate the motor neurons at the right moment.
Their legs go all sloppy and want to pedal the wrong way round.

Cyclists are not multi-tasking. They can't spin the cranks at 120 rpm, apply torque through 360 degrees AND dodge round a photographer.

y'know, if you really believe that everyone else is wrong and you're right, instead of throwing your toys out of the pram, you could find some evidence to back up your assertions. Just a thought like.

whyamihere

Chiggy - First and only warning. Stop posting rubbish and derailing threads or you will be banned.

Now, back to the topic at hand please.

Anonymous

Apologies again to the OP. I shouldn't have responded.

The nutritionist I saw ( who transformed my training) is hopefully writing a book soon. I'd heartily recommend a consultation with him ( less than 100 quid IIRC) as you get a plan completely tailored to you and your needs. But if you can't stretch to that then hopefully the book won't be long...

http://www.optimumnutrition4sport.com/

Chiggy

G-Wiz wrote:

Trying to lose about 10kg over the next few months and have a question about managing the calorie defecit.

I'm on about 1700 cals/day to hit target, but on a weekend ride I can burn about 4,000 cals in one session. I'll probably get through under 800 cals in energy bars while doing it.

My question is, how should I approach the timing of replacing that defecit? Should I be trying to stock up before, eat more during, or replenish after, and over what period?

My aim at the moment is the weight loss rather than performance, I'm getting some quite good quality sessions during the week and feel pretty strong generally compared to previous years.

For a 4000 kCals ride, Eat about half of this within 24 hours of the start. Make sure 60ish % of this is Carbohydrate. This is called 'Carbo loading'. You will absorb the carbohydrate ready to be used the next day.

A 4000 kCals ride is an opportunity to lose 1/2 lb of fat ( 1800 kcals ). All you need to eat before and during the ride is your normal intake for that day. Breaklfast, mid morning snack and a light lunch that adds up to 700 -800 kcals.

After the ride, get a protein shake within an hour ( 200 kCals ) and then have a protein rich cooked meal when you start to feel hungry. Chicken or fish that adds up to 1000 kCals.

For 4000 kcals, you'll lose about a litre of H2O. A Coke Can sized drink each hour will be OK cus this includes what you need for the day and the ride.
You'll also lose about 1.5g of salt, so put this in the cooked meal later in the day.

Another tip for weight loss. Don't rush round the route. Ride steady and keep thinking of the weight you will lose.

G-Wiz

Apologies again to the OP. I shouldn't have responded.

No problem, if we all had perfect self restraint there'd be no threads about dieting :-)

The nutritionist I saw ( who transformed my training) is hopefully writing a book soon. I'd heartily recommend a consultation with him ( less than 100 quid IIRC) as you get a plan completely tailored to you and your needs. But if you can't stretch to that then hopefully the book won't be long...

http://www.optimumnutrition4sport.com/

Any chance you could share the contact details either here or via PM?
£100 would save about 100g off my bike, I think I can justify that.

Anonymous

Contact details here, http://www.optimumnutrition4sport.com/contact_us_4.html

His name's Barry and he is very enthusiastic about what he does.

Give him a call on the phone and have a chat! (Say hello from me!)

This is what he did for me in 6 weeks -

From this-



To this-

G-Wiz

Thanks, much appreciated.

The top photo isn't dissimilar to where I am now. If I could make half that change I'd be happy with the money spent. I'll let you know how I get on.

Anonymous

It's not just in the weight though, it's energy levels, sleep, general well being

I've been naughty the last couple of months and have crept back up a bit, the difference it makes when you stick to the plan is quite startling.

amaferanga

I've had similar results from following (some of) the advice in the book Racing Weight by Matt Fitzgerald. I'm sure a tailor made plan by a pro is better, but I've been able to lose a bit of weight (4kg - down from 70kg to 66kg ) over the last couple of months without really trying and I'm also finding energy levels, recovery, etc. are good. What's really made the difference for me I think is looking at the quality of the food I eat and cutting out as much processed stuff as possible.